THD Hotplate vs. Weber Mass vs. Marshall Powerbrake vs. iba

[skunkyfunk]

Please help me decide on the best power attenuator for use with non-master volume amps.  Personally I am decided on the Weber MASS but is there anything that the others can do that the MASS can't?

[titser_marco]

Mejo OT: Where can i get an attenuator here in Manila? How much kaya?

[skunkyfunk]

Mejo OT: Where can i get an attenuator here in Manila? How much kaya?

from BAMF?  

[geetar_geek79]

PM mo si PHIL.  He can fill you in with THD's...

[skunkyfunk]

PM mo si PHIL.  He can fill you in with THD's...

What I don't like about the THD Hotplate is that it works only with one specific impedance.  Say you have 2 amps, one runs at 8 ohms and the other at 16 ohms.  That means you need two Hotplates.  

[Phil]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

[Phil]

PM mo si PHIL.  He can fill you in with THD's...

What I don't like about the THD Hotplate is that it works only with one specific impedance.  Say you have 2 amps, one runs at 8 ohms and the other at 16 ohms.  That means you need two Hotplates.  

correct .......but mostly amps of today have select switch for impedence...it really depends on your cab selection.

if you go for the heavy 4x12 rated at 4 ohms....a 2x12 cab or 2 of those....or a 1 x 12 cab (rated at 8ohm, of course)

In my case I will never use a 16 ohm setup....like 1 x12 cab at 16 ohm. In my case, I use it to run a 2x12 (rated at 8 ohms) and 2- 2x12s(rated at 4 ohms)....the 8 ohm version can do 4 ohm with no hassles.

  The THD has preset attenuation...-2Db the lowest  to -16Db the highest....in this case you can use the volume knob. It also have 2 brightness and deep switches which is an added feature when your amps EQ don't have enough numbers to give you more treble and bass.

..tell me..what cabs do you have right now? and what speakers/ impedence are they at....and how are wired?

[skunkyfunk]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

[Phil]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

[skunkyfunk]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

[Phil]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

1. good results but you have to compinsate ....use EQ.
2 very good result
3. still very good result
4. very good result
5. might as well no attenuator

key here is to find out what volume your amp sounds the best most.

Then....glue it there....and then use the attenuator..to control the volume.

The higher the attenuation...the tone changes...it gets darker. (use EQ or bright switch or turn of deep switch). In my case...the THD doesn't suck tone until you reach maximum attenuation which is -16Db.

[skunkyfunk]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

1. good results but you have to compinsate ....use EQ.
2 very good result
3. still very good result
4. very good result
5. might as well no attenuator

key here is to find out what volume your amp sounds the best most.

Then....glue it there....and then use the attenuator..to control the volume.

The higher the attenuation...the tone changes...it gets darker. (use EQ or bright switch or turn of deep switch). In my case...the THD doesn't suck tone until you reach maximum attenuation which is -16Db.

Thanks Phil.  I really appreciate.  Anyone who has a Powerbrake or Weber MASS?

[deltaslim]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

Not Phil, but I had a THD Univalve w/ built-in Hotplate before. Generally, you don't want to have the Hotplate working at more than 50% at whatever amp volume level.  Otherwise, medyo nagiging choked na and supot.  Nababawasan ung brilliance and harmonics.  However, heaven sent sya for late night playing at home and still have summadat tube tone and dynamics.

[skunkyfunk]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

Not Phil, but I had a THD Univalve w/ built-in Hotplate before. Generally, you don't want to have the Hotplate working at more than 50% at whatever amp volume level.  Otherwise, medyo nagiging choked na and supot.  Nababawasan ung brilliance and harmonics.  However, heaven sent sya for late night playing at home and still have summadat tube tone and dynamics.

Hmmm, so that means I can just reduce the volume by like, 50% to make it sound good?  That's -3dB less lang.  

[deltaslim]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

Not Phil, but I had a THD Univalve w/ built-in Hotplate before. Generally, you don't want to have the Hotplate working at more than 50% at whatever amp volume level.  Otherwise, medyo nagiging choked na and supot.  Nababawasan ung brilliance and harmonics.  However, heaven sent sya for late night playing at home and still have summadat tube tone and dynamics.

