TALK @ PhilMusic.com - The Online Home of the Pinoy Musician
The Musician Forums => Guitar Central => Topic started by: BAMF on January 29, 2006, 01:55:13 AM
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Been browsing my downloaded schematics for my first all-tube amp build. Looking at a 50 Watter. I'm thinking of just going hybrid. Like tube preamp, solid state tone control and phase splitter, then tube power amps. I'll just adjust the voltage and impedance requirements closely. That way I can limit the tube count to just three.
It seems that the VOX AC amps and the Hiwatts are much simpler than Marshalls to build. Tube count is roughly the same for equal wattage, but the number of passive components are much less for those two amps.
Has anyone had any experience with those ? They're awfully rare in the RP. Will it approximate the "brown sound" that Marshall fans like me adore ?
BAMF
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Been browsing my downloaded schematics for my first all-tube amp build. Looking at a 50 Watter. I'm thinking of just going hybrid. Like tube preamp, solid state tone control and phase splitter, then tube power amps. I'll just adjust the voltage and impedance requirements closely. That way I can limit the tube count to just three.
It seems that the VOX AC amps and the Hiwatts are much simpler than Marshalls to build. Tube count is roughly the same for equal wattage, but the number of passive components are much less for those two amps.
Has anyone had any experience with those ? They're awfully rare in the RP. Will it approximate the "brown sound" that Marshall fans like me adore ?
BAMF
I'm not an expert but it seems building a Vox or Hiwatt are complicated for a first build? Have you tried building an AX84? I think they have different flavors naman -- or give one your own Vox/Hiwatt flavor.
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OT: How's that solid marble electric guitar coming along?
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Al : Gave it lots of thought. Figgers that natural marble will entail too much expense and time as I might have to travel to Romblon just for it.
I had a better idea. Cultured marble made from Resin and calcium carbonate. It won't need to be carved, it can be molded :D . Mixture can even be modified so that the body will be cultured granite so I can have a "hard rock guitar" :D.
If you could help by donating a strat body that's lying around, I'd be much obliged. I need something to mold around.
Delta: Yup I've looked at the AX84 site a couple of times. Very interesting, but the power output on the original circuits are...well...kinda low. The expense between those and 50 Watt things won't be too great.
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BAMF,
Will the parts be 100% locally sourced including the power and output transformers? I've been wanting to build the Ax84 P1 for ages but have given up on the idea because I don't think there is a local substitute for the Hammond output and power transformers listed on the bill of materials. I'm not planning to order online either because it's darn expensive.
I actually don't know anything about electronics but I think the AX84 schematics are simple enough for mere mortals to understand. Documentation is abundant as well. It would definitely be a great way to acquire a new skill set. That is if I don't get zapped by 300 volts!
Anyway, good luck on your project. Give us an update once you've finished your 50 watt screamer.
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Heya zook.
Yeah, the goal is to have all parts sourced locally (although some, like the tubes are imported but still bought locally).
The power supply transformer is the easy part. Deeco (Ill check if they still have this service ) used to have a service where they'd wind transformers for you. I've had a couple made already, but they were power transformers with specific voltages. WHen I was starting out in electronics...gosh back in 82, there was a company called "Lion" whose specialty it was to wind all kinds of transformers, power, input matching, output matching, balun, hi-voltage step-ups etc. I'll just trace where they went. Which reminds me...we were taught in school to wind our own transformers...hmmm...I just have to find the formulas. But mechanically it's simple enough...determine the wire gauge required to carry the current requiremen, how long it needs to be and wind it on a plastic bobbin (can be bought at deeco) then cover that layer with masking tape, wind your primary winding over it. THen insert the "E" cores alternately from left and right until the bobbin is filled with it. fill the gaps outside the bobbin with the "I" cores until there are no more gaps. Dip in varnish and screw the thing down. Hey thanks for reminding me :D .
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Aww looky here zook. Right under my very nose. Alexan has a custom transformer winding service. And output transformers (both Hammond and local AMX) are available from kinetic audio in Cainta. Must be my lucky night. Now the next question of how much :D .
BAMF
eadquarters Location:
Kinetic Audio Technologies
123 Mangosteen Road, FTI Complex,
Taguig City, Metro Manila Philippines
Tel (632) 8384301 local 3552 & 3554
Fax/Tel (632) 8380590
Email: k-audio@philonline.com
Services:
Custom Design and Custom Building of all types of vacuum tube amplifiers. Upgrade and tweaks
Vacuum Tube Sales: Electro Harmonix, Sovtek, Svetlana,Tung-Sol, US and Japanese NOS/NIB
Parts: Sprague, Solen, Auricap Capacitors, Alps Potentiometers, Hammond Transformers, AMX Power and Output Transformers and Chokes
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BAMF,
without any disrespect, but have you really heard what a good AC30 sounds like in person? If so, how many? If not, how do you know that you are voicing the correct sound?
this is my point... wala tayo sa position to make amps that sound good because we are not exposed... period
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BAMF,
without any disrespect, but have you really heard what a good AC30 sounds like in person? If so, how many? If not, how do you know that you are voicing the correct sound?
this is my point... wala tayo sa position to make amps that sound good because we are not exposed... period
Heya oas. Actually, that's exactly the question of this thread. I have not heard not even one AC, except the records of the Beatles and have not heard a Hiwatt, except from the records of The Who. That's why I'm asking if anyone has heard one and what are their comments.
My target sound is Marshall, of which I have been plugged into tens of them,and have one, albeit solid state. I'm just asking if it approximates Marshall. Yep, in this regard I truly admit that I'm clueless to the AC30's and Hiwatts.
As for not in the position to make amps that sound good...that's a very limiting belief. I'll be the judge of that, when it's done, and not prior to actually doing it. Even a Jim Marshall started from zero when he cloned the Fender tweed. As for me, I can make my mistakes, learn, and adjust again. After all, it will be my personal unit, I can do with it whatever I damn please. :D. I do have 23 years of electronics building experience under my belt and have built some nasty solid-state's in my heyday. This is admittedly my first tube build.
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don't forget that speakers play an important role in the sound. probably more important than the tubes themselves.
good luck! post some clips when you're done.
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Oh yeah. My brother 10 years my senior, who's a fellow ECE and the pro audio engineer between the two of us still has questions about why a speaker sounds good and why some don't. Together with the mythical Marshall output transformer, that's the "myth" part which still needs to be figgered out. And these darn things are not made equal. A celestion will not sound like the next one, even if it's made exactly the same. The truth is out there somewhere :D.
But I'll be starting with Crown or Dai-ichi instrument speakers for the moment and start from there. Thinking of a closed-back cabinet too to add bass punch. That's where I'll need my bro's help :D.
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BAMF,
Will you be willing to hand build a state-of-the-art B-A-M-F! power transformer for a poor soul like me? Hehehe, just kidding! I will check out Deeco and Alexan for their custom winding service and many thanks for the tip, you've been very helpful. Oh, pardon my laziness but do you have the address of Kinetic Audio in Cainta? Mr. Google did not yield any interesting results.
I'm sure tube amp DIYers will frown upon this. Some AX84 enthusiasts swear by the sound of Hammonds. Others will bet their life on some so-and-so piece of equipment. Swat the Duck! I'm not willing to shell out cash for a piece of heavy iron. We are Pinoy and we ARE damned resourceful. We will use materials that are readily available. I think the satisfaction here comes from building something out of nothing. By relying on ones' skill, creativity and DISKARTE we are able to come up with something we can call our own. Ultimately, it is our own ears that will judge whether the end product sounds good. If the end product does not sound like a true VOX or a Hi-Watt or a Marshall, it doesn't really matter. What's important is that we built it ourselves.
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sir do you think they wind transformers with impedance matching.. ( tama ba? )
kasi from what i know.. most tube amps may impedance matching sa transformers.. i think sa power transformers ata..
currently im in search for a Hammond 125 A (22.5k / 8 ohm)
http://www.ax84.com
ok din ito for tube amp builders
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zook: Scroll up a little, I pasted Kinetic Audio's contact numbers in a previous post. They carry Hammond Transformers :D.
I agree with y' both. Of course the objective is important, but if we fall short, it was really the journey and not the destination. And if I don't hit a marshall sound, maybe it will be a BAMF sound if it doesnt approach anything else. Not a total waste.
At any rate, I was reading up literature til 7 am this mornin, wasnt able to sleep. Lots of factors that go into the sound and I believe some of these are not just myths. Like the metal used for the output transformer core and the way the transformer is wound. I've read somewhere that the best output transformers are "bifiliar" or "trifiliar" wound, meaning the primary and secondary coil wires are wound around together and not in layers. It's a myth that actually makes sense. Then I was able to find a "Marshall Tone Stack" which is to say that it's the unique way that Marshall configures its tone controls. Yes, it does look quite assymetrical and unusual, and right now I'm beginning to understand the high passive parts count of marshall. The El Tubero preamp is now complete and is relatively silent (as overdrives go anyway). It appears it was noisy because I forgot to put in a shunt resistor on the output. I'm already happy with its sound, it's got this "glassy", brittle sound and when you strum full chords, it goes "quack". Is that a good thing? Sounds good to me...although a little more perfection is in order. Kumbaga sa golf, its about 3 putts away from Marshall sound pa. I'll implement the Marshall tone stack on it and if it gives me a 1 putt away or hole in one, I could stop there, short of building a tube amp (bakit pa kumbaga).
Dantuts : Output transformers are actually impedance matching transformers. They convert the impedance from the side of the tubes to the 8 or 16 ohms required by the speakers. Kinetic audio has Hammonds btw, or so they say in their website. Scroll up and call them up :D By the way, their retail arm is Phasetron audio in park square 1 glorietta. They also have custom-wound transformer service. Malamang pang hi-fi pa and local so I hope to get a high cost to quality ratio if I go that way :D.
BAMF
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sound clips naman! :)
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Mayang gabi upload ko sa soundclick me gig cum audition lang kami 2nyt :D. Or mas maganda pag naikabit ko na yung Marshall tone stack :D mamayang gabi din tapos na yun.
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BAMF,
this is my point... wala tayo sa position to make amps that sound good because we are not exposed... period
I believe it's a very colonial view to think that something that sounds "good" should sound like some other thing which is touted to be so.. An object's real merit can only be seen if it's judged against itself, not against things that were obviously designed to do other things.
Being exposed to different tones will definitely create a good starting point but the lack of it should not be a factor that inevitably destroys the potential to create something that's good. After all, Leo Fender never heard a "real" guitar amp prior to his designs. Jim did hear Fender amps but that was about it. Radio and stereo systems were the closest thing they had to instrument amplification.
I support BAMF in his endeavor and am very excited to hear what he comes up with.
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BAMF - wow! lots of great info here. i, too, am excited to hear about the results of your project (yours too, zook, if you decide to take the plunge). pag makabuo kayo ng prototype from local materials, i will follow suit regardless of the tone. as an initial foray into tube amp building, what's important is acquiring the know-how in building it. pag marunong na ako mag-build, then i'll go into tweaking them to sound good to me!
willing ka ba i-share yang schematics and know-how a la AX84 open-source community? i hope so para yung ibang enthusiasts like zook, me, at i'm sure marami pa, makasunod sa yapak mo (and not make the same mistakes, get good tips/best practices, etc.).
btw, tama ka about the Marshall transformers. i think "interleaved" is the term they call that type of winding. i've read the theory behind its sound and it did make a lot of sense. as for the tone control, i think you are referring to the Baxandall type of eq control, unlike the very common Fender style. i had a THD Univalve amp dati that had that type of tone control and it basically leaves the mid-range alone when you cut the bass and trebles, giving the impression of boosted mids. as you already know, Marshalls are renowned for those delicious mids.
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When I talk to the Boutique amp manufacturers, they are already so far away on the learning curve. They never claim they are ECE graduates or anything but tell you what works and what doesn't rather bluntly. Its when you actually try a product that you start to understand what they are after. Beyond schematics and parts, they are after magic and I have seen and heard what they can produce.
For example, Todd Sharp never claims ever that this specific model of a Vox AC30 is the best sounding but what he does claim is that the sound of the best vox that he has heard is in his head which none of us may even experience in our lifetime because of the limited number of good vintage sounding voxes will ever hear -- not all vintage voxes sound great. With regards to marshall, even the US guys will tell you only selected Marshall heads of even the vintage variety sound great and they are careful which specific model to blueprint and copy. Its is true that something can be judged as subjective but the key is to produce something that a great majority will judge as good sounding not only by yourself. What you are thinking about, I thought myself a long time ago until I realized that I don't have the ears for it and more importantly we are not exposed to the great guitarists of our times in the Philippines. If you ever talk to Van Halen, Brad Gilis, Larry Carlton, Eric Clapton, Steve Lukather, George Lynch, John Petrucci, Scott Henderson or SRV -- you get the point, then lets start making amps. These guys are musicians who are known to work with Amp makers and we lose out on that.
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Titser Marco,
I have never liked Fender Amps. But I am willing to try out Victoria. The best clean channel I have heard is Rivera's clean channel on this TBR models and the bright low gain of a Vox AC30. I am not trying to be colonial but rather indicative of who is what I consider leading edge in terms of guitar amp development. Beyond features, guitar amp manufacturers are now looking at magic -- the ability to inspire to play as their selling point. Do not mistake my being colonial -- I am just trying to be frank. I still think Filipinas are one of the most beautiful women in the world and so are the girls of Destiny's Child. An amp's real merit I believe is its ability to inspire if not all at least a great majority of guitarists who plug into it.
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just a question oasgomez, just to make sure i understand where you're comming from.
you judge an amp based on what others think sounds good or based on what you think sounds good?
it just crossed my mind because of this line
".... I thought myself a long time ago until I realized that I don't have the ears for it...."
just clarifying. thanks
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hi bamf, suggestion lang sir, why not "disect" existing parts (output trannies, or even an actual amp), maybe try to find sponsors? :D
for Vox AC30, they are cathode biased ("class a" though not really) EL84 amps and they have SEVERAL, CHEAPER (not necessarily inferior) clones, like Crate V3112 and Laney VC30, might want to take at look at them too. Meron din mas mahal and much complex such as the Mesa Lonestar Special hehe.
good luck! :)
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Okay guys, baka sabihin nyo pinapasakay ko lang kayo :D So here's a soundclip of the El Tubero preamp. Good lessons learned here en route to building my first tubo amp. Including NEVER PUT THE PLATE VOLTAGE ON THE END OF A TERMINAL STRIP WHICH HAS THE MOUNTING SCREW ON IT (this buzzed me with 300+ volts a couple of times before I figgered out why). Hehehe. Meron palang mga Sovtek na tubo sa Audiophile ! Nyehehehe. At mura lang yung iba, yung 6550 na allparts, parang 1 k lang for a matched pair ! Power tubes yun ! China nga lang, pero the goal is an affordable, if not cheap, tube amp. Meron ding mahal, 5 thou ang isang piraso (nobayan!!!)
Anyways, eto sya. I flatted all EQ, somehow I can't get it to quack (must be in the mids or highs section which got cut out). Here are the parameters that may color the sound :
1. Guitar- RJ PRS copy with el cheapo Lazer Humbucker on bridge pickup.
2. All EQ is flat
3. Miked 6 inches away
4. Main amp is a JR50. Actually, not really coz I already pulled out the power amp section of this beast and replaced it with a 100 Watt solid state power amp module. Anyway, it should be "solid-state linear".
5. Mic is a Hyundai from a videoke machine
6. No reverb (the JR50 doesnt have it anyway).
7. Gain setting is somewhere between 1/4 and 1/3. Higher settings are unusable because of a "whistling" sound that ensues when you strum.
8. Input mixer/mic preamp is a 4-input el cheapo china mixer
http://rapidshare.de/files/12342555/eltubero.mp3.html
Okay na din...sounds good...albeit, it still needs some modifications to the final 1/2 of the 12AX7. Needs a lower bias resistor to it can handle the high signal feed from the first half of the tube without choking out. Kumbaga, we love tubes coz they "breathe" kaso eto parang me hika, kinakapos ng hininga at high gain settings. :D . Hindi ako nakabili ng capacitors for the Marshall tone stack, masyado maliliit at walang stock ang malapit na electronics store. I'll try Raon a little later today and finish this monster.
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Glassjaw,
I actually rely on both. I cannot entirely depend on my ears because I have to assess whether what I am hearing can also be heard by others. Each of us has a different way of hearing things. This is my bias: I am in favor of boutique amps and some of the older stuff. This means I talk to and deal with high end US amp retailers, Ultrasound on the East Coast and Amp Shop in the West Coast. They have and I mean have the best sounding amps in the world under one roof. Specially Ultrasound.
I rely on them to give an honest assessment of an amp because: they have everything or close to tried everything -- they have 5 dumbles I think and several Komets, Bruno, Diezels, VHTs, Bad Cats, CAAs, Matchless, Alessandro, Victorias, Marshalls and even some Peaveys, etc...., they have soundproof rehearsal rooms, they dont have degrees in engineering so to they tend to be more honest because no matter how expensive an amp -- they will tell you if it sounds lousy, they always ask for your type of music and are sensitive to what particular sound you want, most importantly they have a real vintage Gibson 59 sunburst to test and calibrate their amps. I thought initially it would be cool to have a KOMET because I heard they were sensitive amps and I felt I would be ASTIG sa Philippines but Ultrasound discouraged me and insisted that I get the Diezel Herbert because they felt it was a better amp for the music that I wanted. They were also concerned about the operating level and felt the Diezel sounded good at any volume versus the KOMET which only sounded good when cranked which they felt was really loud and not for the Philippine situation. Given that set up, how can we with our limitations pretend to know how the real good amps sound? We talk about the elusive sound of Voxes and Marshalls that we want to copy but they have 5 Dumbles to plug in anytime of day and vintage Voxes and Marshalls are just plain vanilla and they are selective about those too.
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When I talk to the Boutique amp manufacturers, they are already so far away on the learning curve. They never claim they are ECE graduates or anything but tell you what works and what doesn't rather bluntly. Its when you actually try a product that you start to understand what they are after. Beyond schematics and parts, they are after magic and I have seen and heard what they can produce.
For example, Todd Sharp never claims ever that this specific model of a Vox AC30 is the best sounding but what he does claim is that the sound of the best vox that he has heard is in his head which none of us may even experience in our lifetime because of the limited number of good vintage sounding voxes will ever hear -- not all vintage voxes sound great. With regards to marshall, even the US guys will tell you only selected Marshall heads of even the vintage variety sound great and they are careful which specific model to blueprint and copy. Its is true that something can be judged as subjective but the key is to produce something that a great majority will judge as good sounding not only by yourself. What you are thinking about, I thought myself a long time ago until I realized that I don't have the ears for it and more importantly we are not exposed to the great guitarists of our times in the Philippines. If you ever talk to Van Halen, Brad Gilis, Larry Carlton, Eric Clapton, Steve Lukather, George Lynch, John Petrucci, Scott Henderson or SRV -- you get the point, then lets start making amps. These guys are musicians who are known to work with Amp makers and we lose out on that.
Forgive me if I might sound a little abrasive...but...so what's the point ? I already know that Marshalls are not made equal, Marshall heaven (to me) is a JCM 800 (and a very specific unit which I don't know where it is right now) with TSL's in close second, and Marshall hell to me are the Valvestates (specially MIJ ones) and my own G15R. But they're still Marshalls and I will love them over any fender or Peavey. Again that's just me.
From your line of reasoning again, my amp might not be the best amp but it might be the best sounding amp TO ME (or not). It's gravy if other musicians within my reach will appreciate it too. If not, then I won't commercialize and just enjoy my creations by myself. So what's your point ?
As for Lukather, Van Halen, Clapton, of course I respect them and they are my guitar heroes. But I am not seeking their validation and if they tell me that I can't build an amp, or at least even try, then I'll tell them to kiss my brown, hairy, all-Pinoy arse.
This is quite ironic coming from a guy who claims to objectively hear the difference between an ordinary cheapo resistor and a Riken Ohm. You can't tell a good amp from a bad one ? Please don't inflict upon me nor anyone else your own self-created limitations.
Okay, I'll just summarize what I believe is your point, and in no uncertain terms. I think I can do it, or learn it, or approach it, and am going...while you told yourself that you don't have the ears for it and stopped. Like I said, it's the journey, not just the destination.
Warmest.
BAMF
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Glassjaw,
I actually rely on both. I cannot entirely depend on my ears because I have to assess whether what I am hearing can also be heard by others. Each of us has a different way of hearing things. This is my bias: I am in favor of boutique amps and some of the older stuff. This means I talk to and deal with high end US amp retailers, Ultrasound on the East Coast and Amp Shop in the West Coast. They have and I mean have the best sounding amps in the world under one roof. Specially Ultrasound.
I rely on them to give an honest assessment of an amp because: they have everything or close to tried everything -- they have 5 dumbles I think and several Komets, Bruno, Diezels, VHTs, Bad Cats, CAAs, Matchless, Alessandro, Victorias, Marshalls and even some Peaveys, etc...., they have soundproof rehearsal rooms, they dont have degrees in engineering so to they tend to be more honest because no matter how expensive an amp -- they will tell you if it sounds lousy, they always ask for your type of music and are sensitive to what particular sound you want, most importantly they have a real vintage Gibson 59 sunburst to test and calibrate their amps. I thought initially it would be cool to have a KOMET because I heard they were sensitive amps and I felt I would be ASTIG sa Philippines but Ultrasound discouraged me and insisted that I get the Diezel Herbert because they felt it was a better amp for the music that I wanted. They were also concerned about the operating level and felt the Diezel sounded good at any volume versus the KOMET which only sounded good when cranked which they felt was really loud and not for the Philippine situation. Given that set up, how can we with our limitations pretend to know how the real good amps sound? We talk about the elusive sound of Voxes and Marshalls that we want to copy but they have 5 Dumbles to plug in anytime of day and vintage Voxes and Marshalls are just plain vanilla and they are selective about those too.
Amp Shop sucks. It's a small mom and pop store in the corner of Ventura and Woodman( close to my place of work)....I know the place ...I went there to ask for estimate to bias my amp.....assholes.
....$45 dollars to bias an amp 2 week waiting period ....geeeesh..
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ey man...i'll bias your amp! hehehe...
jesus effin' christ...so what if you don't have the best tone out there? just play yer godd@mn geetars! tone is in the fingers, ...so what if you never ever hear them "bowteeeq" amplifiers? i hate these effin' tone snobs...it's not about the equipment, these are just toys...it's about you, the player...inspiration comes from within yourself, not within the amp! when you hear a great song, a great solo, whatever, you don't go "if i only had HIS equipment, his bowteeeq amps, i could be inspired to write something that will be a hit, but i don't...so i'm not inspired."...that's BS...
so i'm gonna stop ramblin' on right here because it's off topic...
anyway, BAMF...make that amp and make it sound good to YOU...i fully support what you're doing...kaya din nating mga pinoy yan...inspite what other snobs say...
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ey man...i'll bias your amp! hehehe...
jesus effin' christ...so what if you don't have the best tone out there? just play yer godd@mn geetars! tone is in the fingers, ...so what if you never ever hear them "bowteeeq" amplifiers? i hate these effin' tone snobs...it's not about the equipment, these are just toys...it's about you, the player...inspiration comes from within yourself, not within the amp! when you hear a great song, a great solo, whatever, you don't go "if i only had HIS equipment, his bowteeeq amps, i could play that thing too, but i don't...so i'm not inspired."...that's BS...
so i'm gonna stop ramblin' on right here because it's off topic...
anyway, BAMF...make that amp and make it sound good to YOU...i fully support what you're doing...kaya din nating mga pinoy yan...inspite what other snobs say...
=D> \:D/ :-({|=
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ey man...i'll bias your amp! hehehe...
jesus effin' christ...so what if you don't have the best tone out there? just play yer godd@mn geetars! tone is in the fingers, ...so what if you never ever hear them "bowteeeq" amplifiers? i hate these effin' tone snobs...it's not about the equipment, these are just toys...it's about you, the player...inspiration comes from within yourself, not within the amp! when you hear a great song, a great solo, whatever, you don't go "if i only had HIS equipment, his bowteeeq amps, i could play that thing too, but i don't...so i'm not inspired."...that's BS...
so i'm gonna stop ramblin' on right here because it's off topic...
anyway, BAMF...make that amp and make it sound good to YOU...i fully support what you're doing...kaya din nating mga pinoy yan...inspite what other snobs say...
I had it biased for $20 while I wait by an amp tech here in my area. ( www.tone-man.com ) ...Don...stand-up guy...explains everything to you while he's doing it.
Anyways, I had to learn how to bias my amp though.....I know now how to do it.
BAMF....do it. Let us know how it all works out.
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haha...same here...i learned by watching the guy bias my amp! saves a whole but t load of money...hehehe...what's the setting of yoru bias now?
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haha...same here...i learned by watching the guy bias my amp! saves a whole but t load of money...hehehe...what's the setting of yoru bias now?
...I'm happy with 32mA per tube right now in my Carvin MTS3212 combo. The Legacy is still in stock bias....meaning "cold"....but I'm happy with the tone I'm getting right now....no need to touch that.
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So here's a soundclip of the El Tubero preamp.
sir, sayang di namin majudge based on the clip. low quality ata ang pagkarecord and, c'mon! i'm sure you can play better than that. :)
pero initial observation, manipis at buzzy ang tunog.
the good thing is, it produces a sound :)
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oasegomez, i get your point. but don't you think we have enough world class musicians to rely on when it comes to judging good tone? for me kasi, medyo limiting yung approach mo. you will never consider a locally produced amp even if maraming magsasabi na maganda ang tunog nya. because, as you've said, you think we're not exposed enough. i might be wrong but following your logic, that may be the case.
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oasegomez, i get your point. but don't you think we have enough world class musicians to rely on when it comes to judging good tone? for me kasi, medyo limiting yung approach mo. you will never consider a locally produced amp even if maraming magsasabi na maganda ang tunog nya. because, as you've said, you think we're not exposed enough. i might be wrong but following your logic, that may be the case.
expose to what? ALL the botique amps?....you must be crazy.
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Phil, i think you misunderstood my post.
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Phil, i think you misunderstood my post.
sorry about that....so who's saying....we should try ALL botique amps to know what is good or bad then? Honestly speaking, when I buy an amp....I go to the store and play the hell out of it and don't rely on what this salesperson or amp tech (specially doing mods) says....his "good sound" might not be MY "good sound"....especially here in LA...a lot of crazy people here. :D
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BAMF,
Simple Message: Wanna build good sounding amps? Get exposed.
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Whew... it's getting hot in here 8) . Could it the tubes in BAMF's pre-amp? Or just the heat comming from all these post, :-k , hehe.
BAMF... katulad ng sabi ni Glassjaw, medyo manipis ang tunog. But then again... you created the thing to make some sound. I think that alone deserves a commendation =D> You actually initiated the work. Can anybody honestlly say that they made their own amp in this forum., I sure can't. And I'm not gonna because I have no clue what to do, #-o hehe. Go ahead BOI :shock: !!!Get them tubes burnin'. It's your creation. If it sounds good to your ears then that's great. YOu can't make eveybody happy so just make yourself happy :lol: . Plus, you don't want to sound like any other amps out there, you want to have your own sound. The BAMF sound, tada!!! :-({|=
Punta nalang sa BOTIKA, tagay ng Corex D, tapos gawa ng amp. O, e di may BOTIKA amp ka na, hahaha :lol: Sensya na mga bossing, this rambling is brought to you by excess lack of sleep, :mrgreen:
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Phil,
I understand that the Amp Shop may be expensive when it comes to biasing. But more importantly, did you try out their amps?
I bought my Soldano and Bogner from Ampshop. Gary of Ampshop rushed soldano to get a customized SLO100 in under two weeks wired for Philippine 220 volts. Gary also pestered bogner for an Uberschall wired for Philippine 220 volts. Both heads were ready for pickup within 2 weeks from the date of downpayment.
Soldano customer support was on top of the whole order process and made sure that from the date of the downpayment, they knew what I wanted. Bogner for their part was able to find a European wired 220 in their inventory, so they immediately sent that to Ampshop.
Now thats what I call customer service given that these are custom amps and not readily available.
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Phil, i think you misunderstood my post.
sorry about that....so who's saying....we should try ALL botique amps to know what is good or bad then? Honestly speaking, when I buy an amp....I go to the store and play the hell out of it and don't rely on what this salesperson or amp tech (specially doing mods) says....his "good sound" might not be MY "good sound"....especially here in LA...a lot of crazy people here. :D
Hey!!! I told you my Psychiatrist discharged me last week and said that my tendency and sudden urge to kill can now be controlled by medications. Now... if I can just find that medicine bottle... :lol:
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Markflo,
When I talk about equipment, I am assuming the baseline is that you already have tone in your fingers. So, dont skew the topic. The topic is: If I play on a Korean Hot Cabs amp versus a Soldano SLO100, there will be a tonal difference very much in favor of the Soldano. Period. Thats the message.
Now since you mentioned that tone is in the fingers, so if you want to change tone, what do you do now? Cut off your fingers? You don't. You either change guitar, guitar parts, amp or effects.
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Glassjaw,
What I am saying is that to really say an amp sounds good, we have to compare and AB. Unfortunately, the guys in the U.S. and other European countries have a super head start because they have been exposed and doon nagsimula ang tubes right? Mga RCA and GE circuits ang naunang tube amp di ba? Saan nangaling iyon? U.S.A di ba -- mas attuned na sila sa tunog ng tube amp. First tube amp pa lang nga ni BAMF -- siya pa nga ang first local producer ng RP made tube amp pang hobby pa muna walang intention sa commercial production as of today. I am not discounting that BAMF can produce something good down the line but I believe thats very far. The funny thing is that we want to make our own tube amp pero magtatanong sa tunog ng Vox or Hiwatt. Labo talaga. Kung gusto Vox, dapat email tayo kay Cornell, kung gusto Hiwatt dapat email tayo sa Hiwatt o sa anak ni Harry Joyce.
