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Author Topic: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp  (Read 2420 times)

Offline x_taxi

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kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« on: September 24, 2007, 02:42:43 PM »
i've researched bout the 3 gig switch.  but i get lost when the discussion gets technical.

my question is thus:  does it let you use 3gigs of ram per app?  or it simply changes the way windows manages the paging file?

thank you.

 :-) :-) :-)

note: boss kit, kindly move this to the appropriate forum if it's out of place, but i'm askin this with regards to use in music applications.
:razz::razz::razz:

Offline marvinq

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2007, 12:47:45 PM »
you're most likely to encounter problems with applications that aren't large-memory-address-aware. if your applications and plug-ins (and drivers too) are more-or-less up-to-date, then you should have very little problems using it.

well, i know for a fact that uad-1 cards are very moody with this 3gb switch. you will need to experiment with various 'userva=' values.
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http://www.facebook.com/MVQMusic ============

Offline KitC

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2007, 01:20:25 PM »
Plain XP usually addresses up to 2 gigs of ram only. The /3GB switch was a workaround to address that limitation so that you can install as much as 4 gig of ram in your system. Unfortunately, windows will keep 1 gig for itself so your applications can address only a maximum of 3 gigs. This is usually important for samplers that usually have access to multi-gigabyte sample libraries. (see? this is also relevant in this forum!)

Ditto also for what marvin said.
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire

Offline abyssinianson

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2007, 11:14:33 PM »
great!  thanks mssr. kitc and marvinq!  ram's gotten cheap though, over a g for a gb!

my friend's been buggin me to do the mac switch, but i'm holdin off.  definitely, leopard 10.5 will be the bettter 64-bit os compared to vista.  they already have insane amounts of ram available to the hardware.  but i still love my pc despite its myriad flaws.

 :-) :-) :-)

my last apple lappy was a G3 ibook and then I upgraded my desktop G4 to the G5 to reap the benefits for PT. i am due for a lappy upgrade and I am still thinking about one of the smaller sized Macbook Pros....no bigger than a 15.4 for me.

i have a Mac and a PC. The Mac has its own flaws as well despite a lot of Macheads saying it doesn't have any.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2007, 12:42:03 AM by abyssinianson »
ako si mimordz. 友だちからよろしくです!

Offline KitC

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2007, 02:48:42 PM »
Like they say, only experiment on your DAW when there ain't anything pending. It's bad enough when something goes wrong, worse if you corrupt your data in the process. That said, it pays to check for compatible ram before doing so (my mobo, for ex., wouldn't boot when I used double-sided ram).

I believe you can use the 3 gig switch with 3 gigs of memory, but I guess you're in single channel mode in that configuration so you might experience a bit of a slowdown inspite of increased mems. It's usually recommended to have identical sticks of ram.
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire


Offline KitC

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2007, 03:21:24 PM »
Knowing MSI very well, your mobo shouldn't be running dual channel with your mix of mems but since you are, I think it's time you brought out the sacrificial goat.  :wink:

Since you got identical sticks in a balanced configuration, you should be running in DC mode save for that anomaly re: single/double-sided mems. It's possible your FSB got bumped down though.
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire

Offline KitC

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2007, 09:52:02 PM »
Even if you're streaming samples from disk, there will always be some loaded into ram, on top of your applications and OS. This is one case where 64-bit OS rules in the area of addressable ram (128 gigs!). Kind of like how gigasampler handles samples even if they use disk streaming technology, there are always samples loaded into ram. From what I've been able to gather, it's like the first few seconds of a sample are loaded as a sort of buffer since the HD naturally is slower than reading off ram.

As for your swap file size, the norm is usually 1.5 times the amount of available ram, but that became obsolete when it became possible to have gigabytes of ram. I say keep your swap file static at 1 gig, but try to use partitioning software that allows you to partition specific areas of the HD, specifically the outer edge of the platter. Create a small partition there big enough for the swap file (maybe a couple of gigs), and assign the swap file completely to that partition. The rationale for the outer edge is because it is the fastest part of the HD, hence, data transfers are much faster than in other areas of the disk.
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire

Offline marvinq

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2007, 12:13:53 PM »
not really. just provide an option to revert to windows without the 3gb switch. i'm sure kitc can explain it better.

ot -- @kitc: went to a music store today. tried the korg m3 and the yamaha xs7. nice!
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http://www.facebook.com/MVQMusic ============

Offline KitC

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2007, 12:36:47 PM »
ot -- @kitc: went to a music store today. tried the korg m3 and the yamaha xs7. nice!

<drool>

I once went to Sam Ash in Edison, NJ and that place was synth heaven.

Hay... if only you can get the Sonar7 upgrade for me...
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire

Offline KitC

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2007, 08:22:44 PM »
master kitc!  pano po yun option to be able revert back from the /3 gig switch as per marvinq's suggestion?

I don't think you change anything radically with your OS when you activate the /3GB switch; it's merely a little add-on in your boot.ini kinda like this:

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /fastdetect /3GB

Normally, when you have 4 gigs installed, windows will allocate half to itself and the other half to your applications. The /3GB switch merely adjusts the allocation so that you have 3 gigs available for your applications, that's all. Just take it out and windows should revert. Like Marvin mentions, you might have to play around with /userva values, start with /userva=3030. More here.

You can have the option to boot with the 3GB switch on or off by modifying your boot.ini like this:

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional 3GB" /fastdetect /3GB
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /fastdetect

More here.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2007, 08:28:27 PM by KitC »
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire

Offline marvinq

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2007, 11:13:29 PM »
just to safe, boot without the 3gb switch whenever you update windows and/or your applications.
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http://www.facebook.com/MVQMusic ============

Offline abyssinianson

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2007, 12:01:02 AM »
<drool>

I once went to Sam Ash in Edison, NJ and that place was synth heaven.

Hay... if only you can get the Sonar7 upgrade for me...

Sam Ash usually has better synth and keyboard choices than Guitar Center but recently my local Sam Ash has been slipping. There haven't been as many synths on display to try and the showroom doesn't look very organized and enticing. Maybe I can coerce them to have me take a crack at designing and stocking the showroom...I could think of a few things to stuff into their keyboards room:)
ako si mimordz. 友だちからよろしくです!

Offline KitC

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Re: kindly explain the truth bout the 3gig switch in 32bit xp
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2007, 12:32:47 PM »
one more thing, since there is the allocation limit for everything, how is the video card memory handled?  so it's part of which allocation?

Not a problem unless you are using onboard video, which I don't recommend at all.
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire