Smacking TUBE AMPS running clean with DIRT PEDALS

[boncram]

are the so-called "nuances" (feel, response, harmonics, etc.) from playing a tube amp CLEAN that apparent AFTER you smack it with a solid-state pedal?

OO. i have drive pedals that are compressed but when i use them with my tube amp they almost lose their compression (although andun pa din talaga espcially if you pair them with uncompressed gain pedals), because the tube amp itself is not "flat" sounding. SS amps are boring. They sound "flat". Kahit JC120 pa yan. WALANG DIMENSION. at yung compressed gain peds sobrang compressed sounding na talaga with SS amps.

Iba pa rin talaga clean ng tube sa SS. Naging kulob at boxy tunog ng SS amp ko simula nung nagka tube ako hence parang ang labo tuloy ng tunog ng drive pedals ko pag sa SS.

so to conclude, hindi lang yung "nuances" ang makukuha mo sa tube. pati ung mismong clean sound talaga hamak iba sa clean sound ng SS.

saka sabi nga nila ang pedals naman tinetest at dinedesign using tube amps diba?

[fraudulentzodiac]

^^ well my solid state amp sounds otherwise.

have you tried a ZT Club 12?

[oliverb]

watching this thread. was sold on buying the cub 10 kaso nadinig ko yung demo nung stagg 60w SS, now i'm torn

[boncram]

^^ well my solid state amp sounds otherwise.

have you tried a ZT Club 12?

hindi pa. ok so i generalised mahal ba yang ZT Club 12?

[fraudulentzodiac]

hindi pa. ok so i generalised mahal ba yang ZT Club 12?

hehe it's cool bro, compared to a tube amp with similar output (whatever tube watt matches 200 watts of solid state) I think it's considerably cheap. It goes for 25K brand new if you get it locally, I'm sure it's cheaper abroad.

afaik, ZT designed their amps to somehow capture the desirable aspects of tube amps, and making them more portable and less hassle (in terms of maintenance and durability).

[lenpopz]

watching this thread. was sold on buying the cub 10 kaso nadinig ko yung demo nung stagg 60w SS, now i'm torn

Same here. 

[teleclem]

I have to say that I've gotten the best results by using a tube amp on the verge of break-up and slamming it with a very responsive & transparent (meaning it keeps the sound of your guitar and amp) od. It has to be a pretty good od though. It depends sa od, imo. Some don't sound that great talaga, kahit tube amp gamit mo. Unless it's new year's eve, it's gonna be hard to crank your amp hard.

When it comes to a very clean amp though.. everyone points to the Suhr Riot. High gain nga lang talaga.

[maxi_musikero]

OO. i have drive pedals that are compressed but when i use them with my tube amp they almost lose their compression (although andun pa din talaga espcially if you pair them with uncompressed gain pedals), because the tube amp itself is not "flat" sounding. SS amps are boring. They sound "flat". Kahit JC120 pa yan. WALANG DIMENSION. at yung compressed gain peds sobrang compressed sounding na talaga with SS amps.

Iba pa rin talaga clean ng tube sa SS. Naging kulob at boxy tunog ng SS amp ko simula nung nagka tube ako hence parang ang labo tuloy ng tunog ng drive pedals ko pag sa SS.

so to conclude, hindi lang yung "nuances" ang makukuha mo sa tube. pati ung mismong clean sound talaga hamak iba sa clean sound ng SS.

saka sabi nga nila ang pedals naman tinetest at dinedesign using tube amps diba?

let's not turn this into a tube vs SS word war bro. 

but good inputs i'm sure gotten from experience.  but would the tube amps break up the clean tone when the tubes get hot?  sorry for the noob question since i have yet to own a tube amp.  thanks in advance! 

[r_chino18]

let's not turn this into a tube vs SS word war bro. 

but good inputs i'm sure gotten from experience.  but would the tube amps break up the clean tone when the tubes get hot?  sorry for the noob question since i have yet to own a tube amp.  thanks in advance! 

For single channel tube amps, maybe. For two channel tube amps, not much. Perhaps pag lang sobrang lakas ng volume ng clean channel at magcclip na yung tube. Pero it can be changed by swapping out with a different preamp tube which handles clean sounds better. 