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Hmmm, exposure helps but it's not a necessity.
BAMF,
Simple Message: Wanna build good sounding amps? Get exposed.
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BAMF,
Simple Message: Wanna build good sounding amps? Get exposed.
Simple answer that you can't seem to comprehend. I AM EXPOSED AND I KNOW WHAT I WANT. And it's a Marshall JCM 800 sound.
What part of this can't you understand ? You seem to speak good English.
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Glassjaw,
What I am saying is that to really say an amp sounds good, we have to compare and AB. Unfortunately, the guys in the U.S. and other European countries have a super head start because they have been exposed and doon nagsimula ang tubes right? Mga RCA and GE circuits ang naunang tube amp di ba? Saan nangaling iyon? U.S.A di ba -- mas attuned na sila sa tunog ng tube amp. First tube amp pa lang nga ni BAMF -- siya pa nga ang first local producer ng RP made tube amp pang hobby pa muna walang intention sa commercial production as of today. I am not discounting that BAMF can produce something good down the line but I believe thats very far. The funny thing is that we want to make our own tube amp pero magtatanong sa tunog ng Vox or Hiwatt. Labo talaga. Kung gusto Vox, dapat email tayo kay Cornell, kung gusto Hiwatt dapat email tayo sa Hiwatt o sa anak ni Harry Joyce.
point taken. thanks
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BAMF,
Simple Message: Wanna build good sounding amps? Get exposed.
Simple answer that you can't seem to comprehend. I AM EXPOSED AND I KNOW WHAT I WANT. And it's a Marshall JCM 800 sound.
What part of this can't you understand ? You seem to speak good English.
mismo pre...screw exposure its the passion that counts and the drive to get that sound in your head 8) GOOD LUCK
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Whew... it's getting hot in here 8) . Could it the tubes in BAMF's pre-amp? Or just the heat comming from all these post, :-k , hehe.
BAMF... katulad ng sabi ni Glassjaw, medyo manipis ang tunog. But then again... you created the thing to make some sound. I think that alone deserves a commendation =D> You actually initiated the work. Can anybody honestlly say that they made their own amp in this forum., I sure can't. And I'm not gonna because I have no clue what to do, #-o hehe. Go ahead BOI :shock: !!!Get them tubes burnin'. It's your creation. If it sounds good to your ears then that's great. YOu can't make eveybody happy so just make yourself happy :lol: . Plus, you don't want to sound like any other amps out there, you want to have your own sound. The BAMF sound, tada!!! :-({|=
Punta nalang sa BOTIKA, tagay ng Corex D, tapos gawa ng amp. O, e di may BOTIKA amp ka na, hahaha :lol: Sensya na mga bossing, this rambling is brought to you by excess lack of sleep, :mrgreen:
Ah Stratman Bro, speaking words of wisdom, as always...
soldering different pickup combination is a challenge na for me, gagawa pa ng amp, unthinkable! BAMF, go for it buddy, the result will either be good or bad, however, its the learning experience that comes along it that matters...
Do What Thou Wilt ... Alister Crowley
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Phil,
I understand that the Amp Shop may be expensive when it comes to biasing. But more importantly, did you try out their amps?
I bought my Soldano and Bogner from Ampshop. Gary of Ampshop rushed soldano to get a customized SLO100 in under two weeks wired for Philippine 220 volts. Gary also pestered bogner for an Uberschall wired for Philippine 220 volts. Both heads were ready for pickup within 2 weeks from the date of downpayment.
Soldano customer support was on top of the whole order process and made sure that from the date of the downpayment, they knew what I wanted. Bogner for their part was able to find a European wired 220 in their inventory, so they immediately sent that to Ampshop.
Now thats what I call customer service given that these are custom amps and not readily available.
...tell you this...I won't ever go back to that store....mga swappang mga tao don.....they treat you really good 'coz you were buying expensive stuff from them. I'd rather go to Guitar Center....mas friendly pa mga tao don....And if I do save up the money to buy me Bogner or Soldano? ...I won't ever go through that shop...I'd bring my business to another FRIENDLY store.
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yea dude, but thing is...not alot of people have access to these boutique amps, y'see? we here in the US, of course, have access to them...but MOST people don't...so what you're basically saying to everyone here is ..."none of you have great tone because none of you have these oh so great boutique amps that i have" and "none of you are exposed because you haven't heard my oh so great boutique amps" well....good for you, dude...what? do we start worshipping you and your amps now?
comparing hot cabs with a soldano is just plain f%$%'n stupid really...but see, you don't need to spend $3000+ bucks on an amp to get a great sound...there's alot of "normal" priced amps out there that will deliver the goods just the same...you make it sound like your boutique amps are the be all, end all of all amplifiers....i got news for you, they're not!
what i don't care for is amp snobs like you who think that your uberschall's and shiva's and matchless amps are the only access to great tone...sure they're great amps...i'll give you that, but you can get great tone from mid priced amps as well...i think about 99% of these people will agree...
now about cutting my fingers, that's just real bad analogy man...that would be equivalent to turning the amp's eq off...not changing the tone...y'know what i do when i wanna change the tone? I PLAY WITH THE EQ OF THE AMP! THAT'S WHAT IT'S THERE FOR!
you can change your tone with tubes, speakers, guitars, picks, strings, etc etc....effects....these are all true...these will probably cost you a few hundred bucks...
but guess what? even if you shell out a car's downpayment's worth for your so called boutique amps, you're still gonna buy the above mentioned items! that's just plain ridiculous...
if you're touring the world as a musician... $3000 is a piece of cake...but other than that...making that decision is just borderlining on either pure excessiveness/plain s t u p i d i t y...
btw, before you dismiss this as an envious outcry...i'll be the first to tell you...it's not...i have all the gear i need...its total cost is probably less than the cost of one of your amp's grille cloths...but it sounds great....BECAUSE I SAY SO...
Markflo,
When I talk about equipment, I am assuming the baseline is that you already have tone in your fingers. So, dont skew the topic. The topic is: If I play on a Korean Hot Cabs amp versus a Soldano SLO100, there will be a tonal difference very much in favor of the Soldano. Period. Thats the message.
Now since you mentioned that tone is in the fingers, so if you want to change tone, what do you do now? Cut off your fingers? You don't. You either change guitar, guitar parts, amp or effects.
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Yo guys. Thanks for the encouragement, it's truly appreciated.
I just finished as in closed the case on the El Tubero. It's got the Marshall Tone stack now and now, I can again hear that "quack-quack" (or is it "thwack-thwack"?) .
Funny design that Tone Stack is. The pots are in series, such that if you bottom out the treble and/or bass, the mid (which is at the last stage) actually gets boosted and emphasized, as opposed to just separately cutting out the treble and bass and mids. The pots actually interact with each other ! Ingenious work by Marshall engineers considering the technology they had at the time :D. Now I'm appreciatin' :D .
Inserting the Marshall Tone Stack between the triode halves also "tamed" whe wild 12AX7's gain by introducing some insertion loss. Now, there's no more whistling, no more breath-catching and no more unusable area with the gain control's "twist". No wild buzzing caused by too much saturation either. And most of all, it's approaching the brown tone...that signature "squeeze my balls hard" sound (ipit) from a Marshall. I'm happy. I think this will also make other guitarists happy. But I won't stop here yet :D. It still lacks that tube "hahhhh" breathing sound which comes from the interaction of the output transformer, speaker and power tubes (so I'm told anyway). Hmmm...I'm getting a couple more ideas. What if I insert a small output transformer at the 12AX7's output and insert a 16 ohm wirewound (and hence inductive) dummy load resistor at the secondary and tap the audio output from there ? That should give that non-linear interaction. Interesting thought. But I'll sleep on it for now.
It's like 1 am. My neighbours will put out a contract on me if I record a soundclip now. I'll do it tomorrow after waking up.
Thanks guys.
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BAMF,
Simple Message: Wanna build good sounding amps? Get exposed.
Simple answer that you can't seem to comprehend. I AM EXPOSED AND I KNOW WHAT I WANT. And it's a Marshall JCM 800 sound.
What part of this can't you understand ? You seem to speak good English.
yup. damn right. to each his own.
ey man...i'll bias your amp! hehehe...
jesus effin' christ...so what if you don't have the best tone out there? just play yer godd@mn geetars! tone is in the fingers, ...so what if you never ever hear them "bowteeeq" amplifiers? i hate these effin' tone snobs...it's not about the equipment, these are just toys...it's about you, the player...inspiration comes from within yourself, not within the amp! when you hear a great song, a great solo, whatever, you don't go "if i only had HIS equipment, his bowteeeq amps, i could be inspired to write something that will be a hit, but i don't...so i'm not inspired."...that's BS...
so i'm gonna stop ramblin' on right here because it's off topic...
anyway, BAMF...make that amp and make it sound good to YOU...i fully support what you're doing...kaya din nating mga pinoy yan...inspite what other snobs say...
amen...
weird comparison on one of the posts here. korean hot cabs then soldano/botique amps? pertty far off to prove a point. price wise. tone wise. quality...um..hehe...now i feel stupid reading that part. on the other hand, it could get worse. every tried a marshall v40? good tone. very very good tone. y? coz i said so too.
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Yo guys. Thanks for the encouragement, it's truly appreciated.
I just finished as in closed the case on the El Tubero. It's got the Marshall Tone stack now and now, I can again hear that "quack-quack" (or is it "thwack-thwack"?) .
Funny design that Tone Stack is. The pots are in series, such that if you bottom out the treble and/or bass, the mid (which is at the last stage) actually gets boosted and emphasized, as opposed to just separately cutting out the treble and bass and mids. The pots actually interact with each other ! Ingenious work by Marshall engineers considering the technology they had at the time :D. Now I'm appreciatin' :D .
Inserting the Marshall Tone Stack between the triode halves also "tamed" whe wild 12AX7's gain by introducing some insertion loss. Now, there's no more whistling, no more breath-catching and no more unusable area with the gain control's "twist". No wild buzzing caused by too much saturation either. And most of all, it's approaching the brown tone...that signature "squeeze my balls hard" sound (ipit) from a Marshall. I'm happy. I think this will also make other guitarists happy. But I won't stop here yet :D. It still lacks that tube "hahhhh" breathing sound which comes from the interaction of the output transformer, speaker and power tubes (so I'm told anyway). Hmmm...I'm getting a couple more ideas. What if I insert a small output transformer at the 12AX7's output and insert a 16 ohm wirewound (and hence inductive) dummy load resistor at the secondary and tap the audio output from there ? That should give that non-linear interaction. Interesting thought. But I'll sleep on it for now.
It's like 1 am. My neighbours will put out a contract on me if I record a soundclip now. I'll do it tomorrow after waking up.
Thanks guys.
..send that "piece of work" to me and Mark and we'll give it a good work out....well...Mark can make it sound like a $5000 amp.
...just kidding dude :wink:
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Wha ! My baby !!! Sent over to the West Coast ? Waaaahhh!!! Heheheh. But it's just a preamp sir, I doubt if it can match a real deal tube amp.
Seriously, if anyone wants to listen to it first hand, just contact me and I'll let you give it a spin here in my workshop. Still got that annoying 60 Hz buzz tho', but not as bad as before. Maybe an AC Choke coil will fix that. Hey wait...I got a couple of those. Uh-oh. Does this mean I'll open her up again ? Oh well...perfection is a journey :D.
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Phil,
I understand that the Amp Shop may be expensive when it comes to biasing. But more importantly, did you try out their amps?
