TALK @ PhilMusic.com - The Online Home of the Pinoy Musician
The Musician Forums => Guitar Central => Topic started by: ice.lacsina on August 21, 2007, 11:09:49 AM
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We all know that every amplifier has got their own flavors: fender amps have that bright tone, marshalls have that classic rock sound. I go to different small and medium sized venues at kung anong amp meron dun, yun ang ginagamit ko in which most are 30 to 65 watt amps. And most of the time, I spend lotsa time just tweaking and tweaking just to get the tone that i want. I've used Marshalls and Fenders pero until now, I still haven't found the right amp for me. I just want to know if you experience the same or if you've found the right amplifier for your tonal flavors. If you do, anong amps yun at anong settings ang favorites nyo. Thanks!
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We all know that every amplifier has got their own flavors: fender amps have that bright tone, marshalls have that classic rock sound. I go to different small and medium sized venues at kung anong amp meron dun, yun ang ginagamit ko in which most are 30 to 65 watt amps. And most of the time, I spend lotsa time just tweaking and tweaking just to get the tone that i want. I've used Marshalls and Fenders pero until now, I still haven't found the right amp for me. I just want to know if you experience the same or if you've found the right amplifier for your tonal flavors. If you do, anong amps yun at anong settings ang favorites nyo. Thanks!
Unless you play one very specific style of music, there is no one "right amp". You'll never stop searching if you think there is. And even if you did play one specific style of music, your ideal tone from the amp might eventually evolve because your music is also evolving.
Actually, you almost answered your own question. Like guitars, various amps have different sounds. Determine what each is good for and use them when appropriate. Think of them as tools for certain jobs. If you insist on using the wrong tool, you can't expect to do the job as well or as painlessly as with the right tool.
But if you really want to stick to one amp (tool), you'll have to make sure that you can replicate the situation in which it works best. That means using the same gtrs, effects, cables, and the same type of room characteristics, noise, and other related factors to your sound as heard by you and the audience.
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marshall! -- fenders are not versatile enough! :-(
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XXXX! -- XXXX are not versatile enough! :-(
Same argument from Fender users.
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For the utmost in flexibility and combined with good tone I would recommend a Diezel Herbert. Also, if you can afford, have a great collection of amps. Your timbre preferences may evolve overtime but a good sounding amp with character NEVER loses its value in ANY style of music.
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ako din parang everytime na nagtry try ako ng amp gusto ko lagi yung tunog dahil kaya bago sa pandinig ko? =)
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Unless you play one very specific style of music, there is no one "right amp". You'll never stop searching if you think there is. And even if you did play one specific style of music, your ideal tone from the amp might eventually evolve because your music is also evolving.
Actually, you almost answered your own question. Like guitars, various amps have different sounds. Determine what each is good for and use them when appropriate. Think of them as tools for certain jobs. If you insist on using the wrong tool, you can't expect to do the job as well or as painlessly as with the right tool.
But if you really want to stick to one amp (tool), you'll have to make sure that you can replicate the situation in which it works best. That means using the same gtrs, effects, cables, and the same type of room characteristics, noise, and other related factors to your sound as heard by you and the audience.
+1 dito sa sagot ni Joric.
I don't think you'll ever find 1 amp that will satisfy you 100% of the time. The more you play the more you'll realize that there is not one amp that will do everything well. Take me for example I like Fender Blackface amps for clean tones and Marshalls for distorted tones. I like to bring my amp/s to gigs. That way hindi ko na kailangan paglaruan yung amp para mahanap yung sweet spot niya.
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I forgot to mention that the Diezel Herbert does not have any sweet spot. At all volume settings it sounds good. It was designed that way. Since its a 3 channel monster, I don't even care about Fender Cleans or Marshall Drive because it has its own voicing that sounds good that wont make you miss a Fender or Marshall in a gig situation. Despite this, I have a bunch of Marshalls for different timbre and Deltaslim is right that amps are different tools for different jobs.
However some amps are still worth keeping more than others because of their character.
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I forgot to mention that the Diezel Herbert does not have any sweet spot. At all volume settings it sounds good. It was designed that way. Since its a 3 channel monster, I don't even care about Fender Cleans or Marshall Drive because it has its own voicing that sounds good that wont make you miss a Fender or Marshall in a gig situation. Despite this, I have a bunch of Marshalls for different timbre and Deltaslim is right that amps are different tools for different jobs.
However some amps are still worth keeping more than others because of their character.
I bet it can do a Dumble tone. :wink:
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I forgot to mention that the Diezel Herbert does not have any sweet spot. At all volume settings it sounds good. It was designed that way.
I think that is because it relies more on the preamp saturation rather than power amp saturation, much like most Mesa amps. Anyway, the Fletcher-Munson curves (equal loudness contours) still apply, which will affect how differently you'd dial in the amp at low volume compared to higher volume.
In response to ice: Unlike your situation, we bring our own amps to gigs. My main amp is Mesa Road King with matching 4x12 cab, no pedals. But still, I get use other amps, usually with pedals. At one point I was even using a rack full of stuff. What I've noticed is that my playing adapts to the rig that I am using. When I am playing through my Mesa rig, no pedals, I generally play tighter and more aggressive. When I am playing through some pedals into a Fender Bassman, I generally play a little looser and a bit less aggressive, more laid back. If I'm playing through a Rivera Quiana, no pedals, I am somewhere in between, leaning slightly to how I would play if it were the Bassman. I guess that over time, I subconsciously learned how to adjust, or adapt, my playing style to make the best of the difference each of the rigs have to offer. I very rarely have to change the settings. But if I have to, I always start with the amp, tone controls set at 12 o'clock, then go from there.
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We all know that every amplifier has got their own flavors: fender amps have that bright tone, marshalls have that classic rock sound. I go to different small and medium sized venues at kung anong amp meron dun, yun ang ginagamit ko in which most are 30 to 65 watt amps. And most of the time, I spend lotsa time just tweaking and tweaking just to get the tone that i want. I've used Marshalls and Fenders pero until now, I still haven't found the right amp for me. I just want to know if you experience the same or if you've found the right amplifier for your tonal flavors. If you do, anong amps yun at anong settings ang favorites nyo. Thanks!
I found ONE of my amp that I'm gonna keep for a very long time.
It's a Brown Note D lite (Dumble Lite) obvsiously the topology of the amp is the Dumble amp.
Brown Note is the counterpart of Fuchs .... Brown Note @ west coast and Fuchs @ east coast.
Favorite Setting:
Preamp:
Volume = 2 o clock
EQ = 12 o clock
OD :
Gain: 10 o clock
volume : 12 oclock
Master:
for bedroom levels : .75 to 2
Presence : 12 o clock
My other amp is a Carvin Legacy.... I know I'm gonna sell and get another amp....it's nice...but I know there's another nicer one out there. I'm also eyeing on an Allen Encore amp for my Fender clean fetish. Topology of the amp is based on the Vibrolux. I'm not really a pedal guy....I don't really rely on my pedals for my sound (like Satch) ....I'm more of an amp guy.... guitar plugged to the amp.
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Phil,
Someone suggest that I use the Channel 2 of the Herbert to approximate the overdrive channel of a Two Rock Custom Signature Reverb. Never heard one so I would not know how to get that tone from the Herbert.
I know about the Fletcher Munson effect and thats why I endorse the Herbert for flexibility because its tone controls are powerfull enough to tweak at each volume level and still retain its character at any volume.
I can vouch for it bedroom level. Arie can vouch for it small club gig level against a dimed 1x12 and I think Wally G. had fun playing with it at loud levels. And thats only for the clean channel!!!
Ubersam,
Agree with you on your points. But for me it really does not matter how each amp gets its own unique voice going. I just buy and try. If I like it. I keep it and forget about how its done.
+1 -- my playing adapts to every different gear. The good sounding gear seems to suggest to the player how to play. I sound different thru my Vox AC30 and thru my Herbert but both have the same character. Go figure.
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There is no "right" amp, but what I can say for sure, there is always a "wrong" amp.
Each amp has its own voice, its own behavior, and for some, even the looks matter. But for me, the right amp means an amp that can respond best to my playing style with the least processing (i.e. no compression or OD pedals) and at the same time can nail the timbre I want, that cuts through any volume scenario... and it should also work well in a given musical situation. You won't use a Bogner Uberschall for Jazz, you know, in the sense that you can go for a Fuchs or a nice Fender Blackface instead.
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@Sir Joric: - I agree on what you said about how our tastes evolve and how different amps have their own tone. But i guess I'm the guy who would stick to one amp since the affordability always counts on my measure. Maybe I should rephrase it from "the right amp" to "the versatile amp".
@Sir Alex - I really like how you describe the versatility of your Herbert. I've heard and read reviews about it and they are all good. But same with the VOX AC30, I would also love your Herbert if I only had lots of $$$$$$$$. :-D Sorry, but I forgot to include the affordability. hehe.
@Sir Phil - I'm not really a pedal guy....I don't really rely on my pedals for my sound (like Satch) ....I'm more of an amp guy.... guitar plugged to the amp.
Same here - I mostly set up simple too, that's why the amp matters to me.
To All: I guess I can split it up to 2:
(This one's for me) Let's see... If we'd stick to one 30 - 65 watter versatile amp, one that would be balanced on both clean and overdriven, regardless of the music you play, or the brand, what would it be?
(and this one's for the sake of everyone so that flames wont be burning in this thread): Let's do something like this: "I play jazz and this amp suits me best, etc..." With this everyone can learn through opinions.
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@Sir Joric: - I agree on what you said about how our tastes evolve and how different amps have their own tone. But i guess I'm the guy who would stick to one amp since the affordability always counts on my measure. Maybe I should rephrase it from "the right amp" to "the versatile amp".
Good man. You are a practical guy and so am I. I buy gear in the hope that they work for my style and get a lot of utility (ie, versatile and sounds good for the many musical styles I might play). Otherwise, I sell. Although I do my homework before a purchase, I don't invest a lot of pride or sentimentality in my gear if they aren't working out for me, so I don't mind rolling gear in search of good sounding, high-utility tools.
@Sir Joric: - I agree on what you said about how our tastes evolve and how different amps have their own tone. But i guess I'm the guy who would stick to one amp since the affordability always counts on my measure. Maybe I should rephrase it from "the right amp" to "the versatile amp".
If I were to suggest just one in an affordable price range, I'd say a Peavey Classic 30. Pretty good cleans (mix of Fender/Vox/Marshall) and Marshall OD. Even without a pedal, it covers a lot of ground. Contrary to myth (or lies), I've never dimed it in a gig (anyone who thinks you can dime a C30 for a small club blues gig is either lying or does not know what he's talking about!); it's plenty loud and I've never gone past 12 o clock on the master vol. I've also never had to use 2 boost/OD pedals at the same time for it. It's got a good basic sound that just needs a different flavor sometimes depending on the song or passage.
Another option is find an amp with good cleans and use a pedal in front. A good ol' Fender tube/SS or Yamaha amp are great for this purpose. 99 times out of 100, a good player can make that simple setup sound as good as anything for any price, IMO.
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If you play mostly jazz with some variety and want something affordable and reliable and is easy to carry I'd go for a Roland JC-77...
Great over all sound I use it most of the time...
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basta malakas okay na yun, tweak tweak na lang :)
pag mahina there's nothing you can do about it kahit anong adjust pa gawin.
my personal dream amp would be a Full-Stack Marshall Major (200W all tube amp). then play it cranked in a small-ish club, destroying everybody inside who doesn't have enough faith on rakenrol.
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If you play mostly jazz with some variety and want something affordable and reliable and is easy to carry I'd go for a Roland JC-77...
Great over all sound I use it most of the time...
yup, lots of great old rolands too!
Ice,
BTW, the newish Roland Cube 60 is VERY versatile and VERY highly rated. look into it...
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Also, if you can afford, have a great collection of amps. Your timbre preferences may evolve overtime but a good sounding amp with character NEVER loses its value in ANY style of music.
I'm now a believer in this. 'Nuff guitars... amps naman.
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I'm now a believer in this. 'Nuff guitars... amps naman.
PTP only. ... s o s y a l. :mrgreen:
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PTP only. ... s o s y a l. :mrgreen:
PTP? Wat dat?
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PTP? Wat dat?
point to point ... in short ...tao ang masosolder hindi transformer. :evil:
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point to point ... in short ...tao ang masosolder hindi transformer. :evil:
Transformer? More than meets the eye! :-D Corny ako.
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If I were to suggest just one in an affordable price range, I'd say a Peavey Classic 30. Pretty good cleans (mix of Fender/Vox/Marshall) and Marshall OD. Even without a pedal, it covers a lot of ground. Contrary to myth (or lies), I've never dimed it in a gig (anyone who thinks you can dime a C30 for a small club blues gig is either lying or does not know what he's talking about!); it's plenty loud and I've never gone past 12 o clock on the master vol. I've also never had to use 2 boost/OD pedals at the same time for it. It's got a good basic sound that just needs a different flavor sometimes depending on the song or passage.
Another option is find an amp with good cleans and use a pedal in front. A good ol' Fender tube/SS or Yamaha amp are great for this purpose. 99 times out of 100, a good player can make that simple setup sound as good as anything for any price, IMO.
Ooh. A Peavy Classic! I haven't heard or tried it live but i've heard those 15 watt types and i heard some punch even on the cleans, and boosting both highs and lows sounded metal on the OD channel. If the 8 incher is that powerful already, I guess the 12s would be alot better! I can't wait to try that C30. Thanks Sir Joric!
yup, lots of great old rolands too!
Ice,
BTW, the newish Roland Cube 60 is VERY versatile and VERY highly rated. look into it...
The Roland JC Combos are good! But the only JCs I've tried were those 2X12's. I don't know if the smaller ones sound the same.
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basta malakas okay na yun, tweak tweak na lang :)
pag mahina there's nothing you can do about it kahit anong adjust pa gawin.
my personal dream amp would be a Full-Stack Marshall Major (200W all tube amp). then play it cranked in a small-ish club, destroying everybody inside who doesn't have enough faith on rakenrol.
Langyang dream yan... Hahahaha! :evil:
I'm not very picky with amps; I just like it to have a great clean sound with lots of headroom so that my pedals can do their thing. For multi-channel amps, I prefer a crunchy blues/hard rock tone because I'm not really a high-gain metal/thrash guy anymore. I'm into Van Halen/Neal Schon/Michael Landau/Satriani dirty tones :)
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Ooh. A Peavy Classic! I haven't heard or tried it live but i've heard those 15 watt types and i heard some punch even on the cleans, and boosting both highs and lows sounded metal on the OD channel. If the 8 incher is that powerful already, I guess the 12s would be alot better! I can't wait to try that C30. Thanks Sir Joric!
You're referring to the Classic 20 ata. I am familiar with that 2xEL84 combo tone. IMHO, yung C30 is in a different level or class by itself. I'll stop talking. Just try it.
Kung wala ka mahanap, you can try mine at my house in Fairview... just so you know what the fuss is all about.
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Ooh. A Peavy Classic! I haven't heard or tried it live but i've heard those 15 watt types and i heard some punch even on the cleans, and boosting both highs and lows sounded metal on the OD channel. If the 8 incher is that powerful already, I guess the 12s would be alot better! I can't wait to try that C30. Thanks Sir Joric!
The Roland JC Combos are good! But the only JCs I've tried were those 2X12's. I don't know if the smaller ones sound the same.
The Roland JC-77 is a 2X10 amp very nice sounding amp lots of headroom also since it has 70 watts per side ata... I Honestly like this better than the JC-120...
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so sino lamang, si fender o si marshall? :wink:
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so sino lamang, si fender o si marshall? :wink:
eh si Roto amps.
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Skunky,
Wanna bet? You can use the Uberschall's clean channel for Jazz. It is high headroom even if it ain't loud.
Ice,
Unfortunately, as of today, I cannot find a cheaper amp that is as VERSATILE and GOOD SOUNDING as the Herbert at the same time, not too mention back breaking. But a lot of people, normal people who have used Classic 30s have said that the Herbert is worth the dough. Surprisingly. It sounds so good that I just plug straight without any effects at all. Nothing can be more simple than that. Quite a long time ago, some people were comparing a small Royal combo against the Herbert and saying that it produced as good a tone. Now, I don't see anybody giving high praises to that japanese tube amp.
The problem with 20 and 30 watters is that you lose your clean real fast and in any low wattage amp for that matter. Also, low wattage amps cannot reproduce tight bass and sound one dimensional. Some also lack punch and become chewy that you lose pick attack.
For your tight situation, what I suggest is that you find a one channel 50 watt tube combo (nonmaster volume preferred) that does clean very well and just use a bunch of pedals to get your drive. Save up and get one good real tube amp -- sorry for endorsing tube but I really think SS amps are grainy and harsh sounding even with moderate drive and their cleans just do not breathe enough or sound a bit clinical and that goes for Roland JC series -- sorry to all JC fans. I would take my Vox AC30 bright channel at super low volume over the JC. Do not force yourself to try to make do with budget models of the Major Brands. And despite so much praise for the Peavey Classic, after a while, it does not have defined character. Again sorry for dissing Peavey Classic fans. Its just neither there or here for me. My oldest amp a studio Mesa Boogie Studio 22 -- modified with a Celestion Heritage G12M cannot be beat by a classic 20 or classic 30 despite me wanting to own one of the Peavey Classic series which is a much much newer design.
Buying gear and rolling them after a while is great at the start but rolling them one after another is the start of GAS. It shows a lack of clarity of purpose and defined needs. Today, this is how I do homework with amps -- 1) Save up money, 2) Call Ultrasound -- since they know my amps and my specific DEFINED needs and PURPOSE -- I get a recommendation from them, 3) Most of the time they will tell me that there is nothing worth buying given my amps. So, I do not buy. They talked me out of buying a US$6,000 Mad Professor and a US$6,000 Two Rock Custom Reverb Signature which they carry.
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Skunky,
Wanna bet? You can use the Uberschall's clean channel for Jazz. It is high headroom even if it ain't loud.
Ice,
Unfortunately, as of today, I cannot find a cheaper amp that is as VERSATILE and GOOD SOUNDING as the Herbert at the same time, not too mention back breaking. But a lot of people, normal people who have used Classic 30s have said that the Herbert is worth the dough. Surprisingly. It sounds so good that I just plug straight without any effects at all. Nothing can be more simple than that. Quite a long time ago, some people were comparing a small Royal combo against the Herbert and saying that it produced as good a tone. Now, I don't see anybody giving high praises to that japanese tube amp.
