TALK @ PhilMusic.com - The Online Home of the Pinoy Musician
The Musician Forums => Guitar Central => Topic started by: Screamous on June 08, 2017, 10:27:43 AM
Title: HIYAW
Post by: Screamous on June 08, 2017, 10:27:43 AM
I'm not sure if meron nang thread regarding this, with the recent discussions from every thread na nai-involve ang hiyaw, at laging nababanggit, so why not start a thread nlang about it.,
just a short conversation with CJV (no trolling intended)
nasabi nya na Sya(CJV), Si FM55 and Matt De Leon have the same definition and thought pagdating sa "hiyaw"
what is it exactly? is it only for those who looks for it? possible ba na magka hiyaw ang Low-End at Mid-End Guitars? (or dpat i-assume ko na nsa 98% na sila) possible din ba na ma-distinguish ang hiyaw thru HD recording (video record, hnd yung nka mix na hehe) is it defined by every guitarist's personal definition?
nag-tanong ako sa isang thread before na di ko na matandaan yung topic
"ano sa english ang hiyaw?" somebody told me "tonal bloom"
sa bawat forum mate, thread and discussions na nabasa ko about "hiyaw" na entice ako and it triggered my curiosity, i hope di ako mag fail.
i hope we can all help one another.
for the benefit of every guitarist who's in search of it, let's keep this thread as peaceful as possible,
so here goes, nag google ako about tonal bloom, at eto ang bumungad..
http://www.esomogyi.com/tonal_bloom.pdf
your thoughts mga master??
P.S.
baka may makulitan sakin about the topic since it's been a discussion for ages for most people sa PhilMusic, siguro this thread will be para sa mga katulad ko na walang idea pa about it or wla pang idea about it.
Thank You po
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 08, 2017, 10:29:46 AM
Mas maganda yung BULYAW bro.. Hiyaw on another level :-D
"Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness Hiyaw"
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: marzi on June 08, 2017, 10:31:34 AM
yung 98% ay mga hupaw.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: red lights on June 08, 2017, 10:34:26 AM
kung ano ang magpapasaya at magpapakuntento sayo, doon ka. kapag naghangad ka ng higit pa sa gusto mo, babalik ka sa umpisa
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: skrumian on June 08, 2017, 10:51:06 AM
kung ano ang magpapasaya at magpapakuntento sayo, doon ka. kapag naghangad ka ng higit pa sa gusto mo, babalik ka sa umpisa
may punto ka sir, gsto ko lang din maintindhan yung discussion patungkol doon, just like sa kabilang thread, di nya alam na may hiyaw pla gitara nya hehe, bka kasi mka chamba ako na meron din pla yung mga ibanez ko hehe, kung wla, err.. yun edi wala, tingin ko hindi din nman kbawasan satin kung meron o walang hiyaw yung mga gitara ntn hehe.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Screamous on June 08, 2017, 11:01:04 AM
I'm not sure if meron nang thread regarding this, with the recent discussions from every thread na nai-involve ang hiyaw, at laging nababanggit, so why not start a thread nlang about it.,
just a short conversation with CJV (no trolling intended)
nasabi nya na Sya(CJV), Si FM55 and Matt De Leon have the same definition and thought pagdating sa "hiyaw"
what is it exactly? is it only for those who looks for it? possible ba na magka hiyaw ang Low-End at Mid-End Guitars? (or dpat i-assume ko na nsa 98% na sila) possible din ba na ma-distinguish ang hiyaw thru HD recording (video record, hnd yung nka mix na hehe) is it defined by every guitarist's personal definition?
nag-tanong ako sa isang thread before na di ko na matandaan yung topic
"ano sa english ang hiyaw?" somebody told me "tonal bloom"
sa bawat forum mate, thread and discussions na nabasa ko about "hiyaw" na entice ako and it triggered my curiosity, i hope di ako mag fail.
i hope we can all help one another.
for the benefit of every guitarist who's in search of it, let's keep this thread as peaceful as possible,
so here goes, nag google ako about tonal bloom, at eto ang bumungad..
http://www.esomogyi.com/tonal_bloom.pdf
your thoughts mga master??
P.S.
baka may makulitan sakin about the topic since it's been a discussion for ages for most people sa PhilMusic, siguro this thread will be para sa mga katulad ko na walang idea pa about it or wla pang idea about it.
Thank You po
screamous,
if sincere ka sa search mo, PM mo si Firemodel.
parang Ferrari din yan. if you want to know what a Ferrari is and how it performs, magtanong ka sa may ari. hanap ka ng mapagtetest drive. and mag test drive ka ng marami
it pays to know an owner who has numerous ferarris.
in other words, you do your own research. i base mo sa experience mo at hindi sa mga hear say or mga naka try lang ng sandali.
reach out din sa mga collector ng mga high end. baka swertehin ka, maka play ka.
kung nasa ibang bansa ka at nakaka gala ka. try visiting vintage guitar stores, pawnshops. tugtugin mo yung mga luma at mahal doon, pati na rin mga intermediate price.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Screamous on June 08, 2017, 05:18:27 PM
parang Ferrari din yan. if you want to know what a Ferrari is and how it performs, magtanong ka sa may ari. hanap ka ng mapagtetest drive. and mag test drive ka ng marami
it pays to know an owner who has numerous ferarris.
in other words, you do your own research. i base mo sa experience mo at hindi sa mga hear say or mga naka try lang ng sandali.
reach out din sa mga collector ng mga high end. baka swertehin ka, maka play ka.
kung nasa ibang bansa ka at nakaka gala ka. try visiting vintage guitar stores, pawnshops. tugtugin mo yung mga luma at mahal doon, pati na rin mga intermediate price.
Sir Analog.Matt,
to be honest, hanggang tanong tanong lang muna ako, until magkaroon na ko ng vacation sa pilipinas, nsa base kasi ako, as in remote island wherein limited ang lahat, meron lang dito grocery store and food diners, kaya sa case ko, yung mga gamit ko is na-test ko lang sila after orderin, haha buti nlng it all worked out for me, although may mga nasyang (na sidetrack na). ino-order ko lang sila sa musiciansfriend at amazon, recently lang din ako naging active sa philmusic and yun na curious ako sa hiyaw dahil lagi kong nbabasa sa iba ibang thread dito sa PM e, hehe.
yung pagiging gitarista ko is hobby lang din, pag trip na jam yun na yun, wla kaming technical or any specific knowledge pagdating sa mga mlalalim na bagay sa about sa gitara. hehe,
so yun, hopefully mka try soon hehe.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: analog.matt on June 08, 2017, 06:35:50 PM
to be honest, hanggang tanong tanong lang muna ako, until magkaroon na ko ng vacation sa pilipinas, nsa base kasi ako, as in remote island wherein limited ang lahat, meron lang dito grocery store and food diners, kaya sa case ko, yung mga gamit ko is na-test ko lang sila after orderin, haha buti nlng it all worked out for me, although may mga nasyang (na sidetrack na). ino-order ko lang sila sa musiciansfriend at amazon, recently lang din ako naging active sa philmusic and yun na curious ako sa hiyaw dahil lagi kong nbabasa sa iba ibang thread dito sa PM e, hehe.
yung pagiging gitarista ko is hobby lang din, pag trip na jam yun na yun, wla kaming technical or any specific knowledge pagdating sa mga mlalalim na bagay sa about sa gitara. hehe,
so yun, hopefully mka try soon hehe.
sa lagay mo nga naman, base and all talagang mahihirapan ka, hintay hintay lang. maski ako, foreign based, it took me a while to meet the people i needed to meet and help me with my quest.
wala naman masama kung hobby lang. mahalaga masaya ka and yung kasiyahan natin, hindi nag iinterfere sa iba. nagkakalabuan lang naman pag absolute terms ang isang tao sa paniniwala niya.
mahalaga makita mo yung buong range ng tones. then ikaw na bahala kung saan mag tow ng line. at least na optimize mo ang options mo.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: dullFingers on June 08, 2017, 07:42:42 PM
Naalala ko yung nag tanong dati....
Is an original guitar matters than local???
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: bgarcia on June 08, 2017, 08:08:07 PM
Kung gusto nyo matuto ng hiyaw, pumunta kayo kay Arie at magpaturo sa kanya. Sya ang nag-imbento ng konsepto ng hiyaw dito sa Pilipinas. Go straight to the source para hindi na nanghuhula.
Ang problema lang, iba rin ang tenga at utak natin kay Arie so kahit sya mismo ang magturo, hindi natin maproprocess ang tunog ng eksakto kung paano iprocess ng utak at tenga ni Arie. So akala mo alam mo na ang hiyaw (as per Arie's definition), hindi parin pala. Hehe.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: queer_rocker on June 08, 2017, 08:22:36 PM
Kung gusto nyo matuto ng hiyaw, pumunta kayo kay Arie at magpaturo sa kanya. Sya ang nag-imbento ng konsepto ng hiyaw dito sa Pilipinas. Go straight to the source para hindi na nanghuhula.
Ang problema lang, iba rin ang tenga at utak natin kay Arie so kahit sya mismo ang magturo, hindi natin maproprocess ang tunog ng eksakto kung paano iprocess ng utak at tenga ni Arie. So akala mo alam mo na ang hiyaw (as per Arie's definition), hindi parin pala. Hehe.
sino yun?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: rowley75 on June 08, 2017, 08:46:06 PM
Imo, cjv and matt de leon's definition of hiyaw is completely different from fm55. Lalo na yung process of achieving it.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: skrumian on June 08, 2017, 09:09:21 PM
Kung gusto nyo matuto ng hiyaw, pumunta kayo kay Arie at magpaturo sa kanya. Sya ang nag-imbento ng konsepto ng hiyaw dito sa Pilipinas. Go straight to the source para hindi na nanghuhula.
Ang problema lang, iba rin ang tenga at utak natin kay Arie so kahit sya mismo ang magturo, hindi natin maproprocess ang tunog ng eksakto kung paano iprocess ng utak at tenga ni Arie. So akala mo alam mo na ang hiyaw (as per Arie's definition), hindi parin pala. Hehe.
I'm not sure if meron nang thread regarding this, with the recent discussions from every thread na nai-involve ang hiyaw, at laging nababanggit, so why not start a thread nlang about it.,
just a short conversation with CJV (no trolling intended)
nasabi nya na Sya(CJV), Si FM55 and Matt De Leon have the same definition and thought pagdating sa "hiyaw"
what is it exactly? is it only for those who looks for it? possible ba na magka hiyaw ang Low-End at Mid-End Guitars? (or dpat i-assume ko na nsa 98% na sila) possible din ba na ma-distinguish ang hiyaw thru HD recording (video record, hnd yung nka mix na hehe) is it defined by every guitarist's personal definition?
nag-tanong ako sa isang thread before na di ko na matandaan yung topic
"ano sa english ang hiyaw?" somebody told me "tonal bloom"
sa bawat forum mate, thread and discussions na nabasa ko about "hiyaw" na entice ako and it triggered my curiosity, i hope di ako mag fail.
i hope we can all help one another.
for the benefit of every guitarist who's in search of it, let's keep this thread as peaceful as possible,
so here goes, nag google ako about tonal bloom, at eto ang bumungad..
http://www.esomogyi.com/tonal_bloom.pdf
your thoughts mga master??
P.S.
baka may makulitan sakin about the topic since it's been a discussion for ages for most people sa PhilMusic, siguro this thread will be para sa mga katulad ko na walang idea pa about it or wla pang idea about it.
Thank You po
nakakatawa naman na si panot ang kinausap mo about "hiyaw" eh ang sabi nya tone is in our fingers. 😂😂😂😂
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: analog.matt on June 09, 2017, 08:20:42 AM
Imo, cjv and matt de leon's definition of hiyaw is completely different from fm55. Lalo na yung process of achieving it.
Hi Rowley,
if im not mistaken, i have not publicly defined Hiyaw. at best i had given different facets but never a complete definition.
remember all of these overtones are abstract. so minsan may kanya kanyang tayong tawag.
but for me to understand alex and arie's concept of Hiyaw, i had to do the following over the past few years
1. visit vintage and semi vintage stores. 2. visit pawn shops and second hand music stores 3. ordinary music stores 4. PM certain people including local Gas Gods 5. visit people 6. visit arie and alex
take for instance the vintage guitar shop near my home. there was one point where they had 20 plus 70s Fender Stratocasters, 20 plus 80 Stratocasters, 20 plus 90s Custom shops 10 plus mid to late 60s fenders 10 plus early 70s Gibson les pauls 1980s gibsons early 1900s na acoustic guitars
(yung mga 90s hindi ko na pinakialaman)
blessing din talaga na okay lang sa music store na hawakan ko lahat at tumambay ng oras at bumalik multiple times. walang masungit na salesman. pero kilala ko naman yung may ari and kadalasan sya ang tumatao. so lahat yun sinubukan ko. napagpalit palit ko (A/B), to see the differences. yung era pa lang ng wood kakaiba na. the closer i get to the the 1950s, the woodier the tone. take note, iisang store pa lang to. i had to visit many shops. (and honestly sa lahat ng mga yun kakaiba yung mga gitara ni alex)
for early 60s and late 50s fenders, i had to visit people. for other 1950s guitars, not fender or gibson, sa stores ako dumalaw.
hindi naman bubuka ang tenga ng tao agad agad. it takes time. so it also means hindi porket nadalaw mo na once si FM55, garantisado yun na, 100%, ang narinig mo.
ako it took me a while din to understand and hear.
so the point here is, kumbaga sa trabaho, ano ang broadness ng iyong personal experience? unfortunately not many in this forums have such experience.
ako, bakit ako nag sipag mag store hopping, tumambay sa stores etc... kasi its an opportunity for me. parang swot analysis. ang pisi ko hindi tulad ng mga Gas Gods dito sa Philmu. so imbes na magreklamo ako at maging bitter, naghanap ako ng paraan. so nag music stores ako, dumalaw ako sa mga tao (im forever thankful sa inyo. if you're reading this), tsaka nag consulta din ako sa mga old musicians na walang panahon mag facebook at internet. sila mga nakahawak ng mga vintage guitars both popular and unpopular brands. in the process ive met collectors din and builders
the more i build myself...the more i understood....the more i see the lies sa marketing...the more i understood the oldies....and syemnpre...when i meet Alex and Arie, naiintindihan ko na din sila...kasi i built my experience
sincere ako sa aking personal search noon kaya mas pinili kong gumalaw. at tuwing mag tatanong ako, laging empty ang cup and may, "sige subukan ko nga"
i have not heard all that's good out there, sobrang dami, but sinasabi ko lang, yung exposure na pinaghirapan kong kunin, made me understand what alex has been trying to say for many many years
if you're serious about tone, gagalaw din kayo imbes na tumambay sa forums.
****
as for CVJ, i cant speak for the journey he had taken to arrive at where he currently is....you will have to ask him
as for alex and arie, nakwento naman nila yung journey nila....
and para sa akin parehong important ang skill and gear. music man, baril, martial arts, sciences....parehong important sila.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Screamous on June 09, 2017, 09:28:27 AM
nakakatawa naman na si panot ang kinausap mo about "hiyaw" eh ang sabi nya tone is in our fingers. 😂😂😂😂
bka nagbago na pananaw hehe, "kahit ano tlgang pots o pup nsa wood mismo yung ringing sound o hiyaw nya"
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: dullFingers on June 09, 2017, 10:43:06 AM
@analog.Matt -
I would like to commend you on the way you reply to "sensitive" topics in this forum. Kung ganyan siguro ang delivery ni FM55 dito sa Philmusic mas maiintindihan siya ng mga members dito. As pointed out by another member, yung pakikipag kapwa is also important dito sa forums. I do not know Alex/FM55 personally. Who knows ganyan lang talaga siya mag sulat pero iba siya sa personal. I sure would love to test his gear one day just to see if I can somehow relate to what he is saying.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: analog.matt on June 09, 2017, 11:06:06 AM
salamat
I think nauuna lang kasi ang emotion ng tao. kaya nabibigyan ng kulay ang mga sinusulat ni alex or minsan, dala na ng emotion, hindi na nababasa ng mabuti yung sinulat ni alex.
pero tingnan niyo mga sulat ni alex, kahit gaanong ka heated ang usapan hindi siya nagreresort to name calling or ad hominem attacks.
alex in the flesh is a very very kind person. isipin niyo ilang tao na naka test ng gears niya. sa pag kakaintindi ko gusto niya kasi maianngat ang consciousness natin. yung experience niya sa ibang bansa binibigay niya sa atin. malaking laktaw na sa learning curve yun
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: marzi on June 09, 2017, 11:31:22 AM
nakakatawa naman na si panot ang kinausap mo about "hiyaw" eh ang sabi nya tone is in our fingers. 😂😂😂😂
Self-contradicting talaga si CJV
Pero sikat yan! Ayon nga lang sa kanya ^-^
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: joesat on June 10, 2017, 11:57:39 AM
If that hiyaw is hard to come by in a guitar or we are not blessed nor talented to hear it, then i'll settle for MIYAW. stress free, worry free, easy....why search for a holy grail of a guitar when you can spend your time on making music or practice? :wink:
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 10, 2017, 12:58:49 PM
If that hiyaw is hard to come by in a guitar or we are not blessed nor talented to hear it, then i'll settle for MIYAW. stress free, worry free, easy....why search for a holy grail of a guitar when you can spend your time on making music or practice? :wink:
Parang sinabi mo na bakit kailangan pang mamili ng gitara? Following your point and taking it to the extreme, we should ALL just pick Lumanog guitars and have the time of our life.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: pallas on June 10, 2017, 01:38:47 PM
I say never go too high nor go lowest of the low. I have a 9 year old son now and the things I'm slowly showing him are players and practice and how to teach yourself the songs you like to play. Sure I explain to him strats, singlecoils, humbuckers, les pauls who plays what.
We don't go to where this thread is at.
Oh and I found this Squier VM Jaguar at a yard sale......just under P2000. It sounds AMAZING!!
One of the major benefits of not being a tone snob.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Al_Librero on June 10, 2017, 01:56:08 PM
Just checking in to express my amazement over how this is still a thing after all these years... Seriously, I'm not trying to be dismissive or insensitive to anyone's grievances. I just am.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 10, 2017, 01:56:25 PM
I say never go too high nor go lowest of the low. I have a 9 year old son now and the things I'm slowly showing him are players and practice and how to teach yourself the songs you like to play. Sure I explain to him strats, singlecoils, humbuckers, les pauls who plays what.
We don't go to where this thread is at.
Oh and I found this Squier VM Jaguar at a yard sale......just under P2000. It sounds AMAZING!!
One of the major benefits of not being a tone snob.
Lucky for you. Imagine the trouble I have to go thru trying to help people and their below P2000 guitar sound good. Root Cause: They were not tone snobs enough.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 10, 2017, 01:58:39 PM
Just checking in to express my amazement over how this is still a thing after all these years... Seriously, I'm not trying to be dismissive or insensitive to anyone's grievances. I just am.
Yeah because I now have 20 USA guitars plus 1 Israeli guitar with hiyaw and there are still tons of people who doubt it exists which means their hearing ain't gettin' any better.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Al_Librero on June 10, 2017, 02:02:54 PM
Neither are your manners. C'mon man... move on.
What's that quote I got last year from somewhere.... with great enlightenment comes great arrogance.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 10, 2017, 02:07:11 PM
What's that quote I got last year from somewhere.... with great enlightenment comes great arrogance.
Yeah. I've been movin on yet there seems to be more suckers born every minute to bad sounding guitars. So, I am just trying to help out. I need a bit of arrogance to get thru the crab mentality of Pinoys.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Al_Librero on June 10, 2017, 02:49:00 PM
That doesn't make any sense to me. But I'll leave you to it.
I would like to take a shot at the questions from Screamous's original post:
what is it exactly? -- Matt's right, ask FM55 directly. Afterwards, you can believe him or think he's full of crap -- that is your choice. Or you can just ignore what he thinks, forget about this hiyaw thing, move on and do your own thing, like me. :-D
is it only for those who looks for it? -- From what I've observed, for the most part, I do believe so. Personally, I don't care about it. At the end of the day, I can sleep soundly at night knowing I'm happy enough with whatever sound I am able to come up with through the gear I have in hand.
possible ba na magka hiyaw ang Low-End at Mid-End Guitars? (or dpat i-assume ko na nsa 98% na sila) -- Possible. Just not as likely. This is not just about hiyaw, however you want to define it, but overall build quality. But again, the key term is likelihood. There are too many exceptions to use the term absolute. But el cheapos really do tend to be crapshoots when chasing tone.
possible din ba na ma-distinguish ang hiyaw thru HD recording (video record, hnd yung nka mix na hehe) -- Yes, but it will always leave room for doubt, especially when what matters is the sound coming out of the live speaker cabinet reaching your ears. Anything that comes between those two objects becomes reason enough for tone snobs and purists to doubt the authenticity of the sound. It's one of the reasons why this debate is still alive.
is it defined by every guitarist's personal definition? -- LOL... if that's the case, then there will be no end to this discussion.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: juwanfidle09 on June 10, 2017, 02:50:59 PM
In a music production perspective, does hiyaw really matter? Sa tone-shaping or post processing (amp micing, reamping and blah blah) in general. Kailangan ba nun? Kung oo, does it make local and foreign producers or mixers tone deaf?
Curious lang ako, parang di pa kasi napaguusapan yung aspect na yun. :)
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 10, 2017, 03:17:17 PM
That doesn't make any sense to me. But I'll leave you to it.
I would like to take a shot at the questions from Screamous's original post:
what is it exactly? -- Matt's right, ask FM55 directly. Afterwards, you can believe him or think he's full of crap -- that is your choice. Or you can just ignore what he thinks, forget about this hiyaw thing, move on and do your own thing, like me. :-D
is it only for those who looks for it? -- From what I've observed, for the most part, I do believe so. Personally, I don't care about it. At the end of the day, I can sleep soundly at night knowing I'm happy enough with whatever sound I am able to come up with through the gear I have in hand.
possible ba na magka hiyaw ang Low-End at Mid-End Guitars? (or dpat i-assume ko na nsa 98% na sila) -- Possible. Just not as likely. This is not just about hiyaw, however you want to define it, but overall build quality. But again, the key term is likelihood. There are too many exceptions to use the term absolute. But el cheapos really do tend to be crapshoots when chasing tone.
possible din ba na ma-distinguish ang hiyaw thru HD recording (video record, hnd yung nka mix na hehe) -- Yes, but it will always leave room for doubt, especially when what matters is the sound coming out of the live speaker cabinet reaching your ears. Anything that comes between those two objects becomes reason enough for tone snobs and purists to doubt the authenticity of the sound. It's one of the reasons why this debate is still alive.
is it defined by every guitarist's personal definition? -- LOL... if that's the case, then there will be no end to this discussion.
I am NOT full of crap.
So its now OK for me to say that my guitar is better than yours if you don't look for hiyaw? Since you don't care about it, its logically for me to claim it.
On your third point, I agree with you.
Its the hiyaw standard that defines the guitar and you recognizing it as a DIPSTICK to determine whether a guitar has the other traits that make it great. So for nth time, its not ONLY hiyaw per se but in addition to the other properties of a great guitar.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 10, 2017, 03:20:42 PM
In a music production perspective, does hiyaw really matter? Sa tone-shaping or post processing (amp micing, reamping and blah blah) in general. Kailangan ba nun? Kung oo, does it make local and foreign producers or mixers tone deaf?
Curious lang ako, parang di pa kasi napaguusapan yung aspect na yun. :)
Its more for the ease of expression of the guitarist -- SO ASIDE FROM HEARING IT; ITS ABOUT FEELING IT. However, as I pointed out in earlier posts, there are traits that hiyaw point to that indicate a great sounding guitar in terms of timbre. In addition, a guitar with hiyaw, makes it easier for the player's TONE IS IN THE FINGERS to come out.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: analog.matt on June 10, 2017, 03:45:26 PM
I personally think, this issue of Hiyaw has improved.
nag mumukha lang na hindi nag iimprove kasi iisa lang ang constant na visible --detractors.
pero pansinin niyo, marami nang tumahimik
marami na din ako nakakausap privately saying "oh i now get it, i wish i can visit alex..."
and I for one have benefited greatly from FM55. I dont have Baker, Yaron, high end Suhrs or a pre mass production PRS.... Others went for such big names after they learned of them from Alex....pero ako hindi eh..yun na lang eh.... i could have easily gone for them but the difference is, i dont have a budget as big as theirs. wala din akong budget para hanapin yung best combination ng hardware and pickups...
pero happy ako sa journey ko. and i know the guitars i've picked up are good --one way to say na magana gitara mo is if you bring it to a shop and random people get to play/hear it...you get oohs and ahhs and even cash offers sakaling pakawalan mo sa price na offer nila...eh wala pa yan sa level ng guitars ni alex ha.
so yung mga naishare sa akin na kaalaman ginamit ko. shinare ko din sa mga kaibigan ko. and nagbenefit din sila. many of them were skeptical din at first (many years ago), and were piqued nga when they learned noon na i'd be visiting FM55...nag improve din ang paghahanap nila ng gitara
when i visited one shop in Japan that FM55 frequents...gulat ako they all bowed to me when they learned na kaibigan ko siya...this just shows the other side of the coin....na maraming natuto kay Sir Alex...
yan ang mahirap kasi dito sa forums....detractors na lang ang nakikita ng tao....
pero ang takbo ng buhay nasa inyo yan...
if you think na your behringer sounds better than a real plexi or triple rectifier... e di sige dun ka masaya...
...or if you believe your squire sounds better than all the fender custom shops...then sige, i'll leave you at that...
hindi ako pedantic or nanduduro...i have no time for that. there so much to learn and enjoy eh..
but if you have a desire to improve your tone...think positively. keep your cup empty. base your actions from actual results not forum arguments :-D
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Al_Librero on June 10, 2017, 03:52:34 PM
So its now OK for me to say that my guitar is better than yours if you don't look for hiyaw? Since you don't care about it, its logically for me to claim it.
You can say anything you want. I neither need nor want your approval in order for me to be validated. But claiming you're being logical, especially in this case, is pushing it. :lol:
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 10, 2017, 04:10:16 PM
You can say anything you want. I neither need nor want your approval in order for me to be validated. (Yeah and am saying some opinions are better than others.)
But claiming you're being logical, especially in this case, is pushing it. :lol: (I thought you didn't care. Why does pushing it become an issue? :) )
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Sugar Ray Vaughan on June 10, 2017, 04:32:55 PM
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Al_Librero on June 10, 2017, 05:52:56 PM
Hehe. Buhay pa pala yang video na yan...
Quote
(I thought you didn't care. Why does pushing it become an issue? :) )
I only pointed it out, Alex. You can keep going with what passes of as logic for you, if you like. It doesn't matter to me. Sige na, mas maganda na lahat ng gitara mo. Hehe.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: knet370 on June 10, 2017, 06:21:33 PM
Its more for the ease of expression of the guitarist -- SO ASIDE FROM HEARING IT; ITS ABOUT FEELING IT. However, as I pointed out in earlier posts, there are traits that hiyaw point to that indicate a great sounding guitar in terms of timbre. In addition, a guitar with hiyaw, makes it easier for the player's TONE IS IN THE FINGERS to come out.
Ah... medyo limited lang pala yung demographic. BTW, no tone in the fingers vs tone is in the gear yung tinatanong ko. Corny na kasi nun e haha! Tanggapin nalang natin na we have to agree to disagree :lol:
Curious lang ako kung ano yung lawak at limitations din nung "hiyaw". If helpful kasi sa mga audio engineer yun, maraming magbebenefit kahit papaano. hehe
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 11, 2017, 01:36:12 AM
Sir may mga spot na masyadong malakas ang hiyaw kelangan mo yata bumili ng Boss HS-2 HIYAW SUPPRESSOR. :lol:
This deserves a Grammy.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 11, 2017, 01:41:04 AM
Seriously guys, I think I finally understand what's really going on here. OAS spent almost 3 million pesos on his hiyaw guitars and that is exactly the reason why hiyaw NEEDS TO EXIST. Why? Because if hiyaw doesn't exist....... :-o
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: kawayan_strat on June 11, 2017, 03:05:41 AM
Walang hiyang hiyaw yan oh.....it has been 10 years since nung hiyaw controversy. check nalang my youtube vid abot hiyaw. hahahahaha
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: skrumian on June 11, 2017, 06:44:08 AM
Serious question: May hiyaw ba ang bass guitar? Drums? Piano?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 11, 2017, 07:24:39 AM
Seriously guys, I think I finally understand what's really going on here. OAS spent almost 3 million pesos on his hiyaw guitars and that is exactly the reason why hiyaw NEEDS TO EXIST. Why? Because if hiyaw doesn't exist....... :-o
Huh? Your error in assumption is: I have the money therefore hiyaw exists to justify the money spent.
But in reality: Hiyaw exists and I was lucky enough to have the money and lucky to be at the right place and the right time to buy a guitar with hiyaw.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 11, 2017, 07:25:55 AM
Ah... medyo limited lang pala yung demographic. BTW, no tone in the fingers vs tone is in the gear yung tinatanong ko. Corny na kasi nun e haha! Tanggapin nalang natin na we have to agree to disagree :lol:
Curious lang ako kung ano yung lawak at limitations din nung "hiyaw". If helpful kasi sa mga audio engineer yun, maraming magbebenefit kahit papaano. hehe
Well... Just come over and hear and feel it.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 11, 2017, 09:23:15 AM
Not sure how someone can FEEL hiyaw. I know I can be moved by beats and note intervals. Just saying
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: BAMF on June 11, 2017, 04:55:32 PM
Tignan nyo nga tong vid na to. Listen through headphones. There is a swirling sound na parang umiikot sa ulo when one listens to it. I swear. Meron and others heard it too.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: knet370 on June 11, 2017, 05:02:35 PM
Tignan nyo nga tong vid na to. Listen through headphones. There is a swirling sound na parang umiikot sa ulo when one listens to it. I swear. Meron and others heard it too.
Modulation that i can't turn off? Parang ayoko nun haha. That's gonna get old pretty quick. :D
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: dullFingers on June 12, 2017, 10:44:48 AM
But jok lang. It's the phone. When I made a demo with backing tracks, pati yun naka phaser ang tunog hahaha. De bale. Got an Ipad mini, for study purposes but it's a superior recordi g device to my cherry mobile phone.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: BAMF on June 12, 2017, 11:34:44 AM
But jok lang. It's the phone. When I made a demo with backing tracks, pati yun naka phaser ang tunog hahaha. De bale. Got an Ipad mini, for study purposes but it's a superior recordi g device to my cherry mobile phone.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: BAMF on June 12, 2017, 11:39:08 AM
Pero lam nyo guys (pasintabi lang po) if you can't stand oas, go to Arie instead. He will demo to ypu his blonde telecaster if he still has it and explain to you what he hears. ( me parang fret noise pero hindi fret noise, kelangan me konting distortion, parang me whooshing effect sa loob ng ulo etc).
Kumbaga sa tao, these are his values and criterion for stating that a guitar is good. Kung di nyo type, eh di hindi.
Put this na to rest. Go to Arie if you want.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: titser_marco on June 12, 2017, 11:54:08 AM
Pero lam nyo guys (pasintabi lang po) if you can't stand oas, go to Arie instead. He will demo to ypu his blonde telecaster if he still has it and explain to you what he hears. ( me parang fret noise pero hindi fret noise, kelangan me konting distortion, parang me whooshing effect sa loob ng ulo etc).
Kumbaga sa tao, these are his values and criterion for stating that a guitar is good. Kung di nyo type, eh di hindi.
Put this na to rest. Go to Arie if you want.
+1 Arie demonstrated this to me using his Tokai tele. Nice B-bender too
Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 12, 2017, 12:29:30 PM
Pero lam nyo guys (pasintabi lang po) if you can't stand oas, go to Arie instead. He will demo to ypu his blonde telecaster if he still has it and explain to you what he hears. ( me parang fret noise pero hindi fret noise, kelangan me konting distortion, parang me whooshing effect sa loob ng ulo etc).
Kumbaga sa tao, these are his values and criterion for stating that a guitar is good. Kung di nyo type, eh di hindi.
Put this na to rest. Go to Arie if you want.
I think he shows that Tokai Tele to everyone. That guitar is awesome and I love the work he put into it. But I was more impressed with Arie himself more than with the guitar. He's an awesome guy indeed. To be honest, I don't think this topic can ever be put to rest but that's not necesarilly a bad thing now, is it? :)
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: BAMF on June 12, 2017, 07:08:13 PM
Ako simple lang. A great sounding guitar tone will floor ya at the first strum. No need for bends , distortion, looking out for fret noise etc. But then again and oft quoted ad nauseum, 'to each his own'.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 12, 2017, 07:18:11 PM
Ako simple lang. A great sounding guitar tone will floor ya at the first strum. No need for bends , distortion, looking out for fret noise etc. But then again and oft quoted ad nauseum, 'to each his own'.
I agree.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 12, 2017, 08:25:03 PM
Ako simple lang. A great sounding guitar tone will floor ya at the first strum. No need for bends , distortion, looking out for fret noise etc. But then again and oft quoted ad nauseum, 'to each his own'.
I tried a lot of guitars that sounded great on the first strum but turned out na wala palang hiyaw. In fact, the first strum separates the U.S. and Euro made from the cheap Asian made guitars. But... only the bent note determines and separates the truly exceptional.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 12, 2017, 09:43:26 PM
I tried a lot of guitars that sounded great on the first strum but turned out na wala palang hiyaw. In fact, the first strum separates the U.S. and Euro made from the cheap Asian made guitars. But... only the bent note determines and separates the truly exceptional.
So you believe in love at first strum? :-D
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: juwanfidle09 on June 12, 2017, 09:58:30 PM
game ako dito sir. im sincerely curious to try out this over the top hiyaw guitars. ill bring my prs, suhr and ibanezes as well for everybody to critique and give personal opinions on how it sounds and play. one request lang is that the gathering must have atleast one guitar with hiyaw. whoever owns those and bring those will be very much appreciated. its the entire point of the gathering anyway. :) set lang sana weekend so i could come.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: marzi on June 13, 2017, 11:11:25 AM
OMG OMG! the guys are coming back!!!!
now playing: Thin Lizzy - The Boys Are Back in Town
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 13, 2017, 12:15:42 PM
game ako dito sir. im sincerely curious to try out this over the top hiyaw guitars. ill bring my prs, suhr and ibanezes as well for everybody to critique and give personal opinions on how it sounds and play. one request lang is that the gathering must have atleast one guitar with hiyaw. whoever owns those and bring those will be very much appreciated. its the entire point of the gathering anyway. :) set lang sana weekend so i could come.
