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Author Topic: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...  (Read 14723 times)

Offline glassjaw_jc

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Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2006, 04:01:27 PM »
i've read somewhere a long time ago that mastering is not necessary if the material was mixed very well.

what's your take on this?
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Offline skunkyfunk

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Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2006, 05:07:25 PM »
Quote from: glassjaw_jc
i've read somewhere a long time ago that mastering is not necessary if the material was mixed very well.

what's your take on this?


http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=227725

You'll always need a Bob Katz no matter how perfect the mix is.

However, as Zach Lucero told me, "FIX THE MIX FIRST BEFORE SENDING IT TO ME."  Kasi nagpi-pingpong lang sila kadalasan ng artist.  And he said that the most important part is the tracking stage.  Even his TC Finalizer and DAC1 cannot fix a bad tracking.  

The main idea is:

MASTERING CANNOT FIX A BAD MIX.
MIXING CANNOT FIX BAD TRACKING.
GREAT TRACKING GEAR CANNOT FIX A BAD PERFORMANCE.

Offline jplacson

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Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #52 on: April 11, 2006, 05:22:15 PM »
there's no real rule... if it sounds good, it sounds good.  yes it is possible for one engineer to do it all...

but my personal take on it is, well, personal... I prefer a split process for 3 reasons...

1) simple efficiency.  when a song is mixed, it then moves to mastering... freeing up the mixing guy for the next song.

2) ears.  we're all only human.  listen to the same thing over and over and over again, specially after tracking & mixing, and you start to hear things... or not hear things.  your ears become more sensitive and you start to hear different frequencies.  spliting the process gives you someone whos fresh into the project...kinda like a marathon race.

3) cost of specialization.  if 2 people tried to set up studios that both mixed and mastered... you'd end up with 2 mid-range studios.  but if one spent all time/money/effort in mixing, and the other in mastering... now, you have 2 experts in each field.  each one helping the other improve, and making better output all around.  and the over-all health of the industry improves at a faster pace.
DOPPLER AUDIO

Offline Teja

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Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #53 on: August 30, 2006, 11:03:38 AM »
ryt on.ei, im selling my yamaha o2r (version 2) any1 here interested? maybe any1 here would like to put up a recording studio or sumthing. http://talk.philmusic.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=21959&highlight=o2r
http://talk.philmusic.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=23626
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Offline starfugger

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Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #54 on: August 30, 2006, 06:45:03 PM »
ive said this before and it might be worth mentioning again.  i heard some really good "foreign-sounding" (for lack of a better term) mixes done by home recording enthusiasts in the states.  this is a site by a guy named josh woodward:  http://joshwoodward.com  you might find his stuff interesting.  his gear list is pretty modest, consisting of a tascam fw 1884, an akg c 414, an aphex 1100 pre same as mine, and a few hand made instruments, among others.  i would really love to see how josh woodward's mixes would sound if he had done it here in the philippines (sa kuryente ba talaga? o sa skill?).

recording in the 50's and 60's still sound pretty amazing considering the limited recording tracks that were avilable at the time (granted some of the stuff they used have actually turned into classics and are even more expensive now than some new gear).
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Offline KitC

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Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #55 on: August 30, 2006, 06:55:37 PM »
Just edited the double post, Hazel.
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Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #56 on: October 25, 2006, 01:37:19 AM »
Hey Guys.. I just registered a while ago. Ive been living in Toronto for a couple of years now and it's such a thrill to see this site active and being helpful to a lot of musicians out there. Getting back to the topic... Given the digital revolution of audio recording for the past years, recording has never been accessible to musicians as to what is being offered to us today. I completely agree that having the high end HW/SW contribute a factor to a great recording but given the economic situation of the Philippines, there becomes a gap between those artists who wanted to record in such facilities as "PC3" or "GC4" im im correct.
Upon lurking into this topic i noticed that a lot of home studios / studios there have high end gears and such that honestly, i think compares to a typical small scale recording facility here in toronto. (of course there are those crazy crazy studios here too). My point is, I believe that for what available resources there in the philippines now and what most studios offer, we are capable of producing high quality audio . I agree to a thread about Urbandub's song.. that yes, indeed, it need a lot in terms of mixing etc.

I also checked the studio ad section of the forums and i was comparing their rigs to that of a typical "reasonable" studio here in toronto and the phils have quite similar  gears.. if not better,,  but the final product is where the diffrence is heard,  Check this studio of a friend of mine. nothing fancy.. just a home studio.. http://www.199studios.com   ..  check his demos.  And again, these equip are pretty much what ive seen among studios there that were listed.

SOrry if im all over.. so much to share. ahihihi.
   

Offline KitC

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #57 on: October 25, 2006, 01:54:29 AM »
Welcome to the forums, filbot.

It's quite heartening to see more kababayans gracing our Philmusic forums. I do hope you will keep us informed of the music tech scene over in Toronto. Please feel free to contribute more and congratulations for having graduated from lurking status!  :-D

Regards,
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Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #58 on: October 25, 2006, 02:19:55 AM »
Thanks KitC.. I'll surely update you guys. Well, in terms of gears, i think one of the main advantages here is that you go to a music store and there you got most of the pro audio equip you see in mags. But that doesnt separate us from you guys coz most of the times, it's useless.. THEY COST A LOT. and even in North American standard means of living. They are quite pricey. Then we got great financing deals here like I could be working at mcdonalds and qualify for a financing deal for an HD3.,., It's true.. but the dilemma... Instead of focusing on recording or music.. .we spend our times working just to pay off. hehe.. I've recorded a compilation album here to support local pinoy talents here in toronto and i'll tell you guys about my experience on releasing / recording an album standpoint from toronto.

The recording:
I started to take interest in recording maybe 2 years ago using the cheapest means.. then make the long story short, i slowly understood the limitations and what not of certain gears and what would be practical for the budget. Then happened the album..  It was called "One"  and it has 15 all original tracks.
I recorded the album in 4 months which i think was a NO NO.. never rush a project. Now that im listening to it.. there were some parts that i think i went DEAF when i was mixing it.. SO yeah.. but yeah,, we all learn from mistakes and experience. hold on.. gotta go back to work.. ahihiihhi..


www.myspace.com/minervarecords
« Last Edit: October 25, 2006, 02:22:13 AM by filbot »

Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #59 on: October 25, 2006, 02:35:56 AM »
ohh.. btw, regarding this topic. More reason to believe that lack of top notch equip is not to blame for our status in recording,,, www.myspace.com/moulann    she's a friend of mine and her album is done using SW/HW that most decent "home studios" there have.
Theres Hope for the Phil's recording quality!!! woohooo

Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #60 on: October 25, 2006, 02:44:58 AM »
Quote from: skunkyfunk
Quote from: abyssinianson
Quote from: skunkyfunk
I am not discounting the fact that you can record AT HOME.  Rick Rubin's masterpiece, Blood Sugar Sex Magic was recorded in a haunted mansion.  It took them 9 months to rehearse before laying everything on tape.  And I cannot discount the fact that their makeshift studio was 10x better than most studios in this country.  

The idea behind this thread is not to demean ourselves, but rather get to the bottom of our dilemma.  Why the hell are OUR recordings (bands particularly) so messed up?

my guess: the recording methodology and mixing skills need improvement to compete with mainstream material's "sound" released from the US, European and Japanese markets. any other suggestions?

Point taken.  But can we come up with world-class recordings with what we have NOW?  Can people hear the difference between an 1176 plugin versus the real thing?  Can people hear the difference between vocals recorded straight thru a Digi 001 VERSUS an AKG414 fed to a Neve Portico 5042 with an EL Distressor on the rear end through a Benchmark ADC1 to a Protools HD3 Accel?   Tracking stage pa lang ang dami na nating kulang.

not unless you are listening to the songs through hi-fi equipment or decent studio monitors. then again, these are not the mainstream speakers people listen to. the reason why I specified "methodology" and "mixing skills" as suggestions is because both are totally doable with the equipment available to the philippine market. had I said "Upgrade your equipment," that would have specified using the gear you detailed. Having good gear in a signal path is one thing, sharpening your methodology - the way you engineer your tracks, mix it, and arrange the elements in a song - is different. engineering a track with the gear that you have requires a working knowledge of what frequencies your instruments work best on, how to best capture them in the environment you are in, and applying the proper effects to contextualize the track to the scope of the whole song. engineering a song, like the recording methodology (not the equipment) can make or break a track because although a Digi 001 cannot compare to a Neve, you can record at a high res (1)96khz at 32 bit float - more than enough to ensure that you are getting every bitrate of data you are recording. and even if you dither down to 44.1, you are still capturing as much detail as possible to make track sound fuller.

using the EQs in a regular sequencer, you can trim, boost, and enhance the elements of a song for next to nothing since there are powerful tools included with the sequencer. if you need dynamics, sequencers come with those tools too - saturation emulators, modulation effects, choruses, automation etc... there are a ton of tools in Cubase, Sonar, Logic, or MOTU that you can use to get your track in good shape.


I totally agree with this. You guys have enough available equip out there... just more development for the mixing/ mastering part. I'm listening to a song by Kitchie "Fire" and given that it was done using HW/SW which i dont think would cost more than a Protools HD system.. But the quality is great.. you guys can compete with North American standards given whats accessible at the moment. Learn to utilize what gears you have to the fullest.

Offline music_doctor

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #61 on: October 25, 2006, 06:16:37 AM »
... pls consider also the instrumentation, musicality & style of arranging. It does matter a lot, too.
Know the rules before you break them.

Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #62 on: October 25, 2006, 06:46:04 AM »
... pls consider also the instrumentation, musicality & style of arranging. It does matter a lot, too.

exactly.. i think they're bigger factors than what available techonology has on the table...

Offline music_doctor

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #63 on: October 25, 2006, 08:28:42 AM »
... pls consider also the instrumentation, musicality & style of arranging. It does matter a lot, too.

exactly.. i think they're bigger factors than what available techonology has on the table...

MISMO!!!

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Offline starfugger

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #64 on: October 25, 2006, 10:58:06 AM »
ohh.. btw, regarding this topic. More reason to believe that lack of top notch equip is not to blame for our status in recording,,, www.myspace.com/moulann    she's a friend of mine and her album is done using SW/HW that most decent "home studios" there have.
Theres Hope for the Phil's recording quality!!! woohooo

amen to that.  it's becoming more and more apparent to me that it is in fact a matter of skill (with the technology and equipment we alwready have here in the philippines).  here's another theory.  home recordings probably sound good in the US and other first world countries because their homes are more suitable for recording.  they have higher ceilings, wooden floors and walls, etc.   we have to admit that the room is as important as any studio equipment in the art of home recording.

in any case, there is hope :)
« Last Edit: October 25, 2006, 11:10:46 AM by starfugger »
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Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #65 on: October 25, 2006, 12:30:29 PM »
ohh.. btw, regarding this topic. More reason to believe that lack of top notch equip is not to blame for our status in recording,,, www.myspace.com/moulann    she's a friend of mine and her album is done using SW/HW that most decent "home studios" there have.
Theres Hope for the Phil's recording quality!!! woohooo

amen to that.  it's becoming more and more apparent to me that it is in fact a matter of skill (with the technology and equipment we alwready have here in the philippines).  here's another theory.  home recordings probably sound good in the US and other first world countries because their homes are more suitable for recording.  they have higher ceilings, wooden floors and walls, etc.   we have to admit that the room is as important as any studio equipment in the art of home recording.