The problem with 20 and 30 watters is that you lose your clean real fast and in any low wattage amp for that matter. Also, low wattage amps cannot reproduce tight bass and sound one dimensional. Some also lack punch and become chewy that you lose pick attack.
For your tight situation, what I suggest is that you find a one channel 50 watt tube combo (nonmaster volume preferred) that does clean very well and just use a bunch of pedals to get your drive. Save up and get one good real tube amp -- sorry for endorsing tube but I really think SS amps are grainy and harsh sounding even with moderate drive and their cleans just do not breathe enough or sound a bit clinical and that goes for Roland JC series -- sorry to all JC fans. I would take my Vox AC30 bright channel at super low volume over the JC. Do not force yourself to try to make do with budget models of the Major Brands. And despite so much praise for the Peavey Classic, after a while, it does not have defined character. Again sorry for dissing Peavey Classic fans. Its just neither there or here for me. My oldest amp a studio Mesa Boogie Studio 22 -- modified with a Celestion Heritage G12M cannot be beat by a classic 20 or classic 30 despite me wanting to own one of the Peavey Classic series which is a much much newer design.
Buying gear and rolling them after a while is great at the start but rolling them one after another is the start of GAS. It shows a lack of clarity of purpose and defined needs. Today, this is how I do homework with amps -- 1) Save up money, 2) Call Ultrasound -- since they know my amps and my specific DEFINED needs and PURPOSE -- I get a recommendation from them, 3) Most of the time they will tell me that there is nothing worth buying given my amps. So, I do not buy. They talked me out of buying a US$6,000 Mad Professor and a US$6,000 Two Rock Custom Reverb Signature which they carry.
Yeah say that to the millions of professional musicians that love the Jazz Chorus sound...
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Again sorry for dissing Peavey Classic fans.
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Buying gear and rolling them after a while is great at the start but rolling them one after another is the start of GAS. It shows a lack of clarity of purpose and defined needs.
Yan ang problema... you like dissing people and their buying decisions instead of focusing on the gear. Tsk tsk tsk...
We katutubong orcs-cum-Peavey amp owners-slash-GAS sufferers bow at your feet, o supreme omniscient tone god!
:-D :-D :-D
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.......and a US$6,000 Two Rock Custom Reverb Signature which they carry.
.... real men order DUMBLE amps..... :evil: Two rock is for "Boy Toys wannabe man" :wink:
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.... real men order DUMBLE amps..... :evil: Two rock is for "Boy Toys wannabe man" :wink:
Yun nah nagalit na si Phil hehehe...
Mas type ko nga Dumble grabe tone ni Robben Ford eh....
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Deltaslim,
Its just my opinion and experience so lighten up... Just because millions of musicians love JC does not mean I have to like it right? and that applies to your Peavey Classic 30.
For clarification, the last two statements was meant for you exclusively and not meant to apply to all Peavey Classic owning musicians.
By the way, since when did you become an amp expert? Sabi mo its all in the hands. Ano nangyari sa Trademark 60 mo? Sa Univalve mo? Sa Bassman mo dati? Kaya to all forumites, next time you see Deltaslim play without his Classic 30, sigurado ako nagpa SOFTWARE upgrade ang mga daliri niya kasi siya lang ang alam kung gitarista sa buong mundo na may built-in amp emulator sa daliri.
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Sunog!
Despite the smileys, I say let's let the quotes below pass, for another thread:
Yan ang problema... you like dissing people and their buying decisions instead of focusing on the gear. Tsk tsk tsk...
We katutubong orcs-cum-Peavey amp owners-slash-GAS sufferers bow at your feet, o supreme omniscient tone god!
:-D :-D :-D
For clarification, the last two statements was meant for you exclusively and not meant to apply to all Peavey Classic owning musicians.
By the way, since when did you become an amp expert? Sabi mo its all in the hands. Ano nangyari sa Trademark 60 mo? Sa Univalve mo? Sa Bassman mo dati? Kaya to all forumites, next time you see Deltaslim play without his Classic 30, sigurado ako nagpa SOFTWARE upgrade ang mga daliri niya kasi siya lang ang alam kung gitarista sa buong mundo na may built-in amp emulator sa daliri.
OK?
(Why am I trying to pseudo-moderate? It's because I'm tired of reading posts that sound like children fighting. I've nothing to do at work, so I spend a lot of time in Philmusic, OK?)
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.... real men order DUMBLE amps..... :evil: Two rock is for "Boy Toys wannabe man" :wink:
Hoooyyy... gusto ko magka-Two Rock... :-D Naku, mahahalata na Backstreet Boys fan ako!
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Hoooyyy... gusto ko magka-Two Rock... :-D Naku, mahahalata na Backstreet Boys fan ako!
eto o ... $3K lang... tapos ang daming added features. ... okay to pang bedroom and as amp mo sa Church.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=283136
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eto o ... $3K lang... tapos ang daming added features. ... okay to pang bedroom and as amp mo sa Church.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=283136
wow... looks very veratile. have you tried this? btw, how do you know kung ang amp eh okay pang bedroom volume?
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Also, low wattage amps cannot reproduce tight bass and sound one dimensional. Some also lack punch and become chewy that you lose pick attack.
Hola Mr. A
Not sure I agree with this. I just got a /13 37 watter, and even at like a 4 volume setting, the bass is scary thumping and tight. it doesn't get any louder though past 5/6, although that's when you get more of the breakup. And even if I go half-power, it still rocks.
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Skunky,
Wanna bet? You can use the Uberschall's clean channel for Jazz. It is high headroom even if it ain't loud.
Man I'm not saying your Uber sucks. I just think I'd use it for an application other than Jazz (metal and polka don't you think?) and maybe another amp might deliver much better for cleans. Maybe your Rivera TBR-1 with lush reverb would do the job. And for moi, ultraclean Jazz guitar does not only necessitate headroom... I think you must get an amp that sounds inherently sweet.
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We all know that every amplifier has got their own flavors: fender amps have that bright tone, marshalls have that classic rock sound. I go to different small and medium sized venues at kung anong amp meron dun, yun ang ginagamit ko in which most are 30 to 65 watt amps. And most of the time, I spend lotsa time just tweaking and tweaking just to get the tone that i want. I've used Marshalls and Fenders pero until now, I still haven't found the right amp for me. I just want to know if you experience the same or if you've found the right amplifier for your tonal flavors. If you do, anong amps yun at anong settings ang favorites nyo. Thanks!
As long as it has decent cleans and good volume that about it for me. If thats not the case then there really isn't much I can do but plug in and see what happens :-D
Usually with SS marshalls, I can go almost flat on the eq and then just adjust the volume as I play. For SS fenders, I usually start with the treble on zero and just work my way up looking for the best spot for me. Peavey amps nowadays are easier to use.
Good cleans and volume. I seriously don't care for any other detail.
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Sunog!
Despite the smileys, I say let's let the quotes below pass, for another thread:
OK?
Good idea, but one which doesn't fly in oas' world. If only he didn't have to keep bringing on these side-remarks and negative comments, directly or indirectly, at me.
Let's put this in perspective: Do you know of any other forumite who goes out of his way to diss another forumite about his tone, gear, choices/decisions, and playing? I'm a semi-professional musician trying to make a name for myself and I think this guy has made it his life's mission to put me down. This goes waaaay back, mind you. What a pest.
If this is supposed to be the online home of pinoy musicians, bakit may naninira ng musician dito??? Why put down a fellow musician??? Oh wait, by his own definition, di siya musician... So what the hell is he up to???
(Why am I trying to pseudo-moderate? It's because I'm tired of reading posts that sound like children fighting. I've nothing to do at work, so I spend a lot of time in Philmusic, OK?)
I'm tired too... sick and tired of his attitude, whining, and unprovoked mudslinging. But I'm not going to take anything sitting down from this guy. Internet bully, chicken naman pag totoong challenge.
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wow... looks very veratile. have you tried this? btw, how do you know kung ang amp eh okay pang bedroom volume?
...because this amp is similar to my amp....it's a Dumble clone.
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Skunky,
I am not saying that you are saying that the Uber sucks. I am just saying its clean channel can also be used for jazz. That's all.
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Deltaslim,
1) I don't have a score board footer which for some reason I don't understand why you maintain given that we only both agreed to one challenge and you are so sour grapes about me not accepting your other so called challenges. So why did you accept the original challenge in the first place kung mayroon ka pala mga condition na hindi mo naman sinabi?
2) I have agreed with you on various points in the past. And you have disagreed with me freely with my points of view in the past. So, thats cool.
3) I do not accept that I choose to single you out. In fact, in the past I have fought so many people on this forum because I passionately stand for something that I believe in.
4) There are some points that you post that I simply cannot agree to because I personally believe they are wrong.
5) You are not my life's mission.
6) I have nothing to gain from this because I am not a "semi-professional musician trying to make a name for myself". Since you claim to be a "semi-professional musician", please tell me what song you composed, so I can hear for myself and give an objective review. I promise not to criticize equipment or tone.
7) What mud? Most of the time I just put together your self contradicting statements that come from your various posts in different threads.
8) When it comes to your musicianship, the only thing I have criticized is your equipment and your sometimes inconsiderate volume level. Otherwise, I never criticized your note choice or playing style and was never too particular about it. Even when you criticized yourself on stage "na maraming sabit", I never even noticed it to be that.
9) Even if I do not consider jam whoring strictly as musicianship, I still appreciate your need to be with everybody in their set list. Though I have never heard a jam song ever becoming a hit or being hummed by people or even someone bestowing the JAM KING title on you, you still are cool to listen to.
10) Despite your name calling, I try to exert my maximum effort to answer you in a polite manner.
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Skunky,
I am not saying that you are saying that the Uber sucks. I am just saying its clean channel can also be used for jazz. That's all.
How would you know do you play Jazz?
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How would you know do you play Jazz?
I like fusion more than jazz but I like hollow-bodies.
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for me bottom line is that it should have a lively power amp and the speakers breaks up nice
well at least for the tone im prefering :-D
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I like fusion more than jazz but I like hollow-bodies.
I was asking Firemodel55
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Bluenote,
As I said before, its the character of the amp that matters not its looks. And one characteristic of the Uberschall is a high headroom clean channel. Plus the cleans are kind of stiff which suits jazz runs and chording.
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Bluenote,
As I said before, its the character of the amp that matters not its looks. And one characteristic of the Uberschall is a high headroom clean channel. Plus the cleans are kind of stiff which suits jazz runs and chording.
My question was if you knew how to play jazz...
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No I dont but I know how to get the sound.
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No I dont but I know how to get the sound.
How can you know what sound is needed when you dont even play jazz?
I mean for sure you you havent played through a jazz set and yet here you are giving amp advice to people who can and actually plays jazz...
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How can you know what sound is needed when you dont even play jazz?
I mean for sure you you havent played through a jazz set and yet here you are giving amp advice to people who can and actually plays jazz...
Errrm... you really don't have to play the music (or even be an excellent player at that) to know how to set up things for killer tone. Case in point: Thomas Nordegg who is Steve Vai's tech. He can't play 1/100ths of what Steve can do but he surely knows how to get Steve's tone.
Leo Fender is another one.
Leslie Hammond is another example in the organ world.
Although I agree to some extent that knowing and playing the music helps alot in your gear choices.
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Errrm... you really don't have to play the music (or even be an excellent player at that) to know how to set up things for killer tone. Case in point: Thomas Nordegg who is Steve Vai's tech. He can't play 1/100ths of what Steve can do but he surely knows how to get Steve's tone.
Leo Fender is another one.
Leslie Hammond is another example in the organ world.
Although I agree to some extent that knowing and playing the music helps alot in your gear choices.
As you said Thomas Nordegg is Steve Vai's engineer. Steve Vai dictates what sound he wants and not the other way around. Plus Thomas Nordegg is a pro guitar tech so he knows what he is doing.
Leo Fender was an engineer who teamed up with numerous country musicians to develop his products...
I dont know about you but for me I have to experience things in a practical situation first hand for me to give advice to other people...
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As you said Thomas Nordegg is Steve Vai's engineer. Steve Vai dictates what sound he wants and not the other way around. Plus Thomas Nordegg is a pro guitar tech so he knows what he is doing.
Leo Fender was an engineer who teamed up with numerous country musicians to develop his products...
I dont know about you but for me I have to experience things in a practical situation first hand for me to give advice to other people...
I dunno how valid my comments would be, but do you know that each and every Mesa Boogie Dual or triple Recto that goes out of the factory would go through the hands of some builder/engineer at the factory (forgot his name) who plays Jazz strictly. But he's very good at voicing high gain amps.
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Two-Rock Reverb Signature/ Sterling Signature/ John Mayer Signature
Any of them
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bluenote,
I dont have to know how to play jazz to get the electric guitar timbre for jazz. For example, a jazz player does not need to know how to play death metal to know how to get a death metal sound on his archtop.
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Bluenote,
You seem to have contradicted yourself. You say that Thomas Nordegg knows what he is doing yet he does not play Steve Vai's music. Again, you contradict yourself with Leo Fender who was never a guitar player yet knew how to get a country sound.
But I agree with you that it is best to experience something first BUT not a necessity to be able to give advice. For example, I am assuming you are using a Fender Strat. Just because you have not heard all the good sounding vintage strats does not mean your opinion on Strats is not as important as someone who owns vintage strats. Get the point?
I would just like to make an additional point: Any guitar that sounds good with character no matter what it looks like, will sound good in ANY type of music. Any amp that sounds good and has good character will sound good in ANY type of music. My baker will sound good in any type of music including classical because I have seen and heard different people use it for different styles of music. Even my Marshall Super Lead with some distortion pedals in the front end can do nu metal.
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Bluenote,
You seem to have contradicted yourself. You say that Thomas Nordegg knows what he is doing yet he does not play Steve Vai's music. Again, you contradict yourself with Leo Fender who was never a guitar player yet knew how to get a country sound.
But I agree with you that it is best to experience something first BUT not a necessity to be able to give advice. For example, I am assuming you are using a Fender Strat. Just because you have not heard all the good sounding vintage strats does not mean your opinion on Strats is not as important as someone who owns vintage strats. Get the point?
I would just like to make an additional point: Any guitar that sounds good with character no matter what it looks like, will sound good in ANY type of music. Any amp that sounds good and has good character will sound good in ANY type of music. My baker will sound good in any type of music including classical because I have seen and heard different people use it for different styles of music. Even my Marshall Super Lead with some distortion pedals in the front end can do nu metal.
These people are professionals Thomas Nordegg for example may not play at Vai's level but he is a qulified guitar tech so I believe that he has the authority to say what works and what does'nt...
Leo Fender may never have produced such beautiful gear if he was not aided by pro musicians like Bill Carson on the development of the strat for example. Plus he was a profssional engineer ergo giving him some credit.
So unless you are a musician who knows what an amp feels like when when you personally play through it in a live jazz gig or a sound engineer who knows how things should sound like I suggest you not be so sure of what you say because some people here may also know what they are talking about based on actual personal experience and not just listening to other people playing...
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...one of the reasons why I took the plunge and chose Brown Note because the maker himself is also a gigging guitar player..... so the perfect amp guy is a guy who is also a musician.
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Bluenote,
Let me remind you that skunky was the one who said that the Uberschall would not do well for jazz. Now, I don't know how many dudes have tried an actual uberschall everyday of their lives and I am saying that its clean channel will do well for jazz. And let me point out that you don't have one and yet you insinuate that I cannot say if its suitable for jazz just because I cannot play jazz?
Correspondingly, I will say that you are not in a position to also say that its is NOT suitable for jazz for the plain and simple reason that you have not heard it in person. Whether you play better jazz than me or not, does not put you in a better position to assess because you have not heard and used the equipment by itself of live in band context.
As you said below, Thomas will only follow what Vai says so what does being a qualified guitar tech have anything to do with it if he just follows whatever Steve Vai says? Thats another contradiction for you.
A good sound engineer gave me a piece of good advice. He said for live playing and inspiration, use your amps. If you want quick and painless recording, use a POD. Now, I am sure that he knows what sounds good. But to him things can sound like a POD in the studio and I don't deny that in a total live band mix, things might just sound like POD. But the main message there was I am more knowledgeable about the amps that I own and use than he will ever be and so he leaves it up to me to serve up the inspiration and tone settings from my equipment.
By the way, I don't have to be a musician by any definition to know what an amp feels like. In the same way, there are some musicians who might just play fenders and marshalls their whole life and never touch a single bogner. That does not make them more knowledgeable than me about bogners. Besides some of the amps I have are recommended by Musicians abroad who have more experience than some of the cats here. It does not make then more superior but it does make them more knowledgeable because they are more exposed than majority of musicians here. Its just the way of life.
You play a Strat right? Bill Carson does country right? Assuming I follow your logic, you should be just doing country. But you are doing jazz I guess and possibly some blues and rock. Did Leo and Bill prevent you from playing the Strat for something else other than country? Nope. Did you have to experience playing country the first time to play a Strat? No you did not. Cause I can fault you and say that you are using the Strat in a wrong manner following your logic -- that to know a Strat you have to know how to play country. But you play a strat for some other reason greater than the initial objective of Leo to make a country guitar. And thats what I am saying about good sounding equipment with character, it transcends musical styles.
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By the way, I don't have to be a musician by any definition to know what an amp feels like. In the same way, there are some musicians who might just play fenders and marshalls their whole life and never touch a single bogner. That does not make them more knowledgeable than me about bogners. Besides some of the amps I have are recommended by Musicians abroad who have more experience than some of the cats here. It does not make then more superior but it does make them more knowledgeable because they are more exposed than majority of musicians here. Its just the way of life.
the way of life is this: who would you ask for fishing advice? the hobbyist fisherman who has the best tools money can buy and goes out to fish around 2x a year... or the professional fisherman, who has the [gooey brown stuff] equipment but does it every day of his life? :-)
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the way of life is this: who would you ask for fishing advice? the hobbyist fisherman who has the best tools money can buy and goes out to fish around 2x a year... or the professional fisherman, who has the [gooey brown stuff] equipment but does it every day of his life? :-)
neither.. I would go for the professional fisherman who have been touring all of their lives.... slowly acquiring the best equipment that he can buy ( most of them have really really nice equipment and mind you they are not as rich as "you know who"... simple people with mortage and car payments) .... thats who I'd ask here in the U.S.
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Dudes,
I know how important personal experience plays in determining which equipment sounds good to everyone. For myself, I have mentioned here what is then a hobby is now a passion and as much as there are a lot of talented and experienced musicians here, there are people more talented and experienced beyond these shores. Nowadays, I rely on these people to make equipment decisions for me because they are more exposed and more knowledgeable. For example, before my Baker arrived, I and cliff cultreri were discussing which amp would bring out the best out of the Baker. He said that it should not be a problem and he even suggested that what I felt was sucky sounding clean channel on the Bogner Uberschall was a channel that the Baker could drive. I was skeptical but when the Baker arrived and I plugged in I could get cleans and jazzy sounding stuff.
So who the hell is cliff cultreri? ( I apologize for having to repeat this post again)
"Cliff brings to the table 30 years of music industry experience, during which he was responsible for producing and executive producing primarily guitar-driven music. Cliff was responsible for signing and executive producing such artists as Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Alan Holdsworth, Peter Frampton, Warren Haynes and GOV'T Mule, Steve Howe, John McLaughlin, Scott Henderson, Slash's Snakepit, Opeth, Megadeath, C.O.C., Exodus, Anthrax, Slayer, The Cure, My Bloody Valentine, Our Lady Peace, and too many more to mention. During that time, projects involving Cliff had received 18 Grammy Nominations and 27 Gold, Platinum and Multi-Platinum awards. Cliff was also privileged to work alongside of some of the greatest producers in rock history such as Glyn Johns (The Who, Rolling Stones), Andy Johns (Led Zeppelin), Jim Gaines (Stevie Ray Vaughan), Butch Vig (Nirvana), Bob Rock (Metallica), etc... He has been recording guitar driven rock records since 1975 and has thus gathered a wealth of knowledge in that arena. It is this knowledge that he brings to the table to share with all who work with him at DestroyAllGuitars."
Some quotes about Cliff:
"I was discovered by Frank Zappa but Cliff Cultreri gave me my chance in the music business and if it was not for his instincts, support and encouragement, it's unlikely I would have had a successful music career. When you hear about music business folk lore you hear the fairy tale stories of the one guy that made a difference but was more or less an unsung hero. Cliff was my guardian angel. After countless refusals from virtually every label, Cliff was the only one to take the chance and release my music, giving me a deal that is to this day unequivocally unprecedented in the music business." - Steve Vai
"Back in the 80's when Cliff was with Relativity, he signed my band Tribal Tech, and also helped us get our first three records released. He also really helped us in our first attempts at touring in the US. The music that I play isn't very commercial and I knew it was Cliff's appreciation for what we do that influenced him to help us, more than just trying to make money. Thanks Cliff!" - Scott Henderson
"Cliff is my tone guru. He knows amps and guitars better than anyone, and I trust his recommendations when it comes to equipment. I've known Cliff since '85 and he's always been on the new frontier with both music and gear. He signed me to Relativity back in '86 and since then has continued to help me develop as a solo artist. Now with DestroyAllGuitars on the web we all have a place to go when we need Cliff's advice!" - Joe Satriani
Now, I dont have to be a gigging dude in any situation to know what sounds good if I have Cliff who helps me make equipment purchasing decisions. And believe me, he knows about stuff that he is not even selling on his website and at the same time honest enough to say if he does not know. If you guys are looking to musical credentials, I am telling you that this is the MAN. Who here locally can match his achievements? But you know what? Anybody can write to him and ask for advice. I don't have a monopoly on him. In fact, more than just selling me a Baker, he has shown me a guitar that I never thought would exist in terms of sound character kaya ako bilib sa kanya maski na wala akong tinanungan na gigging musician dito. Between that Aegis guitarist who gigs alot with [gooey brown stuff] sounding equipment or Cliff and Ken Volpe, I would put my trust in Cliff or Ken.
Now if you claim to know more about good sounding guitar than Cliff Cultreri just because you are gigging musician on [gooey brown stuff] equipment, then you are full of hot air.
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Nakakaasar na ang mga usapan sa thread na 'to. Itigil na dapat 'to !!! Magpapataasan nalang ba tayo ng ihi?? Dapat tayong mga Pilipinong musikero ay magtulungan at hindi mag away away at magyabangan. Nakaka BURAT na!!! Kung hindi itigil 'to baka may ma ban uli...
Sino sa inyo ang sangayon ????
RATBUMAN
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I can't afford high-end guitar gear.
Am I less of a musician?
Am I even one?
Should I quit?
Mr. Cultreri seems to be a very supportive person. We need more supportive people.
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Alex -- I mean no offense... but you are nowhere near the caliber of a Cliff Cultreri who people can or should really listen to. I'm sure your passion about this has made you very knowledgeable through the years... but don't get upset if people hesitate to believe you because you're still a nobody in many people's eyes.
Bluenote -- I think your responses to Alex are more out of frustration and its understandable. But I will have to agree with the other guy and say that you don't have to be a gigging musician to be a source of credible opinion.
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the way of life is this: who would you ask for fishing advice? the hobbyist fisherman who has the best tools money can buy and goes out to fish around 2x a year... or the professional fisherman, who has the [gooey brown stuff] equipment but does it every day of his life? :-)
do you guys remember the movie "revenge of the nerds"? there's this one scene where the jock's girlfriend just finished having sex with the lead nerd... and she didn't know it was him because she was blindfolded (i think). when she opened her eyes and saw it was him, she smiled and said that she didn't know that nerds were so good at having sex, and that he was actually better than the jock. the nerd says something like "well, we might not do it all the time, but we think about it all the time".
personally, i'd ask both for their opinion. there's an upside to asking the hobbyist since he's probably done a lot of research, learned from talking shop with other hobbyists, etc. his knowledge though hasn't been curbed/fine-tuned by experience but still there's knowledge to tap. as for the professional, while he has experience to back up whatever he says, you run the risk of hearing insight from a guy who may have developed a lot of bad habits through the years and just refuses to change them. not every seasoned veteran is open to new ideas, and you might get stuck with old tricks that may not work well in the new world.
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Alex -- I mean no offense... but you are nowhere near the caliber of a Cliff Cultreri who people can or should really listen to. I'm sure your passion about this has made you very knowledgeable through the years... but don't get upset if people hesitate to believe you because you're still a nobody in many people's eyes.
..... he feels like he's in the same league with him .... is that wrong? nope... but anybody can dream, right? .... fairy god mother?
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if you choose to be a "critic" of any sort...
you gotta have street cred...
you guys think firemodel has any street cred?
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I personally find no fault in acknowledging the masters' ideas. I do this myself when I research on recording methods. Of course, "name-dropping" can be a good way to convince an artist on how to record their music so there is a little "credibility" with regard to the choice method. Is there a problem when I say "Jimmy Page said DISTANCE = DEPTH" so if you want that big band drum sound, definitely mike your kit with distance miking. Of course, that necessitates determining if the music calls for that setup.
The same thing applies to any fountain of knowledge.
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Bluenote,
Let me remind you that skunky was the one who said that the Uberschall would not do well for jazz. Now, I don't know how many dudes have tried an actual uberschall everyday of their lives and I am saying that its clean channel will do well for jazz. And let me point out that you don't have one and yet you insinuate that I cannot say if its suitable for jazz just because I cannot play jazz?
Ahem I did not say the Uber sucks for jazz. I just said I would prefer something else if I would play jazz. Of course, playing Jazz guitar, in its most basic form, requires clean sounds, with high headroom. And the Uber does have tons of headroom. I just do not know personally how an Uber can deliver the sweet mids of a Jazz guitar. These amps are voiced for metal, a bit loose, so it might be possible that they can work well for Jazz boxes.
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Just believe who you trust.
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Just believe who you trust.
You cannot trust someone without experience. Will you ride a plane with an inexperienced pilot?
Remember the Alice in Wonderland problem?
"The dodo says the hatter tells lies. The hatter says the march hare tells lies. And the march hare says that both the dodo and the hatter tell lies. Who tells the truth?"
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Why dont we all just go and ask the old wise man who lives in a cave :lol:
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Why dont we all just go and ask the old wise man who lives in a cave :lol:
Not to be contrary, baka tayong lahat ang nasa cave at may ibang konting tao na nasa labas ng cave na mas nakakaalam.
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if you choose to be a "critic" of any sort...
you gotta have street cred...
you guys think firemodel has any street cred?
I think Alex should start producing albums. I believe he has that potential. Maybe that can add a little cred...
By the way, his name always appears in thank you lists in many pro released CDs.
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Anong mahirap dun sa believe who you trust? Will you believe someone you don't trust? If you trust the person, it means he has established his credibility to you.
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LUBOTON NAKO NA SI OAS!!!
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Anong mahirap dun sa believe who you trust? Will you believe someone you don't trust? If you trust the person, it means he has established his credibility to you.
Ang mahirap ay paano himayin ang mga sinasabi ng iba-ibang tao para malaman kung sino ang dapat pagkatiwalaan. INC ba o ADD? :lol: Parang ganun.
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Well, that's a different story. But as I said, key word is credibility. Who has more credibility to you? There's no wrong answer. It's you choice anyway. You can always change your mind. It's part of the learning experience.
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Alex -- I mean no offense... but you are nowhere near the caliber of a Cliff Cultreri who people can or should really listen to. I'm sure your passion about this has made you very knowledgeable through the years... but don't get upset if people hesitate to believe you because you're still a nobody in many people's eyes.
Bluenote -- I think your responses to Alex are more out of frustration and its understandable. But I will have to agree with the other guy and say that you don't have to be a gigging musician to be a source of credible opinion.
This is exactly my point Alex. Even if you have the best gear in the world you still have yet to experiece things in the real world...
PRS Man, I didnt say that you have to be a gigging musician to be credible... What I was saying was you at least have to have experienced things first hand in a practical situation before you give any recomendations... Atleast be a knowledgable musician who actualy plays an instrument... Eh as Alex said he is not a musician nor is he a sound engineer or a guitar tech... From my point of view he is a collector with too much doe on his hands. Parang ang dating kc nya eh tone guru kung makapag suggest ng kung ano ano parang mas marunong sa lahat...
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Ang mahirap ay paano himayin ang mga sinasabi ng iba-ibang tao para malaman kung sino ang dapat pagkatiwalaan. INC ba o ADD? :lol: Parang ganun.
Amen! hehehe :-D
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Why dont we all just go and ask the old wise man who lives in a cave :lol:
Maybe he's a reverb expert. :lol:
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The Right Amp
--RAGE amp!
ok we're done...paki-close na po ang thread.
thank you.
:lol:
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wanted to post this here... kinda reviving the thread... ano po magandang amp na halagang 10k to 15k... good overdrive.. good kahit outdoor (madinig lang ng drummer at bassist)... at lightweight... hmmm
di ko sure pero parang natutukso ako sa mga behringer eh... is 30watts good enough? talking about the line 6 spider III 30 :evil:
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mga sirs alam niyo po ba kung anung amp bagay sakin
kasi i need an amp good for distorted and overdrive tone and clean tones
kasi halo halo tugtug ko hee hee
single coil sound , to chug chug and single coil overdrive prefer
anu kayang bagay na amp mga sirs
salamat !!
appreciate anyones suggestions and opinions :-D :-D
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Ang concern ko with amps and gigging is unless may kotse ako palagi at may kasamang dalawang tao para magbuhat, mahirap dalhin ang amp sa gig.
So i bought a ZT Lunchbox amp. :)
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mga sirs alam niyo po ba kung anung amp bagay sakin
kasi i need an amp good for distorted and overdrive tone and clean tones
kasi halo halo tugtug ko hee hee
single coil sound , to chug chug and single coil overdrive prefer
anu kayang bagay na amp mga sirs
salamat !!
appreciate anyones suggestions and opinions :-D :-D
Try bogner shiva, yun nga lang medyo expensive.. pero over all amp, wala pa ako narinig na katulad nun. yung clean parang fender black face, yung overdrive parang marshall jcm 800 tapos may tube gain/volume boost, so parang 3 chanel amp na sha, may tank reverb pa. yun ang target amp ko, vintage sounding boutique amp.
kung ndi naman, mag modeling amp ka. yung spider valve ng line 6. pero personally ndi ako fan ng modeling amps.
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hmmm. mga sir, s tingin nyo, what brand of amplifier are meant for slow rock styles?
..sorry po i'm new in this forum. :D
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most gig situations sa pinas where it can be a small club full of black shirts or a basketball court somewhere
ok na ba ung blackstar ht club 40? or peavey bandit 112?
napanuod ko ang Queso sa laguna eh tas parang un ata gamit ni ocho o ht stage 60
pero parang kaya na sa wattage
mahirap nga kasi pag aasa lang sa amps na basag na ang speakers..kahit anung pihit...nit-pu na!