True Acoustic Tone

[farseer]

alin

[strummer]

i've developed a slight fetish on spanish guitars lately

lecheng housemate. heheh.

he's got a cordoba spanish guitar, equipped with good strings and i must say that's my benchmark for nylon stringed acoustics as of now.

spruce-rosewood combo, plus wood bindings did it very well. sabi nga it' made of 5 different woods, bone nut and saddle...

nga pala fingering style din very essential sa pagpapalabas ng acoustic tone. pramis!

my housemate was scolded a lot of times because of his technique, sanay kasi sa electric umaangat agad yung fingers kya nawawala yung sustain ng notes.

maybe someone could shed light on the prescribed fingering, strumming and plucking techniques on acoustics.

[AngstRidden]

Farseer, ganda tlga ng mga gitara mo..i can almost hear their piano like sounds

Strummer, wla ako idea dyan, sori..

Question lng po, is there really a difference kpag solid top yung acoustic mo compared to a laminated one? I know that the top is responsible for the greater part of the guitar's sound but is there a big diff kpag solid top pro laminated back and sides nmn or marketing scheme lng nila yan? tnx po. This is a nice thread 

[deltaslim]

Just got this... Morris F-20 OM-style guitar w/ abalone inlays, rosewood back and sides. 

We had a nice dinner in my hotel room first...


... before I banged her good and hard.   Here she is resting... can you see the afterglow? 

[dantuts]

alin

yung mga pics ng acoustic.. 

anyway, ganda talaga.. sana maka test ako nyan.

[dantuts]

Just got this... Morris F-20 OM-style guitar w/ abalone inlays, rosewood back and sides. 

We had a nice dinner in my hotel room first...


... before I banged her good and hard.   Here she is resting... can you see the afterglow? 

ayos... parang mas small-bodied sya compared sa dreadnaught.

anong age nyan ?

[deltaslim]

ayos... parang mas small-bodied sya compared sa dreadnaught.

anong age nyan ?

yes, dan. smaller in width and depth ito, and sexier, than a dread.  better balance betw highs and lows and more mids than a dread.  a fingerpicker's dream gtr. it was made in 1975.

just dropped it off at arie's for a thorough once-over... he is impressed. 

[farseer]

Nice OM style guitar... nakakamiss na yun mga maliliit na acoustic... lalo na yun tightness ng tunog... most of my acoustics are dreds/jumbo... isa nalang ang grand concert style ko

[farseer]

alin

yung mga pics ng acoustic.. 

anyway, ganda talaga.. sana maka test ako nyan.

Hehe,,, 

[farseer]

Farseer, ganda tlga ng mga gitara mo..i can almost hear their piano like sounds

Strummer, wla ako idea dyan, sori..

Question lng po, is there really a difference kpag solid top yung acoustic mo compared to a laminated one? I know that the top is responsible for the greater part of the guitar's sound but is there a big diff kpag solid top pro laminated back and sides nmn or marketing scheme lng nila yan? tnx po. This is a nice thread 

tnx... nakakagulat yun mga old guilds ang mas may piano tone...
iba talaga yun mga high end acoustics w/ an almost all solid wood construction, galing din ako sa mga mij laminates, or solid top lang... iba yun vibration, woodiness, etc....

[kawal]

^anak ng tokwa sir farseer, ang ganda ng mga gitara mo, lalu na yung 57 tele pati yung custom tele. meron ka bang pre-war na Martin??? elibs nako sayo pag meron... hehe. more power! 

[farseer]

walang pre war martin.... but thats on my wish list.... im eyeing a 60's martin right now, ayaw pa ibenta e

[GGBR]

as per sir deltaslim's suggestion in the other thread. let's discuss everything acoustic in this thread. what's a good sounding acoustic for you? what shapes the tones of acoustic guitars eg. body type, wood type, strings, etc. and if anyone can post clips, that would be more than welcome. and what's the best recorded acoustic sound you've heard.

for me, i think i have "decent" acoustic guitars naman at the least. both dreadnoughts. i'll try to
post clips of them pag naka-record ako, both acoustic and amplified.

for me the best recorded acoustic sound i've heard would be in john mayer's album, no room for squares.

nicest acoustic i've tried so far was the martin om-21 in tomlee hongkong.

my dream acoustic guitar is a martin om-28v, though i can settle for a blueridge br-263, hehe.

i have a jasmine s80s equipped with l.r. baggs ribbon transducer running through the l.r. baggs para acoustic d.i. and my other acoustic is a 1975 morris w-15.

Hi K!

If you are looking for REAL good acoustic guitars, while the factory made ones by known makes (i.e. Martin, Taylor, Breedlove, Bourgoise, Larrivee, Guild) are of quality (I have tried China/Korean ones which EQUAL and EVEN SURPASS US-made), I know that many acoustic purist players (finger pickers) such as Peter Finger, Laurence Juber, Doug Smith,  Al Petteway, Ed Gerhard, Doyle Dykes (Taylor endorser), Doug Lee go to the known 'private' luthiers such as James Goodall, Froggy Bottom, Kevin Ryan, Linda Manzer, Kathy Wiengert, Cumpiano, McIlroy, Ervin Somogy, Collings, Rick Turner. Jim Olsen (maker for his endroser - James Taylor)

Check out Gryphon Stringed Intruments shop, they are in the neighborhood of Palo Alto. They are well-respected among the luthiers and acoustic (purists) players in Northern CA (and I believe in the US). They have on their team Frank Ford (a VERY respected luthier) who specializes in repair and I am not certain if Dan Erlewine works with them as well (or does he full time with StewMac?). Their salemen are also acomplished guitar players who gig around the bay area. Gryphon was borne of  guitar passion.

Of course the factory ones turn out hundreds (thousands each month) but a luthier will always be biased to 'hand-made' vis-a-vis CNCed guitars. Factors that are still keeping private luthiers alive are:
1) They hand pick the raw materials - specifically tone woods, they check on the age and origins as well as actually "tap" the raw wood (possibly in billet form as yet) for "Q" factor, quarter-sawness, grain runout, knots and annular rings.
While the sonic characteristics of the tonewoods are of their primary concern, the aesthetic appearance also comes as another price-pushing factor. Hence 4-5As ratings (due to aesthetics) are pricier than wood of equal or even better sonic properties.
2) They age their 'stash'; only 5% or less of candidate logs are useful to these luthiers, hence...the price of their picks are high. SO??? HOW DO YOU GET GOOD WOOD FOR FACTORIES THAT CHURN OUT THOUSANDS?
3) Of course the sound of their guitars ARE WAY WAY WAY ahead of factory produced ones; consider the tapping, tapping, tapping from the saw mills all the way to the planning, bracing, voicing and laquering of their babies;
4) A GOOD guitar will take 8 months to two years to produce (hand-made of course); just as a Steinway takes at least a year (or was it 18 months) to come through their Long Island factory (I had an occasion to visit their production back in '93:-)
5) Private luthiers WILL NOT FINISH using catalyst-based (2-3 part components) PU nor UV-catalysed whilst CHEAPER for a serial production run; luthiers will only use lacquer or the more labor-consuming French (Shellac) finish of old;

It's like asking? Which is better - Seiko or Patek Phillippe?

Another point -

If I say that a combination of Adirondack-Madagascar RW is better than your Sitka Bearclaw-Flamed Koa. Or a German Spruce - Cocobolo body vs Adirondack - Honduran Mahogany? Or even Adirondack - Braz RW vs. German Spruce - African Blackwood......

Bottomline..... your personal 'taste' will always be the final say.


Eat a meal less each day and get your acoustic 'made'.

P.S. NEVER RELY ON A RECORDING TO EVALUATE THE GUITAR'S SOUND. - REMEMBER ------ PROTOOLS ET AL!! HAVE YOU EVER CHECKED THE RECORDING EQUIPMENT IN THE OTHER ROOM BESIDE THE VENUE WERE U DO P&W?   

[GGBR]

Hey,

Just curious, how will you know if your guitar is solid top? I have a morris from japan. I am thinking of getting a pickup for it. What do you guys suggest?

like make-silip the edge of the soundhole, if you see layers, then it's laminate. if there aren't layers, it's solid top.

as for the pickup, best for me is L.R. baggs, hehe. i've tried, fishman too, ok rin pero mas gusto ko baggs. meron din duncan, pero i haven't tried it yet. i think seymour duncan lang available dito.

TRY K & K western (mini) for steel or classic for nylons.
Highlanders IPs are of hi acclaim among the acoustic players.
Then there's the B-band from Finland.

[Kulas]

very informative sir GGBR, hehe.

it's very fascinating how so many factors contribute to the overall tone of a guitar, i like the purity of acoustics. no pickups, no effects to color the tone, what you see is what you get. maybe on sunday i can go acoustic, depending on the song lineup.

nope i haven't seen the recording setup in the other room. though i'd love to be part of the editing in the show tito B will produce, hehe. editing and filmmaking is my second love, hehe.

[GGBR]

very informative sir GGBR, hehe.

it's very fascinating how so many factors contribute to the overall tone of a guitar, i like the purity of acoustics. no pickups, no effects to color the tone, what you see is what you get. maybe on sunday i can go acoustic, depending on the song lineup.

nope i haven't seen the recording setup in the other room. though i'd love to be part of the editing in the show tito B will produce, hehe. editing and filmmaking is my second love, hehe.

LET ME KNOW, I WILL BRING MY PREAMP MADE BY THE DESIGNER OF SWRs. THERE'S NO ACOUSTIC AMP OVER THERE.

[Poundcake]

hello GGBR, i just read your LONG post. it's very informative. thanks for posting! the other people here will surely benefit from it

[GGBR]

very informative sir GGBR, hehe.

it's very fascinating how so many factors contribute to the overall tone of a guitar, i like the purity of acoustics. no pickups, no effects to color the tone, what you see is what you get. maybe on sunday i can go acoustic, depending on the song lineup.

nope i haven't seen the recording setup in the other room. though i'd love to be part of the editing in the show tito B will produce, hehe. editing and filmmaking is my second love, hehe.

I SAW THE NEW EQPIUMENT FOR THAT LAST SUNDAY. HE SHOWED ME WHILE YOU WERE ALL ON THE TABLE. THE BAND ROOM WAS MADE SMALLER TO GIVE WAY TO THE EDIT EQUIPMENT. THERE ARE ACTUALLY SEVERAL G5s IN THE OTHER ROOM WHICH ARE PRACTICALLY UNUSED. IT'S ONLY JIM THAT WORKS ON ONE G5 WITH PROTOOLS IF AND WHEN HE HAS AUDIO MIXED/MASTERING TO DO. OTHERWISE...WALANG GUMAGAMIT NG MGA G5s. IF I AM NOT MISTAKEN, I SAW AT LEAST 3-4?

[GGBR]

very informative sir GGBR, hehe.

it's very fascinating how so many factors contribute to the overall tone of a guitar, i like the purity of acoustics. no pickups, no effects to color the tone, what you see is what you get. maybe on sunday i can go acoustic, depending on the song lineup.

nope i haven't seen the recording setup in the other room. though i'd love to be part of the editing in the show tito B will produce, hehe. editing and filmmaking is my second love, hehe.

NGA PALA K!!  REMEMBER THAT TO THESE MASTER CRAFTSMEN - LUTHIERS, THIS IS CRAFT+ART+SOUND NA!

THESE MASTERS MAKE THEIR CRAFT SOMETHING VERY PERSONAL NA....IT'S ACTUALLY MORE OF AN ART TO THEM.. PASSION + CRAFTSMANSHIP + ARTISTRY + AURAL EXCITATION - he he he

[Kulas]

very informative sir GGBR, hehe.

it's very fascinating how so many factors contribute to the overall tone of a guitar, i like the purity of acoustics. no pickups, no effects to color the tone, what you see is what you get. maybe on sunday i can go acoustic, depending on the song lineup.

nope i haven't seen the recording setup in the other room. though i'd love to be part of the editing in the show tito B will produce, hehe. editing and filmmaking is my second love, hehe.

I SAW THE NEW EQPIUMENT FOR THAT LAST SUNDAY. HE SHOWED ME WHILE YOU WERE ALL ON THE TABLE. THE BAND ROOM WAS MADE SMALLER TO GIVE WAY TO THE EDIT EQUIPMENT. THERE ARE ACTUALLY SEVERAL G5s IN THE OTHER ROOM WHICH ARE PRACTICALLY UNUSED. IT'S ONLY JIM THAT WORKS ON ONE G5 WITH PROTOOLS IF AND WHEN HE HAS AUDIO MIXED/MASTERING TO DO. OTHERWISE...WALANG GUMAGAMIT NG MGA G5s. IF I AM NOT MISTAKEN, I SAW AT LEAST 3-4?

nice nice, very nice. we also use G5's at the office. very powerful. yeah, i'd have to see those on sunday, hehe.

[GGBR]

POUND & K,

Here's an acoustic archtop; hand-made; solid spruce top (don't know if its' Sitka or Engelmann); edge bound with flame maple; sides & back flame maple with paua inlay's, scratch plate, bridge are Gabon Ebony with paua inlays; fingerboards, headplates are paua inlaid & bound; neck is maple as well;

Again, this is a master luthier's workmanship. Just from the photo (taken in his house in West LA) you can already see the level of workmanship that this Django-inspired piece exudes. Archtops are usually higher priced than acoustic flatops; some tops are hand-carved from a single solid piece of spruce or maple. Archtops must have been violin-inspired.







paua inlays on the back with a honey (tobaco?) color








HAND-MADE OR FACTORY CHURNED??

[GGBR]

Pound & K,

Note the bridge design!

[Kulas]

very nice... very very nice... hehehe.

[farseer]

POUND & K,

Here's an acoustic archtop; hand-made; solid spruce top (don't know if its' Sitka or Engelmann); edge bound with flame maple; sides & back flame maple with paua inlay's, scratch plate, bridge are Gabon Ebony with paua inlays; fingerboards, headplates are paua inlaid & bound; neck is maple as well;

Again, this is a master luthier's workmanship. Just from the photo (taken in his house in West LA) you can already see the level of workmanship that this Django-inspired piece exudes. Archtops are usually higher priced than acoustic flatops; some tops are hand-carved from a single solid piece of spruce or maple. Archtops must have been violin-inspired.









paua inlays on the back with a honey (tobaco?) color








HAND-MADE OR FACTORY CHURNED??

WOW!!! parang cnc, lupet ng craftsmanship
magkano kaya???

[GGBR]

My guess is upwards na ito ng $5.5K. I had an acoustic made by him and it is not as intricately inlaid and its below this amount, so baka medyo even higher than $6 ito! And deifinitely a lot of the master luthiers create guitars that would look like they were 'CNCed' - Olson, Ryan, Manzer, Cumpiano, Somogy, Froggy B, Goodall, Colling McCullom, Lowden et al. Their pieces are master-crafted, which is why it takes at the very least 6-8month to produce. I believe that most of them are plus 1 year. The would turn up their noses if you mentioned 'CNC' . My lutheir said that CNCed guitar "have no soul!!", sabi nya factory-made are terrible!, ha ha ha. He is often in China designing and teach 'the idiots' (sabi nya!) who don;t know how to make guitars. He designe the well-rated SX (Essex?) brand.  (sa atin atin an lang ito haah, baka umabot sa PRC, he he).  I would think that the pride and heart of master-lutheiry would definitely be reflected in the product as well as the aural experience that you go thru"