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The Music Forums => Jazz and Blues Cafe => Topic started by: Boddhisattva on May 30, 2006, 08:27:07 AM
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Anything about 80's groups/artists like:
David Sanborn
Tom Scott
SpyroGyra
Sadao Watanabe
Grover Washington
Bob James
Dan Siegel
Lee Ritenour
Chuck Mangione
Earl Klugh
Hey, most of these people are GRP artists!
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They are all very good, but a lot of them fell into the "smooth jazz" trap too smoothly... or as we call them in the Philippines, "Pogi Jazz". Especially Mr. Klugh there....
But I like Pogi Jazz now and then. Of all the Pogi jazz artists I like I have a soft spot for Dave "GRP" Grusin and Lee Ritenour's work together, especially tunes like "Early A.M. attitude". I even have an "Early A.M" midi file in my phone that I use as a ring tone.
I also like Dave Grusin's film soundtracks ("the Fabulous Baker Boys" most especially).
One of the more influential Pogi Jazz artists in the Philippines must've been David Benoit - who I like for his covers of the classic Peanuts jazz tunes by Vince Guraldi. ("Linus and Lucy") . Boy Katindig was something of a Dave Benoit clone at one point I recall.
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One of the more influential Pogi Jazz artists in the Philippines must've been David Benoit - who I like for his covers of the classic Peanuts jazz tunes by Vince Guraldi. ("Linus and Lucy") . Boy Katindig was something of a Dave Benoit clone at one point I recall.
Boy Katindig as David Benoit clone! This is new to me. I kinda miss him and his forays into mini moog territory. I also miss Bong Penera. I can't say the same for Eddie K, though.
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most of the stuff brother wayne played on that jazz fm station
how about Ronnie Laws, Hubert Law, Debra laws...
Bob James and also stuff from CTI records, to counter the GRP artists
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But I like Pogi Jazz now and then. Of all the Pogi jazz artists I like I have a soft spot for Dave "GRP" Grusin and Lee Ritenour's work together, especially tunes like "Early A.M. attitude". I even have an "Early A.M" midi file in my phone that I use as a ring tone.
Uy sir Jazzbo i also happen to like that album!
Also that particular track, he he well dont mind me i listen to almost anything.
But i came to know and like Dave Gruisin and Lee Ritenour because of that album! :D
And who doesnt like to be pogi? he he if only we have a choice :lol:
Pogi fusion anyone? 8)
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Dave Grusin is a great and accomplished musician who can easily switch from jazz, fusion, to soundtrack. "She could be mine" is one of my favorites.
David Benoit is somebody I've been trying to ape since he came out with Stages (pwede kasi isolo). Unfortunately I can't even sipra Stages...
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oh yeah pogi jazz! i'd say one of my most favorite songs is feels so good by chuck mangione. fourplay is great too, at shempre sinong popogi pa sa tugtugan ni david benoit? hehe. and let's not forget spyro gyra, hehe.
i happened to borrow a CD dati, it's the GRP all star big band. artists include shempre si grusin, weckl, ritenour, benoit, etc. etc. astig din eh, they had a big band areglo for corea's spain. pero at that time, kinuha ko lang yung tunes na gusto ko, hehe. so konti lang nakuha ko, if i'd known better i should've ripped the whole set, hehe. it also has blue train, sister sadie, etc. kinda pogi, pero not too candy coated, hehe.
anyone have a copy?
i don't think madaming nagja-jam ng pogi jazz dito, mostly fusion ata eh, hehe. oh well, i still have very limited knowledge on jazz. hope to learn a lot from this forum, hehe.
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i happened to borrow a CD dati, it's the GRP all star big band. artists include shempre si grusin, weckl, ritenour, benoit, etc. etc. astig din eh, they had a big band areglo for corea's spain. pero at that time, kinuha ko lang yung tunes na gusto ko, hehe. so konti lang nakuha ko, if i'd known better i should've ripped the whole set, hehe. it also has blue train, sister sadie, etc. kinda pogi, pero not too candy coated, hehe.
and that was just the studio recording.... later on they had a live tour in japan
and with four trumpets fighting it out on "cherokee", I was able to watch and
tape this from a laser disc copy. grabe big band jazz talaga matindi ang recording. all instruments came out clear.... lalo na sa solohan....
for me the highlight is the golpe de gulat "Manteca" an old latin jazz instrumental from Dizzy Gillespie, plus Gary Burton playing on "Sing,sing,sing"
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You can indulge all you want in all those post-boppish, avant garde, mainstream or fusionistic excesses, but I always 'come back home' to the music I grew up with - the so-called 'soundtrack of my life' .. :)
I'm proud to say that I owe my 'musical education,' or at least its formative period, to most of the artists from this particular genre, including Benson, Ritenour, Carlton, Spyro Gyra and much, much more ..
I've spent lots of countless nights wearing down my old, trusty cassette player (does anyone still use this nowadays?) and of course, my stacks of cassette tapes, in my futile attempts at nailing that elusive guitar solo ..
Looking back, I still think that was one of the best ways to learn. Left with nothing but the music that you hear and your instrument, you don't have any choice but to play it the way you hear and interpret it ..
Nowadays, kids have it all too easy, being spoonfed by dozens of videos and tabs ... :roll:
Just for the curious, did you know how much records were during that time? Way back 1978 or 79, I think a regular long-playing record cost something like twenty bucks ... yes, you read that right! Twenty bucks!
I remember tagging along with my classmate/musical mentor whenever he'd get a little extra from his baon and we'd hie over to Greenhills (was it Uni-Mart) or Cubao to get the latest Chick Corea or Lee Ritenour album.
Of course, we had DWWK 101.9 feeding us smooth jazz 24/7. Thanks to Pinky Aseron and Brother Wayne, of course ...
Man, this is turning out into one long nostalgic trip ... :)
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Lee Rit
Dave Cruisin
Larry Carlton
Grover Washington
Chick Corea
Spyro Gyra
Earl Klugh
...konti lang kilala ko eh. Parang karamihan fusion ata ang players nung panahong ito.
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Back then, of course, I was too young to grasp the dichotomy ..
It was only much later (college) when I realized that there were such 'labels' being ascribed to the music, AND the musicians ..
I remember talking to a friend then who had just bought his first electric bass and was getting 'serious' with his playing ..
"So, what do you listen to and study now?," I asked.
"Oh, well ... Jaco, Alphonso Johnson, Weather Report, Scofield ... you know, the 'heavy' stuff," he replied smugly.
"The heavy stuff?," I repeated, with a puzzled look.. :?
"Yeah, the heavy stuff .. I don't listen to guys like Benson or Carlton, you know ... coz mababaw yung music nila eh ... " 8)
Good thing I was able to restrain myself from bashing him on the head with even 'heavier stuff': his amp .. :D
Thus began my journey to the 'dark side' ... (feigns heavy, mechanical breathing)
(next: Episode 2) :)
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Back then, of course, I was too young to grasp the dichotomy ..
It was only much later (college) when I realized that there were such 'labels' being ascribed to the music, AND the musicians ..
Same as you Deacon, was also reared on that stuff. I usually tag along with my brother to buy Deodato records from Avenida. I also remember Seawind and Angela Bofill before she became mushy with Break it to me Gently.
I still do listen to this genre and I still enjoy it.
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Lucky for us, most of the old 80s jazz stuff have been made available again on the market..
But there's still this one album that I haven't been able to find so far ..
Does anyone remember David Spinozza?
He's also a session guitarist like Carlton and Ritenour, and he released an album during the 80s, with such notable tracks as 'Doesn't She Know By Now,' 'Airborne' and my favorite, 'On My Way To The Liquor Store.'
Man, that last cut rocks! I don't remember exactly who played on that, but I'm sure they were the hot session cats of the time..
And for guitar fans, I think he was using a Tele then with a humbucker pickup on the neck position. I remember that album cover pretty well..
Haven't heard much about the guy lately though .. there's not even enough info when you google ..
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I can relate to all this talk. In fact the majority of the jazz LPs that I have I collected in the 80's. A lot of GRPs, ECMs, a few Mobile Fidelity and Sheffield recordings, some Windham Hill (Michael Hedges, Will Ackerman). Maybe one of these days I can transfer them digitally so I can share them. Right now they are in boxes in my basement :shock: :shock:
And Deodato. Saw him at the CCP with John Tropea on guitar.
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Boy Katindig was something of a Dave Benoit clone at one point I recall.[/quote]
I have personally heard and seen Boy Katindig here in the U.S. performing with Michael Paulo and Pauline Wilson in LA in the 90's and performing just recently with Eric Marienthal at Sculler's, Boston and Norfolk Virginia. This pianist 's style and music, (have his latest) under rates him as another "David Benoit clone". His solos were exceptional and has impressed not only me but the listening audience in all the performances I mentioned. He has truly represented the Philippines well.
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ei...being born in the early 80s i remember my dad playing his tapes of SpyroGyra (or is it spyrogyro)...ala lang.
man, i have to look for those tapes.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but if the 80s was the decade of "smooth jazz" or what you call "pogi jazz", man I'd say mismo iyang mga iyan.
I'm only 27 years old so most of you folks would say I'm too young to appreciate it but man, it was it for me.
I just got tired of listening to my Dream Theater cassette tapes (and yes, low tech pa po ako noon. Don't have the money to buy me CDs when I was in college but it's different now. :D ) so I simply switched the radio on and dialled in to DWBM 105.9 (?). I also found out at that time that Citilite 88.3 was on air and it was Citilite for me until it signed off. (Why oh why...)
Anyway, I don't consider what you call "pogi jazz" as lacking depth. Lest we forget the essence of music is expression. I don't think that they succumbed (?) and became sell outs when they put out those records. If you'd get them to play what you call "serious and straight ahead jazz" I bet they'd kick ass. No, they'd just flick you with their pinky and you'd be out of this universe.
Some of us here (and I think one of them is Deacon Blues) site these artists as their keys to playing music or influences. Without them, where will we be?
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Correct me if I'm wrong but if the 80s was the decade of "smooth jazz" or what you call "pogi jazz", man I'd say mismo iyang mga iyan.
I'm only 27 years old so most of you folks would say I'm too young to appreciate it but man, it was it for me.
I just got tired of listening to my Dream Theater cassette tapes (and yes, low tech pa po ako noon. Don't have the money to buy me CDs when I was in college but it's different now. :D ) so I simply switched the radio on and dialled in to DWBM 105.9 (?). I also found out at that time that Citilite 88.3 was on air and it was Citilite for me until it signed off. (Why oh why...)
Anyway, I don't consider what you call "pogi jazz" as lacking depth. Lest we forget the essence of music is expression. I don't think that they succumbed (?) and became sell outs when they put out those records. If you'd get them to play what you call "serious and straight ahead jazz" I bet they'd kick ass. No, they'd just flick you with their pinky and you'd be out of this universe.
Some of us here (and I think one of them is Deacon Blues) site these artists as their keys to playing music or influences. Without them, where will we be?
I strongly agree with you! Don't judge a book by its cover.
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I think of Smooth Jazz as ... an introduction to the world of jazz, which is just as broad as rock is broad. I also got my start here - easy to listen to, just enough melodic character, just enough improvisational solos. Actually with the limited time to do solos here, it tests the musician's ability to express much in so little time..
Deac, di pa natuloy yung East Louis, Bali Run, Friend & Strangers jam natin.. My sked will ease up in November so maybe we can do it that time..
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Deac, di pa natuloy yung East Louis, Bali Run, Friend & Strangers jam natin.. My sked will ease up in November so maybe we can do it that time..
Wow! Bali Run ng Fourplay? Very few can pull that off smoothly. 8)
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ei.
was reared on that too, except that had a difficult time looking for material dahil laging music bed lang un xa commercials dati.
You can indulge all you want in all those post-boppish, avant garde, mainstream or fusionistic excesses, but I always 'come back home' to the music I grew up with - the so-called 'soundtrack of my life' .. :)
I'm proud to say that I owe my 'musical education,' or at least its formative period, to most of the artists from this particular genre, including Benson, Ritenour, Carlton, Spyro Gyra and much, much more ..
I've spent lots of countless nights wearing down my old, trusty cassette player (does anyone still use this nowadays?) and of course, my stacks of cassette tapes, in my futile attempts at nailing that elusive guitar solo ..
Looking back, I still think that was one of the best ways to learn. Left with nothing but the music that you hear and your instrument, you don't have any choice but to play it the way you hear and interpret it ..
Nowadays, kids have it all too easy, being spoonfed by dozens of videos and tabs ... :roll:
Sir deacon ur right. I'd say during the 80s that type of music was Confluent with the times, and i mr. Rit and Mr. Washingotn and Mr. Mangione weren't really conscious coming up with what is called as "smooth" right now, though. It was the times, (Like, Every album that had that DX7 Patch and even Early Elektrik Band had Weckl using Processed drums).
I do the same, after hours of dabbling with 'the darkside' i'd pop in earl Klugh's DOC. or Alphonse Muozon. or Seawind. or Spyro. Or Bob James. Grusin.
Parang nasa tyangge ulit umiinom nang Mello Yello. 8-)
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Nice to know this thread has been resurrected..
There are two things I love about 80s jazz stuff: melody and groove. That's not to say that you can't find the same in the more exotic, avant-garde excesses of the so-called virtuosos. I love those as well, but nowadays, I find myself getting tired of all that after five minutes.
I remember watching a DVD of Lee Ritenour's "Overtime" concert a few months back at psychic_sushi's place, and man, I couldn't help but renew my respect for the guy. Here's one of the best session guitarists playing like he's never lost his touch - never mind if he doesn't seem to have won the nod of the jazz critics.
Watching Rit, you don't say, "Wow! Hayop yung gitarista!" You say, "Wow! Hayop yung tugtugan nung banda!" and you can see how everyone shines. Patrice Rushen (of 'Forget Me Nots' fame) plays some pretty mean piano lines there as well, and Melvin Davis' tasty and solid bass fills.
As a fan of the genre, I can't help but be thankful for youtube, for letting us get reacquainted with those artists again. So far, I've seen vids of Carlton, Foreplay, Spyro Grya, Yellowjackets (with a very young Robben Ford, no less!), George Benson (before the nose job :-)), Dave Grusin, some old Scofield stuff, Cobham, and a whole lot more..
Wish we could organize a jam soon..
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brand new heavies at incognito 80s din ba yan oh 90s na? favorite ko yung jamestylor quartet ang kulit lalo na yung whole lot of loving
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Uy, gotta love incognito and BNH as well! Yan ang groove!!! I just love Incognito's 'Beneath the Surface' and BNH's 'Midnight at the Oasis'..
I'm not sure, but I think these are 90s groups already, kahel..
Thanks to a female guitarist/friend, I also got to know the James Taylor Quartet - another great funk group. I love their sound as well. It's like being transported to the 70s, with all that wah-wah going on.. I was kinda hesitant to listen to them at first. Akala ko they'd sing 'you gotta prend' .. :-)
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ei.
Sir Deacon, nailed po. Watching OVERTIME makes one say 'Galing nang Banda!'. Lahat marunong pumuwesto - imagine 3 keyboardists (Rushen, Lins, Grusin), wlang sumasapaw? kewl.
Actually majority of 80s materiaL were 'song oriented' (dba ung solos were so singable?) which isn't bad. There's no Comparison with 'darkside' material such as ECM Catalogues, Ornette, David Torn, John Zorn, etc. dahil they're different facets of jazz.
BTW, BNH, JTQ and Incognito are 90s Acid jazz people and + 1,000 to them too. 8-)
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Wow! Jam! Sama ako when I get my act together. :-D Di ko pa kasi na-line up yung repertoire namin nung gitarista e.
James Taylor Quartet? Lupit ng keyboard playing dun! :-D
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check out chris standring< he play's smooth jazz< but his taste or choice of notes is better than contemporary smooth jazz guitarists... :-D
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Wish we could organize a jam soon..
If you're down with a pogi jazz jam I'm in. :) Will you be on bass or guitar this time around?
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Hey jim!
Wish I could answer that.
It really depends on the situation at hand. I WOULD love to play guitar, but if there's no one playing bass and there's a surplus of guitar players, I'd take the low end pa rin..
Frogfunk, are you listening? :-)
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Yep, Deac! Loud and clear! Just give me a list of what to play and I'll work it out from there. :-D Also, I'll be needing mp3s of them songs. :-D
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Hey marco!