Hmmm, so that means I can just reduce the volume by like, 50% to make it sound good?  That's -3dB less lang.  

I'm sure you know that reducing the AMP volume level doesn't necessarily mean it'll sound "just as" good but not as loud.  The tone of an amp cranked vs one at 12 noon on the AMP volume is different.  I'd rather crank it wide open and reduce w/ attenuator and try to compensate thru eq.  You will not get the same cranked amp tone w/ the AMP volume at 12 noon even w/ no attenuation.

[Poundcake]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

i use the 16Ω version of the THD Hotplate. same results as Phil's. plus, the "Bright" and "Deep" switches are quite useful too. it gives you more options

[Phil]

..what kind of application? home use? small venue?

More of a studio amp.  Loudness really affects the ambience in the room.  Louder volume means more wall reflections hence a denser, roomier sound.  Softer volume means more definition and tightness.  So what I really need is an attenuator that can work in a lot of environments.  Of course the cab can be a problem because the speakers must be driven well to sound better.

the attenuator is used to drive the tubes.....obviously it won't drive the speaker to its maximum performance...which is more important to you...power tube break up or speaker?.....in a studio ...obviously you can't do both....but a lot of artist are getting good sound using an attenuator.

Anyway, how does the Hotplate perform in these conditions:

1)  Maximum attenuation, amp in full blast
2)  Medium attenuation, amp in full blast
3)  Medium attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
4)  Low attenuation, amp in medium (near breakup) volume
5)  Low attenuation, amp in low volume (clean but not tinny)

Not Phil, but I had a THD Univalve w/ built-in Hotplate before. Generally, you don't want to have the Hotplate working at more than 50% at whatever amp volume level.  Otherwise, medyo nagiging choked na and supot.  Nababawasan ung brilliance and harmonics.  However, heaven sent sya for late night playing at home and still have summadat tube tone and dynamics.

Hmmm, so that means I can just reduce the volume by like, 50% to make it sound good?  That's -3dB less lang.  

I'm sure you know that reducing the AMP volume level doesn't necessarily mean it'll sound "just as" good but not as loud.  The tone of an amp cranked vs one at 12 noon on the AMP volume is different.  I'd rather crank it wide open and reduce w/ attenuator and try to compensate thru eq.  You will not get the same cranked amp tone w/ the AMP volume at 12 noon even w/ no attenuation.

CORRECT!!!!!!!! ....YOU HIT IT RIGHT IN THE BULLSEYE PARENG JORIC.

[Phil]

Dan the stratman has a Dr schotz power soak...calling Dan.

I have a home brew that works well ...up to 50 watts though....it only has a volume knob....made by a white dude good in electronics.

I have a friend whos been using the Marshall and getting good results...although I have other friends who had bad experiences with the Marshall...it fried their amp.

If I am to buy another one...I'd go for the Webber...the higher model one I think its called the MASS or something like that...almost the same price as a hotplate.

But you know what?

I tried biasing my amp a bit hotter and I'm getting really nice tones at lower volumes....no attenuator needed.

[stratman1]

I have the Scholtz Power Soak. It does what it's supposed to do. I do have that tone degradation problem when you go down volume level. Unfortunatelly, Power Soak doesn't have any tone compensation switch. What's good about it is that it does have impedance selector so I can pretty much use this with any amp impedance setting.

I've heard alot of good things about Weber Mass. Might be worth checking out. Check out these ebay links...

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dr-Z-Airbrake-like-new-the-best-attenuator_W0QQitemZ270038490606QQihZ017QQcategoryZ22669QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Weber-Mass-Amplifier-Attenuator-Hotplate-Powerbreak_W0QQitemZ270037727228QQihZ017QQcategoryZ43375QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Weber-Mini-Mass-50w-Attenuator_W0QQitemZ260039999887QQihZ016QQcategoryZ43375QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/Ultimate-Attenuator-variable-line-out-option-New_W0QQitemZ110042574052QQihZ001QQcategoryZ43375QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem