DIY Acoustics and Soundproofing Thread

[botbenz]

i bought one isomax clip from the u.s., just to see how it is. one piece cost me us$5. with one isomax clip in hand, i went to wilcon and tried to see if it would fit a locally available furring/channel. as shown below, it fits a batten-type furring. together, they take up about an inch and a half of space.



i liked them, in spite of the price. but i did not have the luxury of waiting two months (one month to fill a balikbayan box, and another month to ship) for me to finish my steel framing. besides, the batten-type furring shown above is not as widely available as steel studs, tracks, channels, etc. and hat-type furrings (typically used for roofs) don't fit and take up too much space. lastly, isomax clips seem best suited for holding resilient channels, not function as sway braces per se. so i considered building a sway brace myself.

again, i don't mean to post-pad, but this forum keeps me from posting several large photos in one post. so stay tuned for more!

[botbenz]

because commercial sway braces for acoustic isolation use do not seem to be available locally (even mikep has them made), and they are not cheap for the average DIYer, i embarked on making one myself.

i patterned mine after this: http://www.kineticsnoise.com/arch/images/psb.jpg

mine is obviously home-made:


i will describe my build next.

[botbenz]

a sway brace is essentially made of the following:
1) the brace/bracket itself;
2) the fasteners, which attach the brace to two objects, typically two wall framing members;
3) the isolators - typically neoprene pads that decouple the members from one another.

in my DIY sway brace shown in the previous post, i riveted two steel angles together into a metal bracket, shown below:



steel angles are widely available. they are typically used to support ceiling c-channels to the ceiling joists via steel suspension rods. for typical steel framing, this suffices. but for studio purposes, the serially connected steel members short-circuit the frame to the ceiling/joists above. that's where the isolators come in, described next.

[botbenz]

the fasteners in my diy sway brace are fairly self-evident: bolt and nut to fasten the sway brace to the metal stud of the inner room, and bolt and tox/anchor to fasten the sway brace to the concrete wall of the outer room.

the isolators are a combination of rubber washers and an inch-thick "washer" i made out of commercial elastomer products, shown separately below.



yes, i could've used a stack of five or six rubber washers, instead of this "hacked washer". but rubber, especially when exposed to heat, or oil-based products, can deteriorate. so i made one out of elastomer. the sample shown above is made of silicone. the others i made subsequently are made of super vulcaseal, which i learned is made of polychloroprene (aka neoprene). these elastomers are supposed to last longer than natural rubber.

i use rubber washers for the less load-bearing parts of the sway brace. but for the part that is supposed to act as sway brace's main spring, i use my hacked washer.

the blue pvc pipe you see is just used to contain the elastomer, so i can make inch-thick cylindrical washers. and the pvc pipe will keep the washer's "love handles" from bulging out during sway compression. the metal washer pressing the elastomer is smaller than the diameter of the pvc, so there is no rigid contact between the two.

next up, the installed sway brace.

[botbenz]

my diy sway brace, installed:



this was the first sway brace i installed. even the "washers" are made of elastomers. they don't look as neat as the rubber washers i used later, but the elastomer washers still do the job of decoupling the parts from one another. the shadow behind the metal brace indicate that the brace is not in contact with the wall. similarly, the bolts are also not in contact with the sway brace, because i enlarged the brace holes and filled them with elastomer, effectively creating bushings.

i am, however, not deluded into thinking that "no contact" means isolation. an overloaded spring is as good as no spring, hence, short circuited connection. but because sway braces are not as load-bearing as ceiling hangers, i am less concerned. i plan to use perfect view's a/c support as hangers, unless a better alternative comes up.

if you have more discriminating needs, i suggest you spring for (pun intended  ) industrial sway braces, or hire a pro like mikep. i only shared mine, with no intention of advocating it. diy at our own risk. i am certainly willing to live with my hack, for my non-commercial "listening room".

hope this was somewhat helpful! good luck, fellow diyers.

[mikep]

Very good ideas, botbenz. The important thing is that no short circuit will occur when all the components, i. e., walling, studding, sway/hanger brackets, etc. are put together.  That is where the experience of the carpenters or artisans come into play.  My group of carpenters have been working for me for over 20 years of doing studios and music rooms.  Good luck in your endeavour.

[britesynth]

will this work?

http://www.palmcitystudios.com/timobrien/music/soundbooth/simplesoundbooth.html

ano pwede substitute sa moving blankets?

thanks! 

[botbenz]

@britesynth: what do you want to use it for?

what you cited seems useful for controlling/absorbing reflections. but it certainly won't soundproof a room; that is, four of these do not make an isolation booth.

[britesynth]

@sir botbenz

for vocal recording purposes po sana...

untreated  po room ko extra bedroom na walang gumagamit at dun ko nilagay "home studio" ko, dun na rin po kami nagrerecord ng vocs kaya tingin ko mejo muddy recordings ko... 

ano po pwede substitute sa blankets? sa ibang forums auralex acoustic foams at se reflection filters gamit nila kaso costly at di ko lam san meron dito satin... kaya DIY na lang sana...

thanks sir!

[botbenz]

if you backread this thread, you should be able to see examples of DIY broadband absorber panels, using rockwool. a few suppliers are listed on this thread too. or you can use fiberglass, which mc home depot sells. density recommendations can also be found on this thread. i don't remember the details. so please backread.

although not proven to be carcinogenic, you'll need to cover mineral fiber, if only to keep loose fibers from straying like cat hair. i don't know where once sources acoustically neutral or transparent fabric in manila. i suppose you can find burlap in divisoria, but that's just my guess.

if you have unused heavy drapes or carpets, i suppose those may do. be prepared to have a bohemian looking room though.

[britesynth]

nakakita po ko fiberglass sa home depot haha kaso amproblema ko naman sir pano ko iincorporate jan sa frame na nakita ko, thanks lit!

[botbenz]

tignan mo yung post ni peeves24 last march 2nd. he has a picture of the panel framing, and the mineral fiber in it. ganun!

[britesynth]

i've seen it sir botbenz, hmnn ok lang ba if i'll be using fibers instead of the rigid rockwool? pareho lang ba effect nila?

thanks!

[juanberto]

guys pwede ba gamitin yun uratex foam pang soundproof ng booth? yung parang may mga bukol. hehe. di ko alam pangalan e.

[rakrakan]

guys pwede ba gamitin yun uratex foam pang soundproof ng booth? yung parang may mga bukol. hehe. di ko alam pangalan e.

hindi pwede pang-soundproof ang foam. Pang sound-proof are mass heavy materials.

Pwedeng pang-sound control yan.

Iba ang sound control sa sound proof.

[botbenz]

i've seen it sir botbenz, hmnn ok lang ba if i'll be using fibers instead of the rigid rockwool? pareho lang ba effect nila?

what matters more is the density of the fiber, which is usually measured in kilograms per cubic meter; generally, the more dense, the better the absorption characteristics

the advantage of rigid fiber is that it can stay more upright, requiring less bracing/sagging support. you don't want your fiber bulging out like a beer belly, unless you want people to think that the studio owner "created it in his own image."

[alien_inside]

Go for rockwool if you dont have budget. P190 lang per 2x'2'x4' pero 8 ang laman ng per pack. CSR rockwool. Available sa QC area. Yung nasa Alabang is P250.00. mas mahal.

contact me or mark yulo... no additional charge. we are not agents...make sure lang you have pang-transpo...we are after the security of the company lang baka pag nagpost kami without their permission, e kami naman ang kawawa... hu hu.

[britesynth]

what matters more is the density of the fiber, which is usually measured in kilograms per cubic meter; generally, the more dense, the better the absorption characteristics

the advantage of rigid fiber is that it can stay more upright, requiring less bracing/sagging support. you don't want your fiber bulging out like a beer belly, unless you want people to think that the studio owner "created it in his own image."

ahaha! ayt sir, thanks! 

[juanberto]

where to buy auralex bass traps? manila po.

[alien_inside]

where to buy auralex bass traps? manila po.

This will help you...
http://www.auralex.com/dealers/international.asp

Naghanap na rin ako noon... NONE OF THESE KEYWORDS helped me: Reseller, retailer, supplier, dealer, distributor, importer, etc etc...

Makahanap man ako, as in trip lang na makiki usyoso, pisil-pisil, amuy-amoy, tingin-tingin...tapos wala naman pala ako budget... kaya nagROCKWOOL ako...

[palaka]

mga sir tanung lang po kung malaki po ba yung tunog  na mababawas pag ganito ginawa?
simento ung buong sides pati bubong tapus plano ko po sana lagyan ng rockwool buong sides ng hindi lalagyan ng space tapus tatakpan ng accoustic tiles wala parin pong space tatalab po kaya iyon?salamat

[botbenz]

mga sir tanung lang po kung malaki po ba yung tunog  na mababawas pag ganito ginawa?
simento ung buong sides pati bubong tapus plano ko po sana lagyan ng rockwool buong sides ng hindi lalagyan ng space tapus tatakpan ng accoustic tiles wala parin pong space tatalab po kaya iyon?salamat

@palaka: ano ba ang objective mo? do you want to keep the noise in, so as not to disturb the neighbors? do you plan to use it as a practice room, tracking room, or mixing/mastering room? the relevance of your design depends on your goals.

for soundproofing, more mass generally yields higher sound transmission loss. so cement is good; acoustic tiles less so.

but soundproofing is only one aspect; acoustic treatment is the other. kung gusto mo lang na "malaking tunog ang mabawas", and care less about the acoustic quality, kahit nga cement lang, and placement  of broadband absorber panels (rockwool framed and covered with fabric) in key locations might be good enough, saving you the expense and trouble of paneling your room with acoustic tiles. again, much depends on what you intend to accomplish.

[palaka]

@palaka: ano ba ang objective mo? do you want to keep the noise in, so as not to disturb the neighbors? do you plan to use it as a practice room, tracking room, or mixing/mastering room? the relevance of your design depends on your goals.

for soundproofing, more mass generally yields higher sound transmission loss. so cement is good; acoustic tiles less so.

but soundproofing is only one aspect; acoustic treatment is the other. kung gusto mo lang na "malaking tunog ang mabawas", and care less about the acoustic quality, kahit nga cement lang, and placement  of broadband absorber panels (rockwool framed and covered with fabric) in key locations might be good enough, saving you the expense and trouble of paneling your room with acoustic tiles. again, much depends on what you intend to accomplish.

ang gagawin ko nga po pala para sa tracking room
bali ang gusto ko po sana mangyari mabawasan ang tunong niya para habang may nag tratrack hindi marinig ang tunog sa mixing room.

yung ginawang simento yung lahat ng sides nabawasan ng 50% ang lumalabas natunog kaso ang naging problema ko naman po masyado siyang mareverb kaya pansamantala nilagyan ko ng tag two layers ng kortina yung dalawang sides gumana namn po malaki nabawas sa reverb.

[alien_inside]

ang gagawin ko nga po pala para sa tracking room
bali ang gusto ko po sana mangyari mabawasan ang tunong niya para habang may nag tratrack hindi marinig ang tunog sa mixing room.

yung ginawang simento yung lahat ng sides nabawasan ng 50% ang lumalabas natunog kaso ang naging problema ko naman po masyado siyang mareverb kaya pansamantala nilagyan ko ng tag two layers ng kortina yung dalawang sides gumana namn po malaki nabawas sa reverb.

May leak ng sound sa glass view window and door. Especially the door, sabi nga nila, the door is the weakest link...

Make sure you have an AIR TIGHT View window... and the doors are THICK, filled with insulation.

[peeves24]

may gumawa na ba ng QRD diffusors dito sa tin?

3 months ko na ring iniisip gawin. kumpleto ako sa tools, may plans at may idea na ko sa mga templates at jig na gagawin para mapabilis yung pag cut ng kahoy pero wala ako initiative para simulan

matrabaho kasi pero sigurado naman ako na magagawa ko sya

siguro naghahanap lang ako ng inspirasyon. kailangan ko pa naman ng 2 to 4 4x2 feet panels nun