in any case, there is hope :)


another advantage here is that most of the products you see in mags are available in music stores to try.. meaning.. u can buy it, then if you dont like it return it.. This gives a great opportunity to experience the difference among them.. plus, i must say.. crazy financing deals...  very tempting.. hehe. u gotta love it and hate it at the same time i guess. I believe filipinos are at nature more capable of utilizing their systems at their fullest. One of the biggest recording studios here is called metalworks..  bands like nelly furtado, tea party, etc.. recorded albums there and yes they have million dollar facilities.. but then, a friend of mine recorded an album there.. paid 10K dollars for the whole album..( a fraction of how much Nelly Furtado's budget for her album)... and it sounded like [gooey brown stuff].. im not even exaggerating... i think the point here is when theres too much money involved, these big companies would rather get 2 big name clients paying 100000 each than 20 local bands paying 1000 each.. less effort.. so yeah.. big ups for those dedicated studios out there who still balance the love for music and money.

Offline starfugger

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #66 on: October 25, 2006, 02:13:28 PM »
i hear ya filbot.  the way i explain quality recordng to my clients is this:

the qualty of recording will depend mainly on the delicate balance of three things: 1) skill of the engineer 2) equipment and 3) the working budget.  an abundance of one or two factors is not enough.  all three factors have to be well balanced, otherwise the quality will suffer greatly.  that's how i see it at least.  and the absence of this balance would be how i gather a 10k $ recording in a multi million dollar facility sound like [gooey brown stuff], as u mentioned.   
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Offline PINOY PALENGKE

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #67 on: October 25, 2006, 10:40:15 PM »
skill..galing ng pinoy sa technical stuff..ability to make good use of what's available.. malupit tayo dun...actually siguro sa kahit anu field.. you'll see this when you go out of the country and see pinoys at working action...

sa gamit...definitely..majority sa atin iwan...kasama ako dun, nangangarap lang magkaroon nito..nun... puro browse sa net.. tingin ng malulupit na bago gamit... pero di naman ma-afford..pero, not all of course..meron talagang can afford... why ganun? simple lang din..third world country tayo..it all boils down to our standard of living... sa ibang bansa when you work for a day.. the minimum wage you get maybe enough to feed you for 3 days or a week..eh dito? yung trabaho mo, pambayad lang ng kinain mo kahapon.. this is the harsh reality.. for example, i've had american friends, na para sa kanila, mababa lang din sweldo..kumbaga sa pinas..construction worker.. musikero siya..pero.. pag nag decide siya na bumili ng gamit..kaya niya.. eh sa atin? bago ka makabili ng malulupit na equipment, dapat mayaman ka, may financer or sampung taon ka nag ipon..hehehe... medyo malayo na siguro mga sinasabi ko sa topic.. pero para sa kin..kaya tayo napag-iiwanan pag dating sa gamit ay dahil sa status ng bansa natin..mahirap lang ang Pinas... at apektado tayo lahat dun... pero sa abilidad, i'm sure world standard tayo..

however, totoo din na dahil sa technology ngayun, kaya talaga palupitin ang isang mix ng song halimbawa kung magaling ang hahawak.. pero, i've noticed a flaw in our recording industry.. correct me if i'm wrong..but somehow... mga companies or radio or tao sa industriya natin ay may naging "standard"..tunog pinoy na sinasabi..takot sila mag experiment..magbago..although may mga bagong artists, producers, engineers na daring..pero madami pa din ang andun sa safe and generic sound na gusto nila..dahil yun daw ang gusto ng market.. na standard daw.. ewan ko.. napuna ko lang... well kung iisipin natin..layo na ng tunog ng beatles sa incubus di ba? which means, nag proprogress yan... evolve... i think it's safe to say na wala naman talaga standard.. wala tama at mali pag dating sa art na to.. meron lang maganda at pangit sa pandinig pero..depende pa din sa nakikinig...

peace !!!  :mrgreen:
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Offline Direk

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...are we?
« Reply #68 on: November 01, 2006, 12:51:09 AM »
   A great excuse used by some people here;
       "Can people hear the difference between an 1176 plugin versus the real thing? Agreed by another,"But... only .1% of the listening audience can tell the difference."
      It's a great excuse because although it might sound simplistic to the hardened music people,it's actually a tantalizing paradox embracing at least one powerful truth and myth.
    The truth is the more surprising element,but its is supported by experience.If you like a piece of music enough,it will be enjoyable no matter what you listen on.You don't need a ProTools or hi-rez recording equipment to set your feet tapping.Come to that,you dont need any procured equipment at all-the mind is the ultimate storage and playback system,capable of infinitely subtle filtering and editing.Can you hum along to it?Try stopping yourself.
     The myth is that the natural "fidelity" of your ears affects your ability to appreciate music- severe hearing impairment notwithstanding.We don't listen with our ears,we listen with our minds and our emotions.How much we hear depend on how much we want to hear.It's reliant on any number of factors,from immediate environment to mood to natural disposition.Subconciously,we can block out everything but the tune or scrutinize the subltest nuances of musicianship and production.Everyone has a preference somewhere between these two extremes.
         My two cent is- natural is easy to recognise.It does't distract your attention from the music,it is the music.We can all instinctively tell the difference between the realism and artifice.It doesn't require superhuman powers of analysis or hyper-sensitive lug holes,We know what "real" sound like.It surrounds us all the time.Spotting a poor copy requires no effort.It's as simple as that.


Direk



Offline abyssinianson

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #69 on: November 01, 2006, 02:55:57 AM »
Granted, most people in an audience don't care about plugin versus the real 1176 but, as an engineer, I do, and it is my job to deliver the goods to the artist the best that I can. And good songs? Sure, a good song will always be a good song but whether it is done with Pro Tools or not is a matter of subjectivity. In either case, your live ACT should reflect that you are more than a studio person and should be able to deliver live on stage. Also, note this important thing about the process of recording - it involves a process of creativity that requires an idea and the task of translating that idea from a mental perspective into actuality. As a performer, I want my music to be heard the way I hear it in MY head. Whether someone else cares about how it sounds, and whether or not they worry about the fact that I used a real LA-2A versus the plugiin on my UAD is something I don't pay very much attention to or care about until way, way later in the process (post-prod mixing). For the most part, the process of creating a song doesn't involve the audience because the process of producing is something between me, and the medium I am working with. I want my song to sound the best way possible. Can the song sound any less effective if I used cheaper stuff? Maybe - but get this: I am not willing to compromise if I have the means to make the product better, and I sure as hell would want my money's worth from the engineer if I pay them money to record my songs. Wouldn't you want the most for your buck? The process of recording is analogous to painting, something I can relate to since I have been in fine arts for over 20 years, and there is a obvious difference between bad materials and good. I will be the first to lay my b@lls on the line to claim that no artist I know is ever willing to compromise the production of their work with bad materials if they can afford better paints and brushes. The same applies to music production.

Now, can the Phils produce better sounding songs without the aid of PT or Neve or whatever else? Sure. If you think about it, the only things limiting the way song recording quality compares is the A/D converters that is employed to convert your signal into data your DAW can understand. If you master the features of your gear, the playing field is more than fair game nowadays; what you have to do is test the limits of your current equipment to produce music at its very best wthout breaking the bank.

A great example of an album recorded on a budget is Soulstice's debut album "Illusion" off Om Records. That whole album was done on a Digi001, in a warehouse in San Francisco. Yes - a warehouse with concrete walls, and cavernous ceilings; not exactly your acoustic environment eh? But you do what you have to do to get a good recording sound. I later talked to Mei Lwun Yee about the recording process and the only thing they really needed to build to make the process of recording better was a vocal and iso booth out of carpeting, and ply wood to isolate Gina's voice better in the mix. The drums, guitars, and bass were all done in the same booth with bits DI'd through for good measure. I've done something similar in my control room at home to great effect with wool blankets draped around a singer using boom mike stands in a triangle position around the singer. Again, you do what you have to do to get a good recording sound.
ako si mimordz. 友だちからよろしくです!

Offline abyssinianson

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #70 on: November 01, 2006, 03:00:59 AM »
ohh.. btw, regarding this topic. More reason to believe that lack of top notch equip is not to blame for our status in recording,,, www.myspace.com/moulann    she's a friend of mine and her album is done using SW/HW that most decent "home studios" there have.
Theres Hope for the Phil's recording quality!!! woohooo

amen to that.  it's becoming more and more apparent to me that it is in fact a matter of skill (with the technology and equipment we alwready have here in the philippines).  here's another theory.  home recordings probably sound good in the US and other first world countries because their homes are more suitable for recording.  they have higher ceilings, wooden floors and walls, etc.   we have to admit that the room is as important as any studio equipment in the art of home recording.

in any case, there is hope :)


another advantage here is that most of the products you see in mags are available in music stores to try.. meaning.. u can buy it, then if you dont like it return it.. This gives a great opportunity to experience the difference among them.. plus, i must say.. crazy financing deals...  very tempting.. hehe. u gotta love it and hate it at the same time i guess. I believe filipinos are at nature more capable of utilizing their systems at their fullest. One of the biggest recording studios here is called metalworks..  bands like nelly furtado, tea party, etc.. recorded albums there and yes they have million dollar facilities.. but then, a friend of mine recorded an album there.. paid 10K dollars for the whole album..( a fraction of how much Nelly Furtado's budget for her album)... and it sounded like [gooey brown stuff].. im not even exaggerating... i think the point here is when theres too much money involved, these big companies would rather get 2 big name clients paying 100000 each than 20 local bands paying 1000 each.. less effort.. so yeah.. big ups for those dedicated studios out there who still balance the love for music and money.

financing ain't all its cracked out to be because, really, you are just getting anywhere between 6-1 year of no interest payments. If you know your sales people well enough, you could work out a better deal by paying either cash and byassing the finance deal because you can haggle a better price UNDER the cost you would accrue through the finance terms which bases its plan on the rate you qualify for. Now, say, you haggle with the guy to buy the item right away, by doing this he gets a chunk of commission and may even knock off tax, or a percentage of the cost of the item if you play your cards right.

@filbot: who engineered your friend's CD? was the engineer the same for big name acts and your friend's CD? in a lot of these cases, you ar epaying big money for the skills behind the decks, not the decks themselves. in your friend's case, the bad sound may be because of the engineer they used, not the equipment he recorded on because machines only process what you pipe through 'em. they don't necessarily spit out good stuff unless you know how to harness their good features...
« Last Edit: November 01, 2006, 03:18:51 AM by abyssinianson »
ako si mimordz. 友だちからよろしくです!

Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #71 on: November 01, 2006, 03:34:41 AM »
ohh.. btw, regarding this topic. More reason to believe that lack of top notch equip is not to blame for our status in recording,,, www.myspace.com/moulann    she's a friend of mine and her album is done using SW/HW that most decent "home studios" there have.
Theres Hope for the Phil's recording quality!!! woohooo

amen to that.  it's becoming more and more apparent to me that it is in fact a matter of skill (with the technology and equipment we alwready have here in the philippines).  here's another theory.  home recordings probably sound good in the US and other first world countries because their homes are more suitable for recording.  they have higher ceilings, wooden floors and walls, etc.   we have to admit that the room is as important as any studio equipment in the art of home recording.

