A better way for guitar shootout?

[superoxy]

Got this from this thread: http://www.nzguitars.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=74649#74649

There are many guitarists out there who are passionate about tone (bassists to a lesser extent). There are also many arguments about tone - which guitar gives which tone etc. (note: not evaluating 'best' just 'voice')

A few years back we did an exercise with this. We set up two valve amps - a 100W Marshall half stack and a Fender Twin Reverb (no fx) on a stage in a country hall. We set the amps to mid-tone positions (since no-one could agree on amp settings) and ran their two input leads to an A/B box.

About 6-7 guitarists set their guitars to their fav settings and left them on stands on stage. In all, there were 20 guitars on stage - representing several makers.

Then the curtains were closed, so no-one could see what was happening on stage.

All of us - about a couple of dozen musos, sat out at the far end of the hall and the guitarists took it in turns to go up on stage and play a few bars of the same song on every guitar (it didn't matter that each guitarist played a different song - they just had to play the same song, the same way, on every guitar and through both amps at random).

In the audience, we had a sheet with the guitars listed down one side and the two amps across the top. As each riff was played, we had to guess which guitar and which amp etc. There was one other person on stage - noting which guitar/amp combination etc.

The results showed that most of us could tell the difference (most of the time) between the amps, but no-one got every guitar correct and (although I hate stats) only nine of the assembled musos (representing a wide age range) got more than half right. That is far worse than guessing.

I suggest to you that this is a fun thing to do and quite revealing, since it clearly showed us that, although we swore such and such a pickup or guitar made a huge difference, we really couldn't tell that difference with any certainty - even when we were listening critically.

Funnily enough, the younger musos (who we'd expect had better ears) were the most upset at this, since they were the ones who predicted getting close to 100% right! The best result was actually from a keyboard player (not me) who got a score of 62%. The worst was 25% (rounded off with Swedish rounding of course).

If you can put together a bunch of musos and guitars - even better with several amps - why not try this out? Make it a compet ition, maybe.

Its a fun way to pass a Sunday afternoon and then everyone can get throughly pissed/stoned and brag about how good they were.

[greasykid]

Ganyan yung matagal ko nang challenge sa everyone's favorite tone nazi e.  

Blind A/B test para magkaalaman talaga.

[Deacon Blues]

Hey, great post, superoxy!

I'm kinda puzzled why none of the tone fanatics picked up on this post ..

This just confirms my belief that, in the end, a guitar is just a guitar - no matter what we do to squeeze out the best tones out of it ...

It's even more surprising considering that most of the guitarists who listened didn't even fare well with their guesses.

I wonder though how an overdrive shootout would've turned out, given the same test parameters ...

Such are the pitfalls of 'listening blind' ... but after all, isn't that the best way to listen? without bias, without prejudice ...

[psychic_sushi]

"What is invisible to the eye is what is essential"

I agree, the best way to listen, and to play guitar (if possible!) is with your eyes closed. music is an aural/sonic art form (emphasis on the word "art"). at the end of the day, its the soundscapes your stuff can create that count.

different guitars, different textures? different pedals/tomnes, different colors? plus, a great band/tune for canvass.

may i add though, i kinda feel that the most consistent way to shoot out gear is not through the naked guitar-pedal-amp format. methinks that with a full band, drums, keyboard, bass, vocals, or even a group playing a musical genre relative to the gear for reference, would be a great way to conduct a shootout. in this scenario, the true interrelationship of eq with all instruments is revealing, the plus-minus aspect of where the guitar tone lies between the drummers hi hat,  the bass and keyboards.

i'm sure that many of us here have dialed a great bedroom tone, then freak out when we try to apply that in a live situation.

y'know what, it would be great to have a full jam/tone shoot out! perhaps we could all learn how to zoom in on maximizing the guitars space in the mix! using the pedals, etc... it would be beneficial for all

goodbye bangaw tone and sludge forever!

[markflo]

that's an interesting way of doing it.

game!

[psychic_sushi]

and may i add, i am aware of oasgomez's tone parties. its cool him and the gang hold these

i was kinda thinking of following suit but in a lower-fi context, bring what you have, boutique is a minority (due to budget constraints and opaque economy! hahahahah) and wouldn't matter if its you zoom 1010, your psk overdrive (hey, remember those! i doubt there's a remedy for its squash though) or if its your toaster that doubles as a crunchy boost that creates searing tone enough to disintegrate you mom's gardenias.

would be cool if we could also be open to critique on the tone on the fly by all attendies, on the personal gear. then we could probably, just possibly, be able to maximize on what we already possess...

[grecoslave]

hmm i wonder why the nazi hasn't replied in this thread yet

[grecoslave]

someone make this happen

[deltaslim]

I wonder though how an overdrive shootout would've turned out, given the same test parameters ...

+1