Good luck sa inyong lahat guys sana nga maituloy nyo yan haha. I have a feeling December 31 nanaman mas-schedule ito. Catering, anyone?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: knet370 on June 13, 2017, 12:50:19 PM
^
naku bat dec 31 pa? the sooner the better. :) and no need for catering. kahit pizza lang delivery or whatever mabusog lang. ang problema nalang dito ngayon is sino sino ba ang gusto mag tone party. :) parang dalawa palang kami ni idol fidel ang interesado. haha.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 13, 2017, 01:02:46 PM
naku bat dec 31 pa? the sooner the better. :) and no need for catering. kahit pizza lang delivery or whatever mabusog lang. ang problema nalang dito ngayon is sino sino ba ang gusto mag tone party. :) parang dalawa palang kami ni idol fidel ang interesado. haha.
Those are questions that have been asked for almost a decade now I think. And we may never get to find the answer. :-D
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: skrumian on June 13, 2017, 01:05:48 PM
naku bat dec 31 pa? the sooner the better. :) and no need for catering. kahit pizza lang delivery or whatever mabusog lang. ang problema nalang dito ngayon is sino sino ba ang gusto mag tone party. :) parang dalawa palang kami ni idol fidel ang interesado. haha.
contact mo si firemodel55 privately. baka puede ka papuntahin sa bahay nya to try all his goodies. well baka sakali lang naman. i think in the past may mga pinapunta na sya sa bahay nya.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: knet370 on June 13, 2017, 01:12:47 PM
mas maganda pag neutral nasa neutral grounds.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Skybox on June 13, 2017, 02:07:26 PM
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: jm the mute on June 13, 2017, 04:38:04 PM
nawawala ba ang hiyaw ng isang gitara na may hiyaw kapag nabago yung setup? (yung exact truss rod, string height, pickup height, lalim ng nut slots, bridge saddle intonation settings)
paano if that specific guitar (with hiyaw) needs a fret dress or refret...dapat ba bawat fret same shape and dimension and height nung original para ma-retain yung hiyaw?
pag may nabago ba sa gitara (na may hiyaw), pwedeng mawala?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: Screamous on June 13, 2017, 04:53:07 PM
nawawala ba ang hiyaw ng isang gitara na may hiyaw kapag nabago yung setup? (yung exact truss rod, string height, pickup height, lalim ng nut slots, bridge saddle intonation settings)
paano if that specific guitar (with hiyaw) needs a fret dress or refret...dapat ba bawat fret same shape and dimension and height nung original para ma-retain yung hiyaw?
pag may nabago ba sa gitara (na may hiyaw), pwedeng mawala?
^ +1 i would like to know too, in addition, what if yung gitara e wla nman hiyaw, pero pag pna setup, (yung right setup), posible ba na magka hiyaw thru that modification process?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: jm the mute on June 13, 2017, 05:10:36 PM
^ +1 i would like to know too, in addition, what if yung gitara e wla nman hiyaw, pero pag pna setup, (yung right setup), posible ba na magka hiyaw thru that modification process?
I guess what we're trying to get at is if "hiyaw" is a product of design and structure. kunwari, you tried a guitar in a store or wherever, nagustuhan mo, you felt the hiyaw pero it wasn't setup to your liking. from 9s, pina-11s mo. to do that, you have to make some changes on the nut slots, sa intonation...sa string height an rin siguro (taasan or babaan ng koonti). adjust mo rin pickup height and pickup screw height to compensate sa change sa action. koonting adjust din sa truss rod if you prefer some relief or wala. with all those changes...ma-retain kaya yung hiyaw?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: BAMF on June 13, 2017, 08:24:42 PM
game ako dito sir. im sincerely curious to try out this over the top hiyaw guitars. ill bring my prs, suhr and ibanezes as well for everybody to critique and give personal opinions on how it sounds and play. one request lang is that the gathering must have atleast one guitar with hiyaw. whoever owns those and bring those will be very much appreciated. its the entire point of the gathering anyway. :) set lang sana weekend so i could come.
Ang problema ko lang is malamang walang hiyaw gitara ko. Though I never bothered to look for a guitar with that since di ko naman talaga priority yun, but it is still good to learn something new.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: BAMF on June 14, 2017, 05:25:55 AM
Ang problema ko lang is malamang walang hiyaw gitara ko. Though I never bothered to look for a guitar with that since di ko naman talaga priority yun, but it still good to learn something new.
I'm starting to remember it's elements. It is literally 'gut wrenching'. I remember Arie's description 'para kang natatae'
Unfortunately , I didn't experience it on his Tokai but elsewhere.
In the hands of a talented guitarist as yourself, it will be devastating. In lesser hands, well, guys like me would prolly use it to remedy constipation.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: BAMF on June 14, 2017, 05:29:49 AM
Anyway, all that said, I'm in and 'tone party ready' save for some minor details such as a broken nut and a missing control cavity cover. Of course I need not say what sonic weapon I'll be armed with.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 05:59:00 AM
game ako dito sir. im sincerely curious to try out this over the top hiyaw guitars. ill bring my prs, suhr and ibanezes as well for everybody to critique and give personal opinions on how it sounds and play. one request lang is that the gathering must have atleast one guitar with hiyaw. whoever owns those and bring those will be very much appreciated. its the entire point of the gathering anyway. :) set lang sana weekend so i could come.
I only do one on one in MY house. For the simple reason, all my gear is in the house. And group testing is unwieldy. Teaching hiyaw is a one on one experience. Well you can bring a buddy, so I can teach it to a maximum of two people at a time.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 06:03:25 AM
nawawala ba ang hiyaw ng isang gitara na may hiyaw kapag nabago yung setup? (yung exact truss rod, string height, pickup height, lalim ng nut slots, bridge saddle intonation settings)
(nope because hiyaw is caused by that specific combination of wood in your specific guitar.)
paano if that specific guitar (with hiyaw) needs a fret dress or refret...dapat ba bawat fret same shape and dimension and height nung original para ma-retain yung hiyaw?
(hiyaw is not fret dependent.)
pag may nabago ba sa gitara (na may hiyaw), pwedeng mawala?
(only if you change the pieces of wood interacting on your solid body guitar.)
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 06:06:12 AM
(no need for neutral grounds. Either you hear it or you don't. No need for a cheer leading squad. Besides, my stuff is quite plenty, heavy and expensive for me to risk outside the house. I also test with electrical ground for my amps.)
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 06:08:02 AM
^ +1 i would like to know too, in addition, what if yung gitara e wla nman hiyaw, pero pag pna setup, (yung right setup), posible ba na magka hiyaw thru that modification process?
(Nope because its wood interaction does causes hiyaw. Either the guitar has it or it does not on the first day it becomes a guitar.)
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 06:11:14 AM
I guess what we're trying to get at is if "hiyaw" is a product of design and structure. kunwari, you tried a guitar in a store or wherever, nagustuhan mo, you felt the hiyaw pero it wasn't setup to your liking. from 9s, pina-11s mo. to do that, you have to make some changes on the nut slots, sa intonation...sa string height an rin siguro (taasan or babaan ng koonti). adjust mo rin pickup height and pickup screw height to compensate sa change sa action. koonting adjust din sa truss rod if you prefer some relief or wala. with all those changes...ma-retain kaya yung hiyaw?
Yes. As you can see, I listed all my guitars with hiyaw. There are about twenty of them. All of different construction, hardware, pickups, finish, scale length, electronics, and of different wood species. The only thing I keep constant is my Pyramids at gauge 10s.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 06:16:09 AM
I can't deny that. But in my experience since I got rid of my Asian Guitars -- at that point I had Japanese Guitars outnumbering my USA guitars at a factor of 13-2 -- I now have one MIJ guitar with hiyaw versus 20 USA guitars (including one made by Gil Yaron).
Its there but not worth your effort to find. Why? My theory (take this with a grain of salt) is that wood sourced by USA guitar companies and mills seem better suited to electric solid body guitars.
By the way, I keep one cheapo Japanese Charvel that really has no hiyaw what so ever. Its really a dead sounding guitar. I keep this guitar as reference so that people who don't want to compare their guitars to mine don't have to be COMPELLED to judge their own personal guitar in front of me or anybody else. On the other hand, I can assess a guitar if you want me to.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: skrumian on June 14, 2017, 06:34:37 AM
Can't say. Never done any study on that. But feel free to try my DW collector's with Paiste Signatures and Warwick into my aguilar db751 and bergantino 6x10.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: LaXter on June 14, 2017, 08:05:17 AM
(nope because hiyaw is caused by that specific combination of wood in your specific guitar.)
Does this also mean that a guitar with no hiyaw can eventually have hiyaw through swapping necks?
Curious din ako sa note na pinoproduce ng wood ng guitar na may hiyaw. I remember Vai saying that he likes his evo because its neck and body produces the same note when tapped.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 08:14:05 AM
Does this also mean that a guitar with no hiyaw can eventually have hiyaw through swapping necks?
Curious din ako sa note na pinoproduce ng wood ng guitar na may hiyaw. I remember Vai saying that he likes his evo because its neck and body produces the same note when tapped.
Yes eventually. Maybe after trying around at least 90 other necks.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: jm the mute on June 14, 2017, 09:00:18 AM
Does this also mean that a guitar with no hiyaw can eventually have hiyaw through swapping necks?
Curious din ako sa note na pinoproduce ng wood ng guitar na may hiyaw. I remember Vai saying that he likes his evo because its neck and body produces the same note when tapped.
so its not electronics dependent. hmmm...so when we talk about "hiyaw" we're basically just talking about the main body parts: neck and body
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: jm the mute on June 14, 2017, 09:04:09 AM
so does it mean that all we have to do to get hiyaw is find certain pieces of wood (we'll dig deeper on that later) and find a way to get sound waves to resonate through it and listen for the hiyaw?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: knet370 on June 14, 2017, 09:36:27 AM
I only do one on one in MY house. For the simple reason, all my gear is in the house. And group testing is unwieldy. Teaching hiyaw is a one on one experience. Well you can bring a buddy, so I can teach it to a maximum of two people at a time.
Makes sense. How could i forget. I once invited some friends that brought friends at my house for some jam. Unfortunatelty, someone dented my j custom and it was hard to pin point who did it kasi andami nila. Maximum of 3 maybe?
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: firemodel55 on June 14, 2017, 09:44:26 AM
Makes sense. How could i forget. I once invited some friends that brought friends at my house for some jam. Unfortunatelty, someone dented my j custom and it was hard to pin point who did it kasi andami nila. Maximum of 3 maybe?
Sure kaya pa. Will just have to adjust the food menu...
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: analog.matt on June 14, 2017, 07:00:55 PM
bring your best personal guitar para ma compare. yun isa na maisusuggest ko.
if your personal guitar has a little hiyaw...maganda yun as it can be your measuring stick and it will help you in your next purchase.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: titser_marco on June 14, 2017, 08:41:09 PM
Does hiyaw matter for those guitar players who aren't interested in getting the most natural sounding tone from their guitar? I'm talking about guys who load a ton of effects in front of their signal.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: nicoyow on June 14, 2017, 09:04:14 PM
Does hiyaw matter for those guitar players who aren't interested in getting the most natural sounding tone from their guitar? I'm talking about guys who load a ton of effects in front of their signal.
:lol:
as long as I have a good preamp, dark sounding chorus, low gain OD, fuzz and a reverse reverb, I'm good. No need for hiyaws.
Title: Re: HIYAW
Post by: dullFingers on June 14, 2017, 09:34:43 PM