In my experience, when the tubes get hot, mas gumaganda ang drive/dirt sounds.

[maxi_musikero]

For single channel tube amps, maybe. For two channel tube amps, not much. Perhaps pag lang sobrang lakas ng volume ng clean channel at magcclip na yung tube. Pero it can be changed by swapping out with a different preamp tube which handles clean sounds better. 

thanks man!  am i right in saying i need a preamp tube with more headroom for clean tones?  can you suggest some brands? 

In my experience, when the tubes get hot, mas gumaganda ang drive/dirt sounds.

yeah, this is what i know as well.  heard it from jmorrero's Dxmble modded Fender Concert amp.

[mikki_blinkme]

lalo tuloy akong naglalaway sa tube 

[fraudulentzodiac]

thanks man!  am i right in saying i need a preamp tube with more headroom for clean tones?  can you suggest some brands? 

Silverface fender tube amps bro, lalo na twin reverb or dual showman reverb. you will go way past gig levels before you experience overdrive.

[r_chino18]

thanks man!  am i right in saying i need a preamp tube with more headroom for clean tones?  can you suggest some brands? 

yeah, this is what i know as well.  heard it from jmorrero's Dxmble modded Fender Concert amp.

Not really an expert on the different brands say of 12AX7 preamp tubes. I think spankyrigor has a thread on that one. My amp's preamp has 3 tubes in them. One for clean, the other for overdrive, and the last as a phase inverter ( i dunno what it really is). Pero from what I've read, Tung-sols are good tubes when it comes to clean stuff. Mullards are also great for cleans, better than Tung-sols. Pero for the price, Tung-sols are hard to beat.   Then JJ for the OD is fine.
I dunno with other tubes though. I'm basing this also for my Classic 30. Dunno pagdating sa preamp tubes ng fender.

[BAMF]

Not really an expert on the different brands say of 12AX7 preamp tubes. I think spankyrigor has a thread on that one. My amp's preamp has 3 tubes in them. One for clean, the other for overdrive, and the last as a phase inverter ( i dunno what it really is). Pero from what I've read, Tung-sols are good tubes when it comes to clean stuff. Mullards are also great for cleans, better than Tung-sols. Pero for the price, Tung-sols are hard to beat.  Then JJ for the OD is fine.
I dunno with other tubes though. I'm basing this also for my Classic 30. Dunno pagdating sa preamp tubes ng fender.

Don't forget the Shuguang and Valve Art tubes. They may be cheaper, but the bang for buck is quite good.

Double-mica insulator pa ang Shuguang tubes na nabili ko. Military spec yun a.

[Letour]

Is this straight to amp? If so, what were your EQ settings?

[william251082]

Noodling on Gibson ES335 --> monster cable --> zendrive --> EHX memory toy --> hardwire Reverb --> fender pro junior and vox nighttrain on a line 6 12" cabinet

[maxi_musikero]

Silverface fender tube amps bro, lalo na twin reverb or dual showman reverb. you will go way past gig levels before you experience overdrive.

hey thanks bro!  but i don't think i'll be getting a big tube amp.  i'd prefer something that's portable but big and loud enough to hold it's own over a drummer in practice.  i have 2 specific amps in mind:  fender blues jr and vox nighttrain. 

Not really an expert on the different brands say of 12AX7 preamp tubes. I think spankyrigor has a thread on that one. My amp's preamp has 3 tubes in them. One for clean, the other for overdrive, and the last as a phase inverter ( i dunno what it really is). Pero from what I've read, Tung-sols are good tubes when it comes to clean stuff. Mullards are also great for cleans, better than Tung-sols. Pero for the price, Tung-sols are hard to beat.  Then JJ for the OD is fine.
I dunno with other tubes though. I'm basing this also for my Classic 30. Dunno pagdating sa preamp tubes ng fender.

noted bro.  yeah i heard that Tung-sol gives good clean tone with the friendly pricetag.  thanks! 

[fraudulentzodiac]

hey thanks bro!  but i don't think i'll be getting a big tube amp.  i'd prefer something that's portable but big and loud enough to hold it's own over a drummer in practice.  i have 2 specific amps in mind:  fender blues jr and vox nighttrain. 

hehe bro, incidentally I had both before. I tried using the Blues Jr. before at a jam at Kublai's Katipunan, I cranked the amp to 100%, still can't be heard over the drummer. We were jamming over some classic rock songs and blues back then. I ended up mic'ing it na lang.

The NT I was not able to bring to any jam or gig, but ever since that Blues Jr experience, I always said that if I'm getting a tube amp for gigs and jams, I'd better go 25W or more or else I'll have to mic the amp. anyway, with 100W of all tube I guess you can't go wrong with that, plus a lot of headroom for clean.

[william251082]

hehe bro, incidentally I had both before. I tried using the Blues Jr. before at a jam at Kublai's Katipunan, I cranked the amp to 100%, still can't be heard over the drummer. We were jamming over some classic rock songs and blues back then. I ended up mic'ing it na lang.

The NT I was not able to bring to any jam or gig, but ever since that Blues Jr experience, I always said that if I'm getting a tube amp for gigs and jams, I'd better go 25W or more or else I'll have to mic the amp. anyway, with 100W of all tube I guess you can't go wrong with that, plus a lot of headroom for clean.

Hindi ka marining nung na-crank up mo yung blues jr? rock blues lang ang tugtugan hindi metal? ang lakas naman niyang banda na yan, hindi ba sapawan ng volume na yata yung nangyayari dun o baka pangit yung sound sa venue?

[fraudulentzodiac]

Hindi ka marining nung na-crank up mo yung blues jr? rock blues lang ang tugtugan hindi metal? ang lakas naman niyang banda na yan, hindi ba sapawan ng volume na yata yung nangyayari dun o baka pangit yung sound sa venue?

the acoustics of the venue weren't that great, and I was competing with two fender cyber twins and a very loud drummer. although whenever I gigged, di talaga kaya ng 15W yung banda ko, and we play classic rock and some pink floyd. the amp is audible, but overall can't be "heard".

[william251082]

the acoustics of the venue weren't that great, and I was competing with two fender cyber twins and a very loud drummer. although whenever I gigged, di talaga kaya ng 15W yung banda ko, and we play classic rock and some pink floyd. the amp is audible, but overall can't be "heard".

Oh ok, anong balak mong alternative sa blues jr mo? twin reverb maybe?

[fraudulentzodiac]

Oh ok, anong balak mong alternative sa blues jr mo? twin reverb maybe?

hehe, I sold that blues jr 3 years ago. I now bring a ZT Club 12 to gigs and jams. much smaller and lighter than the blues jr.

I also had both a Silverface twin reverb and dual showman reverb converted to 2X12 combo before, I was stupid to trade/sell them away because I thought they were too big for me but now I miss the tone I was getting from them before.

[Red_Strat]

Is it still a wise investment to purchase a tube amp if you're just gonna run it clean and use a bunch of OD / Distortion pedals to achieve your dirty tone?

I was thinking about this when I was about to purchase a new amp for home/bedroom/small jams. I was pretty much decide on getting a Vox Pathfinder (great SS amp btw), but a friend told me to try out the new Laney Cub10 first.
It didn't make sense to me either.. what's the use of a tube amp if I'm gonna use pedals for my dirty tones?

The moment I plugged in, I instantly felt the difference. Of course, I heard the difference too.. but then again my old amp was cr*p. It just felt easier for me to coax good tones.. and my dirt pedals felt/reacted/sounded better to match. With those conditions, tube was the way to go for me.

I set my tube amp to a clean setting, but it'll overdrive a bit if I hit the strings harder. I think it's that kind of amp setting that helps make dirt pedals sound better.

[leech]

I set my tube amp to a clean setting, but it'll overdrive a bit if I hit the strings harder. I think it's that kind of amp setting that helps make dirt pedals sound better.

^^THIS.

[Taoistguitarist]

i recently got meself a tube amp with a nice clean tone.    and although the drive channel of this amp really rocks, i prefer the sound of the clean channel and my dirt pedal. less hassle pa for me as i won't  have to use the send/return option if i use the drive channel of the amp if i use modulation effects.

But the best way is to try out your pedals on a nice tube amp's clean channel and compare it with the drive channel. Whatever floats your boat.