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The Musician Forums => Guitar Central => Topic started by: emil_murillo on June 05, 2006, 07:39:05 AM
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What do you think about tube amp's consumption on our electricity bill............. Does it hurt that bad.
A friend says if you put 6 tube on your amp.................. It will consume your electricity like 2 aircon unit............
Are these true or what?
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probably not.. but then again im no expert.. just sounds improbable..
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someone told me a Peavey Classic 30 consumes as much power as an average desktop PC. i wish i could confirm that.
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Sa aking alam....
halimbawa may nakalagay sa backplate na rated 75watts
yun ang kain nya sa kuryente.... tapos output power nya ay 30watts
yun ang lakas ng tunog ng amp mo....
so meaning approximately times two....
So kung meron kang tube amp na Classic 30 (all tube)
meaning APPROXIMATELY mga 60-70watts
ang kain sa kuryente mo.... :D
correct me if i'm wrong
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Iba yung POWER consumption sa POWER na nadi-dissipate ng speakers from the amplifier.
BAMF or Bunyok, can you help out?
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Actually yung sinabi ni rubis is already right-on. Power through the power plug is much higher than power out of the speaker terminal. This is because tubes use heaters, which are very power hungry, but whose consumption don't figger out in the speaker terminal. Like a single 12AX7 should be allocated 300mA of heater power, each. So for instance like the 50 Watter I'm assembling, if I did go all tube, I'd need a 2A transformer, just for the heaters. For 100W, ok na mga 5 Amperes. Heater pa lang yun, hindi pa kasama yung power na gagamitin to actually amplify the signal.
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Actually sirs.........
It's a Guyatone GA-1500, 60W (72W on the plate), output section is 6L6GCx2 push pull and 12AX7 power section and transistor pre- hybrid amplifier.
Here is the front image:
(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a312/emilyo11/guyatonega-1500.jpg)
Here is the back image showing the 6L6GC:
(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a312/emilyo11/guyatonega-1500-BACK.jpg)
So is it true that this baby can consume as much as a 1 hp airconditioning unit?......................... :?:
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I don't think so Sir Emil that your Flip amp consumes
about 1hp like an Aircon...... i think it only consumes
around 150 to 200W tops.
1 horse power is equal to 746 watts..... :D
correct me if i'm wrong. :D
skunkyfunk,
yun ang alam ko Sir ... mag kaiba ang power consumption
sa power output sa mga amps... dahil sa kain ng mga parts.
di katulad sa mga light bulbs....
OT a 100W incandescent bulb dissipates 100W
of lighting power... whereas sa mga flourescent
lamps... 25W flourescent bulb can dissipate 100w
lighting power. kaya recommended ito...
napunta na ako sa bumbilya.... heheh :lol:
hope this helps...
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Naku many thanks sa lahat...............
Marami kasi akong kakilala na may studio....... Ayaw nila ng di-tubo na amplifiers....... Malakas daw sa kuryente kaya nag re-research ako regarding this............. So far medyo naliliwanagan na ko..........Tnx po. :wink: :)
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Marami kasi akong kakilala na may studio....... Ayaw nila ng di-tubo na amplifiers....... Malakas daw sa kuryente kaya nag re-research ako regarding this.............
can't wait for oasgomez to comment on this! :lol:
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Marami kasi akong kakilala na may studio....... Ayaw nila ng di-tubo na amplifiers....... Malakas daw sa kuryente kaya nag re-research ako regarding this.............
can't wait for oasgomez to comment on this! :lol:
+20 :lol:
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"malakas sa kuryente" is relative. Compared to what ? Of course compared to solid-states, they're monsters. Compared to your aircon tho', its not much.
Tapos pag naka-aircon ka, parang hindi lumalamig ang kwarto kapag meron kang malalaking tube amps. Tapos, ideally, naka-aircon ka pag nagpapatugtog ng tube amps (pero IMHO OA na masyado yun).
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:. ayos lang ang tube amps for rehearsal studios............... is that it?
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:. ayos lang ang tube amps for rehearsal studios............... is that it?
YES! :D
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:. ayos lang ang tube amps for rehearsal studios............... is that it?