How's your sked bro? Easin' up a bit?
It'd be good to get together siguro during the long weekend that hits Dec. 1. If I'm not mistaken, that's a holiday right?
I guess it's just a matter of finding a suitable venue that's accessible for everyone.
Well, offhand, I can think of the ff. songs:
1. Affirmation - George Benson
2. Rio Funk - Lee Ritenour
3. James - Pat Metheny
4. Sunny - Pat Martino
5. Spain - Chick Corea
6. Morning Dance - Spyrogyra
7. Always There - Ronnie Laws (there's a youtube version by Kirk Whalum and friends, with Larry Carlton)
The good thing is all of these are on youtube, so I hope that's a good reference point.
Hope the others can join in as well..
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Awrigt! Pogi jazz rulez!!
Deacn' - I think I know all those songs except my tukayo "James" by Metheny - maybe something more familiar from Pat? "Phase Dance" perhaps?
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Uy, 'Phase Dance!!!'
Yes! Yes! Yes!
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Jim bro, please feel free to suggest any other songs that you'd like to do.
Ditto for the other guys as well..
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i've always wanted to play "colibri" by incognito... ambitious ba?
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Hey nonoy!
My God! Nabuhay ang mga pogi jazzers ... How's your band bro?
Hmmm ... I haven't heard that tune yet. I'm afraid I'm not too familiar with too many Incognito songs. My favorite still remains: 'Beneath The Surface' .. :-)
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The Incognito tunes that come to mind are mainly vocals - "Still a friend of mine" (killer harmonies) and their cover of Stevie Wonder's "Don't You Worry Bout a Thing" ... but Incognito isn't pogi jazz - since they came to fore in the 90's as part of the Acid Jazz thing.
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OK na rin yun, Jim!!
Or do we have to be strictly 80s?
Jim, do you remember a song called 'On My Way To The Liquor Store' by David Spinozza? The same guy who came up with the more popular 'Doesn't She Know By Now' with acoustic nylon and vocals.
Grabe, sarap ng drums dun sa 'On My Way' .. sarap sana i-jam nun ..
Also, Gino Vanelli's 'Brother to Brother' ...
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ahh oo nga 'no! sorry i just got carried away...
colibri was also in the "tribes, vibes, scribes" album along with dontcha worry. its a slick instrumental solo, and give me 6 months and i can nail the rhodes solo! he he
hhmmm today is the 24th, and dec1 is next week.... how to find a suitable venue with instruments and a drum set for TAFKAPM? think quick..
while typing this post, deac suggests "brother to brother" now i would like to hear that telenova jazz/fusion piece...
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Also, Gino Vanelli's 'Brother to Brother' ...
Yoohoo, B2B! Dream piece ko yan. Subok naman yan with my band, di kaya sobrang hirap ng mga individual parts..
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ahh oo nga 'no! sorry i just got carried away...
colibri was also in the "tribes, vibes, scribes" album along with dontcha worry. its a slick instrumental solo, and give me 6 months and i can nail the rhodes solo! he he
hhmmm today is the 24th, and dec1 is next week.... how to find a suitable venue with instruments and a drum set for TAFKAPM? think quick..
while typing this post, deac suggests "brother to brother" now i would like to hear that telenova jazz/fusion piece...
Ummmh, i listen to colibri.. sige try ko sipra. Lets go jam basta wag the dec 13-16...
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OK na rin yun, Jim!!
Or do we have to be strictly 80s?
Jim, do you remember a song called 'On My Way To The Liquor Store' by David Spinozza? The same guy who came up with the more popular 'Doesn't She Know By Now' with acoustic nylon and vocals.
Grabe, sarap ng drums dun sa 'On My Way' .. sarap sana i-jam nun ..
Also, Gino Vanelli's 'Brother to Brother' ...
I remember the title, not the tune though - can you send me an mp3 to jog my memory? email add sent via PM.
(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B00004TZ61.01._AA240_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg)
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Hey there, Deac! Hindi ko pa yata masisipra yung mga kanta agad but I'd like to know if the meet on December 1 or 2 will just be a meet up or a jam meet. Thanks, man. :-D
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Marco,
If ever we do push through on Dec. 1, don't worry about learning all of that. It's definitely going to be a jam. Just jump right in and play when you want to..
PM you the details soon
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Woah! Gives me the jitters! :-o Baka manood lang ako. :-D
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Hey marco!
How's your sked bro? Easin' up a bit?
It'd be good to get together siguro during the long weekend that hits Dec. 1. If I'm not mistaken, that's a holiday right?
I guess it's just a matter of finding a suitable venue that's accessible for everyone.
Well, offhand, I can think of the ff. songs:
1. Affirmation - George Benson
2. Rio Funk - Lee Ritenour
3. James - Pat Metheny
4. Sunny - Pat Martino
5. Spain - Chick Corea
6. Morning Dance - Spyrogyra
7. Always There - Ronnie Laws (there's a youtube version by Kirk Whalum and friends, with Larry Carlton)
The good thing is all of these are on youtube, so I hope that's a good reference point.
Hope the others can join in as well..
hey,how 'bout something from these guys...
rippingtons
special efx
ang ginaw ng tugtugan nila. :-D
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Hey kawayan!
Sure, if anybody has the lead sheets or a CD of it, why not? Anything goes..
Btw, I heard your second electric clip in the soundclips thread. Amazing bro! Studio quality as always.. Did you use a harmonizer somewhere there?
It'd be cool to have you in the jam sana, if you're in Manila. Like maybe nail those Pat Martino songs from 'Joyous Lake' ... Mardi Gras ... :-)
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Hey kawayan!
Sure, if anybody has the lead sheets or a CD of it, why not? Anything goes..
Btw, I heard your second electric clip in the soundclips thread. Amazing bro! Studio quality as always.. Did you use a harmonizer somewhere there?
It'd be cool to have you in the jam sana, if you're in Manila. Like maybe nail those Pat Martino songs from 'Joyous Lake' ... Mardi Gras ... :-)
thanks man.over dub yun.direct yung gtr from a gt6.
sayang nga,i was there 3wks ago but to send my wife off.
di nga ako naka attend ng EB nor buy stuffs for guitar. :-(
anyways,marami pa namang time in the future. 8-)
sa ngayon hirap ako sa Captain Fingers. :cry: pero ok lang. ear workout talaga. :wink:
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Hope so too bro.
Damn, 'Captain Fingers' is indeed a toughie! Especially those unison parts
Nice tones from a GT-6..
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Hope so too bro.
Damn, 'Captain Fingers' is indeed a toughie! Especially those unison parts
Nice tones from a GT-6..
talaga!esp the chords.......aaaarrrrrrgggghhhh!dikit dikit. :-(
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Break a leg on your jam session guys.
I hope you could do it in a venue where we can watch you guys play.
Don't worry about Captain Fingers. L.R. himself admitted that they had quite a number of takes on that middle part (where they played unison). What we hear on record is actually the version where the drummer finally nailed the parts. But the keys, the guitar and the bass still had a lot of curing to do. So there, mas magaling talaga ang Pinoy -- sinisipra talaga ang lahat.
Wish I could watch you guys. Wouldn't even dream of playing some of the songs in your line-up. Kung pwede balitaan niyo naman ako.
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Tindi ng jam daw nila! Di lang jazz nag-classic rock pa! :-D
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Break a leg on your jam session guys.
I hope you could do it in a venue where we can watch you guys play.
Don't worry about Captain Fingers. L.R. himself admitted that they had quite a number of takes on that middle part (where they played unison). What we hear on record is actually the version where the drummer finally nailed the parts. But the keys, the guitar and the bass still had a lot of curing to do. So there, mas magaling talaga ang Pinoy -- sinisipra talaga ang lahat.
Wish I could watch you guys. Wouldn't even dream of playing some of the songs in your line-up. Kung pwede balitaan niyo naman ako.
nasa unison part nako before mag solo(capt.fingers).whew!just taking it slow,hirap din nun.
pati yun chords.sira talaga 'tong si RIT! :mrgreen:
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Tindi ng jam daw nila! Di lang jazz nag-classic rock pa! :-D
He he ... Anton was reared from a solid Deep Purple background.
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Sana makasama ako sa susunod. :-D