in any case, there is hope :)


another advantage here is that most of the products you see in mags are available in music stores to try.. meaning.. u can buy it, then if you dont like it return it.. This gives a great opportunity to experience the difference among them.. plus, i must say.. crazy financing deals...  very tempting.. hehe. u gotta love it and hate it at the same time i guess. I believe filipinos are at nature more capable of utilizing their systems at their fullest. One of the biggest recording studios here is called metalworks..  bands like nelly furtado, tea party, etc.. recorded albums there and yes they have million dollar facilities.. but then, a friend of mine recorded an album there.. paid 10K dollars for the whole album..( a fraction of how much Nelly Furtado's budget for her album)... and it sounded like [gooey brown stuff].. im not even exaggerating... i think the point here is when theres too much money involved, these big companies would rather get 2 big name clients paying 100000 each than 20 local bands paying 1000 each.. less effort.. so yeah.. big ups for those dedicated studios out there who still balance the love for music and money.

financing ain't all its cracked out to be because, really, you are just getting anywhere between 6-1 year of no interest payments. If you know your sales people well enough, you could work out a better deal by paying either cash and byassing the finance deal because you can haggle a better price UNDER the cost you would accrue through the finance terms which bases its plan on the rate you qualify for. Now, say, you haggle with the guy to buy the item right away, by doing this he gets a chunk of commission and may even knock off tax, or a percentage of the cost of the item if you play your cards right.

@filbot: who engineered your friend's CD? was the engineer the same for big name acts and your friend's CD? in a lot of these cases, you ar epaying big money for the skills behind the decks, not the decks themselves. in your friend's case, the bad sound may be because of the engineer they used, not the equipment he recorded on because machines only process what you pipe through 'em. they don't necessarily spit out good stuff unless you know how to harness their good features...

@ abyss: hey dude.. The engineer that they used in my friend's case is of the same caliber as those who recorded with big names. The studio is called METALWORKS and you can not be working there unless you are known in the industry. It's like Pixar in analogy with animation. check it out  http://www.metalworksstudios.com/



Offline mikep

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #72 on: November 01, 2006, 04:00:16 AM »
I think the success of a mix depends on 4 things 1) the song - should really be a hit, looking at it from all directions, 2) talent - exceptional performance, musicality, music arrangement ability, grasp of the on going or trend; 3) producer - knows what he is doing and knows where he wants to go, so the production process is steered towards the right direction; and 4) studio/engineer/equipment - is able to provide the necessary dependability and flexibility to match the talent and the music/song.  It is important that everyone knows the objective of the project, and that everyone will try to achieve excellence.  With these in place, any music project will succeed.

Can studios here in the Philippines achieve an international sound?  I'd say yes.  But we have to strive harder to get the sound, we have to know the sound and the techniques that go with it - and (most important of all) discard our "puwede na 'yan" attitude.

FWIW
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Offline abyssinianson

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #73 on: November 01, 2006, 05:08:21 AM »
@filbot: if the engineer is of the same skill as the other more reputable guys then I can't imagine why your friend's song would sound bad unless the guy was intentionally not giving the session his full attention. other than this, maybe the recording performances were not as good as you had hoped? i mean, the song AND the performance has a ton to do with the power of a recorded piece.
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Offline filbot

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Re: Why I think we're left behind in the world of recording...
« Reply #74 on: November 01, 2006, 05:51:02 AM »
@filbot: if the engineer is of the same skill as the other more reputable guys then I can't imagine why your friend's song would sound bad unless the guy was intentionally not giving the session his full attention. other than this, maybe the recording performances were not as good as you had hoped? i mean, the song AND the performance has a ton to do with the power of a recorded piece.

I think, money had a lot to do with it.. as ive said, they charge indie bands approx 10000 for an album.. approx,,  but then big names come to them with budgets over 100000 at least. using the same engineers and facilities, they'd rather spend more time on the latter making more bucks than indie bands. its like, hitting 10 birds with a single stone. Im not generalizing this over all the pro studios here but it is a fact.  I get your point too... Thats y i was such in a shock when i heard their album. (its really not that crap but for 10000 bucks... it doesnt translate to what they invested on.