YES! :D
i haven't been into a rehearsal studio with tube amps though... but i heard that years ago, there was this expensive studio (you pay twice as much as the "other" studios) in katipunan where they have a half stack marshall and some tube combos... though frankly, i don't see the point with the half stack, but it would be cool to piss off your bandmates every once in a while by cranking it up :)
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well.. if they have competent people managing it, i don't see the problem with having tube amps available in a rehearsal studio..
most rehearsal "studios" that i go to only have a PA. the point of this is, you're rehearsing your songs.. so use your own things..
it would be fun seeing a metal band using an acoustic amp! :lol:
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i haven't been into a rehearsal studio with tube amps though... but i heard that years ago, there was this expensive studio (you pay twice as much as the "other" studios) in katipunan where they have a half stack marshall and some tube combos... though frankly, i don't see the point with the half stack, but it would be cool to piss off your bandmates every once in a while by cranking it up :)
yan ba yung power chord studio dati? 150 dun nung araw e...100 ang standard noon. may fender head + cab sila nung mga panahong yon, di ko alam kung anong model yon maski ngayon hehe. basta nabingi ako nung inoverdrive nung may-ari.
may standard 3-prong wiring ba ang mga venues dito sa atin? classified as death-defying stunt yata ang magsaksak/gumamit ng tube amp sa 2-prong/non-polarized outlet :mrgreen:
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Your electric guitar truly becomes an "electric guitar" nyahahahaa.
Get it all the time with my El Tubero preamp. Preamp pa lang yun !
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Seriously, just plug it into an AVR and you get some form of isolation. Kung dati 220V nakukuha ng katawan mo, ngayon mga 50 volts na lang bwahehehe.
Gaganda pa ang tunog kasi mawawala yung ibang power supply hum and voltage spikes and dirty signals na nakukuha sa power lines.
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sa pagkakaalam ko sir e thousands of volts ang dumadaloy sa high-voltage circuits ng tube amp. kahit naka-avr ka, pag tumawid na ang kuryente sa circuit ground, direcho yan sa guitar cable mo, gitara, at finally sa katawan mo. mabreak man ng AVR o house circuit breaker ang kuryente, nakatawid na. nadale na ang puso mo at nervous system.
kung pwede lang gayahin yung ginagawa sa electric stove e (i-ground sa gripo), kaso pangit yatang maggitara sa kusina :mrgreen:
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yan ba yung power chord studio dati? 150 dun nung araw e...100 ang standard noon. may fender head + cab sila nung mga panahong yon, di ko alam kung anong model yon maski ngayon hehe. basta nabingi ako nung inoverdrive nung may-ari.
may standard 3-prong wiring ba ang mga venues dito sa atin? classified as death-defying stunt yata ang magsaksak/gumamit ng tube amp sa 2-prong/non-polarized outlet :mrgreen:
yun ata yun... but i think they were charging 200/hr and im not sure about the fender head and cab... mejo madalang kasi head na fender e...
speaking of which, who's tried the fender supersonic series?
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yun ata yun... but i think they were charging 200/hr and im not sure about the fender head and cab... mejo madalang kasi head na fender e...
speaking of which, who's tried the fender supersonic series?
i'm pretty sure head yun bossing, na fender...kasi tweed ang balot tapos kita ang pag-ilaw ng tubes. then again, 1994 pa yon at madami-dami na rin akong nainom na alcohol since then :D
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i'm pretty sure head yun bossing, na fender...kasi tweed ang balot tapos kita ang pag-ilaw ng tubes. then again, 1994 pa yon at madami-dami na rin akong nainom na alcohol since then :D
hehe...kick ass!
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mga pre, magastos ba tlga to sa kuryente? help nman mga forumites. :D
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i haven't been into a rehearsal studio with tube amps though... but i heard that years ago, there was this expensive studio (you pay twice as much as the "other" studios) in katipunan where they have a half stack marshall and some tube combos... though frankly, i don't see the point with the half stack, but it would be cool to piss off your bandmates every once in a while by cranking it up :)
yan ba yung power chord studio dati? 150 dun nung araw e...100 ang standard noon. may fender head + cab sila nung mga panahong yon, di ko alam kung anong model yon maski ngayon hehe. basta nabingi ako nung inoverdrive nung may-ari.
may standard 3-prong wiring ba ang mga venues dito sa atin? classified as death-defying stunt yata ang magsaksak/gumamit ng tube amp sa 2-prong/non-polarized outlet :mrgreen:
kilala ko yung may ari.. :) may studio siyang iba ngayon.. grabe brand consciousness niyan.. may fender blues deville ngayon na tatlo.. read: tatlo!.. :D
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uy brand conscious............................................................ .....................
na gearhead............................................................. .............................
hehe :roll:
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sa pagkakaalam ko sir e thousands of volts ang dumadaloy sa high-voltage circuits ng tube amp. kahit naka-avr ka, pag tumawid na ang kuryente sa circuit ground, direcho yan sa guitar cable mo, gitara, at finally sa katawan mo. mabreak man ng AVR o house circuit breaker ang kuryente, nakatawid na. nadale na ang puso mo at nervous system.
kung pwede lang gayahin yung ginagawa sa electric stove e (i-ground sa gripo), kaso pangit yatang maggitara sa kusina :mrgreen:
Sarcastic ba to? Di nga? Ganon ba kataas na DC volts ang kailangan ng tube? o diretso AC gamit nun?
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sa pagkakaalam ko sir e thousands of volts ang dumadaloy sa high-voltage circuits ng tube amp. kahit naka-avr ka, pag tumawid na ang kuryente sa circuit ground, direcho yan sa guitar cable mo, gitara, at finally sa katawan mo. mabreak man ng AVR o house circuit breaker ang kuryente, nakatawid na. nadale na ang puso mo at nervous system.
kung pwede lang gayahin yung ginagawa sa electric stove e (i-ground sa gripo), kaso pangit yatang maggitara sa kusina :mrgreen:
Sarcastic ba to? Di nga? Ganon ba kataas na DC volts ang kailangan ng tube? o diretso AC gamit nun?
OT(i dont know the answer to the original thread):one thing is for sure...a current that leaks out has the potential to electrocute the user( seen this happen many times, some were fatal), This is where grounding comes in , this the best form of protection (unless you wanna wear rubber gloves while playing :lol: ) from a shock hazard if one of the mains or high voltage power supply wires contacts the chassis(then to the guitar cable then finally to U) due to some kind of fault.
Lucky for me I was able to install a 9 ft copper coated ground rod (P300 here in DAU), welded a thick copper wire and istalled a three prong wall outlet( of kors .. use a multi-tester to check the continuity, then ur all set to rock!!! :D ) ... now I can play without worrying about being electrocuted from my PV delta blues. If you have a tube amp you should consider setting up one , your very own life may depend upon it.
:D
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Over. Di naman thousands of volts.
A tube can operate on "starved plate" mode with as little as 12 Volts at the plate. Although in this operation, it doesnt really amplify, in fact the signal taken out of the tube is even weaker than the signal that came in...AND...wala kang headroom. Meaning, the signal will have distortion all the way.
Typical plate voltages are about 190V-350 volts. Tickle-tickle din but not as lethal as, say, a car's ignition coil.
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i apologize for the misleading info. i'll be sure to verify before posting next time.
thanks for the clarification, BAMF!
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Suri din if that came out wrong :D . Na-shock lang ako hahehehe (pun intended)
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So much should i ask for every hour of practice then........... for 2 guitar tube-amps and a 200 watts bass amp, etc, etc, ...........
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Dati may nasubukan akong Japanese tube amp called Stage King maganda ang tunog.
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Ano ba mas maganda tunog............ German tubes or Japanese......
Yung Japanese Tubes sakin ok na eh................ ang ganda ng tunog.
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Sovtek.
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Electro Harmonix or JJ tubes.
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sa pagkakaalam ko sir e thousands of volts ang dumadaloy sa high-voltage circuits ng tube amp. kahit naka-avr ka, pag tumawid na ang kuryente sa circuit ground, direcho yan sa guitar cable mo, gitara, at finally sa katawan mo. mabreak man ng AVR o house circuit breaker ang kuryente, nakatawid na. nadale na ang puso mo at nervous system.
kung pwede lang gayahin yung ginagawa sa electric stove e (i-ground sa gripo), kaso pangit yatang maggitara sa kusina :mrgreen:
Sarcastic ba to? Di nga? Ganon ba kataas na DC volts ang kailangan ng tube? o diretso AC gamit nun?
Tama yung sinabi ni BAMF up to 350V or higher.. but for me i think it is lethal... Lalo ng yung mga output tubes operating at 350VDC.... :D
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You should try fixing a TV and getting tickled by the flyback hehehe. I did...still alive though. 33 Kilovolts :D
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Yayks!................ ako naman nasunog ang kalahating kamay ko noon kakakalikot ng stereo.................... Hayun isang araw nakababad sa yelo yung kamay ko.................... Hindi ko pa alam noon ang first aid dun eh.............
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Sovtek.
May nabibilhan ba sa manila ng Svetlana.
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Russian tubes yan ah..................
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May nakita akong 6L6GC sa raon..................... But 'di ko nakita yung tatak................ Meron pala dito nun....... :?:
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Mura lang yan, pero ingat ka.
Power tubes have to be MATCHED. Pag hindi...well...gagana pa din pero distorted ang magiging tunog mo kasi magiging asymmetrical ang daan ng kuryente sa top and bottom portions ng waveform (corresponding to the positive and negative swing na handle ng mga tubo). Thus kung dual tubes yan, dapat pareho ang transconductance characteristics nyan. And Deeco doesnt have the ability to match it for you.
Mapapamahal ka, pero the better bet is pumunta sa Phasetron Parksquare and order either a matched pair or matched quad ng tubes na kelangan mo.
National ang tatak ng 6L6 sa Deeco, made in Yugoslavia.
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Try ko lang.............................. :) :)
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Mura lang yan, pero ingat ka.
Power tubes have to be MATCHED. Pag hindi...well...gagana pa din pero distorted ang magiging tunog mo kasi magiging asymmetrical ang daan ng kuryente sa top and bottom portions ng waveform (corresponding to the positive and negative swing na handle ng mga tubo). Thus kung dual tubes yan, dapat pareho ang transconductance characteristics nyan. And Deeco doesnt have the ability to match it for you.
Mapapamahal ka, pero the better bet is pumunta sa Phasetron Parksquare and order either a matched pair or matched quad ng tubes na kelangan mo.
National ang tatak ng 6L6 sa Deeco, made in Yugoslavia.
Baka gusto nila sila ang gagawa................... Modus Operandi yan ng mga electronic supplies dito samin yan................. Palaging wala silang stock ng piyesa............... tapos minsan iba ang ibibigay sa'yo para masira ang equipment mo tapos pagagawa m na lang sa kanila.................... Kaya hayun natuto akong mag DIY.................. Ha!
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Mga bro, I have read somewhere in this forum that the pre-amp tubes are more important than the power tubes.
Ano ba ang function ng power tubes?
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Sir just my 2 cents... Preamp tubes shape your distortion but powertubes shape your overdrive. (does that make sense to you)... heheheh.
Anyway the way it works is yung powertubes are well ... poweramps... they drive the speaker.. so pag na ooverload yung poweramp ...it clips creating yung overdrive from the 50's to 70's. Then they introduced teh master volume which controlled teh power tubes so that you could drive the preamp tubes instead. This way you didnt have to drive the amp so loud to get that over drive... but the thing is iba yung voice nila. Anyway long short of it is, powertubes are the over all voice of your amp... it may break up sooner or later in the power cycle but its the raw voice. The preamp naman controls your gain. So if you want a darker / brighter distortion ... you swap out tubes in the v1 and v2 position. of course the combination of both are important... but preamp tubes hardly affect your clean tone .. vs power that affect both clean and dirty but is more pronounced at higher volumes.
daming sinabi... lol ... i hope i helped
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Question!............ Teacher!.........
One good example of a "Pre-amp"..............
And another of a "Power-amp"..............
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Preamp ! The first two "small" tubes of your guitar tube amp.
Power amp ! The last two or four "large" tubes of your guitar tube amp.
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Preamp ! The first two "small" tubes of your guitar tube amp.
Power amp ! The last two or four "large" tubes of your guitar tube amp.
Does it always come in pairs sir :?:
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Preamp tubes do not need to be matched.
Okay let's qualify this. There's what's called the Class-A or single-ended tube amp, which may require only one large tube. But the class -B amplifiers, which are the usual case with guitar amps (except VOX ata) will have a power amp that has tubes that should come in 2's or 4's. I havent seen a six-tube guitar amp yet, but in theory it is possible, it should come in even numbers. And that even number must be closely matched for parameters.
Kasi po, ganito yan. One tube or one pair of tubes will amplify the upswing (positive cycle) and another tube or another pair of tubes will amplify the downswing (negative cycle). Pag hindi matched ang tubes mo, hindi magpapantay ang up and down swings ng waveform mo and you will get various types of distortion (and I don't mean overdrive, i mean real non-linear distortion inherent in the amp). It will be impossible to get a "clean" sound. Pero kung oks sa yo yun, tutunog pa din ang amp mo, so there's the trade-off with not having the tubes matched.
I got my 6550's at Audiophile and they came in a pair, so pre-matched na sya. If you buy at Deeco, it's best you go there armed with a tube tester so you can measure the parameters of each tube before you buy them. If you don't have that piece of equipment, try audiophile, who carries OEM tubes for Peavey and Fender, kaya lang ang last na tanong ko, the tubes aren't matched din. Without the tube tester, your best bet is to buy from dealers that have matched the tubes. Again, Phasetron Parksquare and those stores at Guadalupe EDSA (near Sogo hotel). There is a good list of dealers who will entertain you at www.wiredstate.com . Meron pa sa West Avenue. You can also order sa internet, create an account at www.cedist.com , that's where I get some of my stuff. They offer pre-matched tubes at great prices. Mahal nga lang ang shipping. But the prices are so a-ok. Like a full set (pre-amp plus power amp) tubes for a Marshall 100W only costs like $50. JJ tubes pa, so magandang klase yun.
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6 tube power amp - mesa bogie triple rectifier. :D
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One hell of educational stuffs right here............ right now...........
Hehehe!!!............ VH!
This is the advantage of having fellas like these........
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Preamp tubes do not need to be matched.
Okay let's qualify this. There's what's called the Class-A or single-ended tube amp, which may require only one large tube. But the class -B amplifiers, which are the usual case with guitar amps (except VOX ata) will have a power amp that has tubes that should come in 2's or 4's. I havent seen a six-tube guitar amp yet, but in theory it is possible, it should come in even numbers. And that even number must be closely matched for parameters.
Kasi po, ganito yan. One tube or one pair of tubes will amplify the upswing (positive cycle) and another tube or another pair of tubes will amplify the downswing (negative cycle). Pag hindi matched ang tubes mo, hindi magpapantay ang up and down swings ng waveform mo and you will get various types of distortion (and I don't mean overdrive, i mean real non-linear distortion inherent in the amp). It will be impossible to get a "clean" sound. Pero kung oks sa yo yun, tutunog pa din ang amp mo, so there's the trade-off with not having the tubes matched.
I got my 6550's at Audiophile and they came in a pair, so pre-matched na sya. If you buy at Deeco, it's best you go there armed with a tube tester so you can measure the parameters of each tube before you buy them. If you don't have that piece of equipment, try audiophile, who carries OEM tubes for Peavey and Fender, kaya lang ang last na tanong ko, the tubes aren't matched din. Without the tube tester, your best bet is to buy from dealers that have matched the tubes. Again, Phasetron Parksquare and those stores at Guadalupe EDSA (near Sogo hotel). There is a good list of dealers who will entertain you at www.wiredstate.com . Meron pa sa West Avenue. You can also order sa internet, create an account at www.cedist.com , that's where I get some of my stuff. They offer pre-matched tubes at great prices. Mahal nga lang ang shipping. But the prices are so a-ok. Like a full set (pre-amp plus power amp) tubes for a Marshall 100W only costs like $50. JJ tubes pa, so magandang klase yun.
very good piece of info BAMF..salamat!
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ok info to ah tnx :D :D
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I wish I knew back in 06 what I know now about tube electronics. Sigh.