I bought my Soldano and Bogner from Ampshop. Gary of Ampshop rushed soldano to get a customized SLO100 in under two weeks wired for Philippine 220 volts. Gary also pestered bogner for an Uberschall wired for Philippine 220 volts. Both heads were ready for pickup within 2 weeks from the date of downpayment.
Soldano customer support was on top of the whole order process and made sure that from the date of the downpayment, they knew what I wanted. Bogner for their part was able to find a European wired 220 in their inventory, so they immediately sent that to Ampshop.
Now thats what I call customer service given that these are custom amps and not readily available.
...tell you this...I won't ever go back to that store....mga swappang mga tao don.....they treat you really good 'coz you were buying expensive stuff from them. I'd rather go to Guitar Center....mas friendly pa mga tao don....And if I do save up the money to buy me Bogner or Soldano? ...I won't ever go through that shop...I'd bring my business to another FRIENDLY store.
Hey I was there at Gutiar Center Holly last week (my weekly trek, hehe :wink: ) and I notice that they are carrying Soldanos and Bogners now. Not a boutique guy. Can't recall them model names. I'm not really sold with the Soldano sound but I like the Bogner a lot. Phil... there you go. You can get the boutique amp through decent, friendly sales people that will treat you right not because your paying them lots of money but because you are a customer, a musician, and a person regardless of whether you give $50.00 or $50,000.00. Wow :shock: words of wisdom again. Sometimes I amaze myself, hehe :lol:
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Wow :shock: words of wisdom again. Sometimes I amaze myself, hehe :lol:
ganyan talaga pag lumaki sa paranaque :mrgreen:
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Wow :shock: words of wisdom again. Sometimes I amaze myself, hehe :lol:
ganyan talaga pag lumaki sa paranaque :mrgreen:
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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whew, mainit si flo. easy lang dude :)
uwi ka na lang dito, kulang tayo ng instrumental rock dito eh. :)
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hahahahaha!
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Mark... meng... cool na cool ka kaninang tanghali ng nagkita tayo, ah. Anong nangyari? Kulang bang bayad ko? Hehehe.
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i see someone getting real popular around here. :lol:
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ditto :lol:
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byuti is in the eye of the beholder....it's my sound my music my soul not their's....ehemehem...
to all the pipol who hunger for higher learnings....mabuhay kayow!
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Funny design that Tone Stack is. The pots are in series, such that if you bottom out the treble and/or bass, the mid (which is at the last stage) actually gets boosted and emphasized, as opposed to just separately cutting out the treble and bass and mids. The pots actually interact with each other ! Ingenious work by Marshall engineers considering the technology they had at the time :D. Now I'm appreciatin' :D .
I guess it is a Baxandall tone circuit, then, as mentioned in my previous post. I'm interested to confirm this in terms of actual circuitry but I'm not an engineer. I-google mo yung 'baxandall tone circuit' and you'll some basic schems. Let me know naman kung pareho talaga. I'm very interested to settle that question I've had in my mind from a technical stand point.
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Mark... meng... cool na cool ka kaninang tanghali ng nagkita tayo, ah. Anong nangyari? Kulang bang bayad ko? Hehehe.
you guys met already? I've been chatting with Mark for a long time now and I haven't met this dude......kailan next EB natin?
Dan....are you and Mark....... ahhhmmmmm? What were you guys doing?:wink:
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heheh...kinuha ni dan kahapon yung small clone...pasensya na sir dan...medyo nagmamadali ako kahapon....30 mins lang lunch ko nun eh...eh baka mangayayat ako..hehehe
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Phil... wag ka nang magselos. Hindi naman kami "BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN", eh, hehe :lol: . Hayaan mo, sa next jam eb natin, iyong iyo na si Mark, hahaha :lol:
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Phil... wag ka nang magselos. Hindi naman kami "BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN", eh, hehe :lol: . Hayaan mo, sa next jam eb natin, iyong iyo na si Mark, hahaha :lol:
bwahahahah...Dan don't tell me you watched that movie, dude. :?
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AHAHAAAY MGA FAFA BROKEBACK MOUNTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEYNN! HEHEHE...buti nalang napanood na ng asawa ko..di ko na siya kelangan samahan...
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Mark... your so kind. I only needed 5 minutes but30 minutes was plenty, hahaha :oops: :P .
Anyways... tama ng kalokohan nyo. Speaking of jam eb. Si room335 daw gustong sumali. Kelan tayo mag set? Meron pa ba kayong alm na sasama? Rent natin yong malaking studio sa Sound Arena, tagay-tagay naman, eh. ANo? Game ba kayo?
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game ako diyan!
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super duper game ako dyan mga gwapings? sino ba sya (room335)Dan ? gwaping ba? ...sama ba si Jo?
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:?: :?: :?: May grupo jazz,blues style. Site is www.mpgproject.com. Mukang maayos naman. Try natin. Mas marami mas masaya.
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uy mpgproject..... ok bassist nyan ah.. si miko...
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uy mpgproject..... ok bassist nyan ah.. si miko...
Kala ko nasa paranaque ka? Si Gerry ba ang room335?
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uy mpgproject..... ok bassist nyan ah.. si miko...
Kala ko nasa paranaque ka? Si Gerry ba ang room335?
hehe.. yup.. sa paranaque ako... officemate ko dati yan si miko.. he's now working in the US office - same company pa rin namin
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oic.
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what a disappointment... i was checking this thread for the vitriol and mudslinging but now it turned gay. pffft! ;-) :lol:
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Funny design that Tone Stack is. The pots are in series, such that if you bottom out the treble and/or bass, the mid (which is at the last stage) actually gets boosted and emphasized, as opposed to just separately cutting out the treble and bass and mids. The pots actually interact with each other ! Ingenious work by Marshall engineers considering the technology they had at the time :D. Now I'm appreciatin' :D .
I guess it is a Baxandall tone circuit, then, as mentioned in my previous post. I'm interested to confirm this in terms of actual circuitry but I'm not an engineer. I-google mo yung 'baxandall tone circuit' and you'll some basic schems. Let me know naman kung pareho talaga. I'm very interested to settle that question I've had in my mind from a technical stand point.
Looking at the baxandall's, I dunno, it kinda doesnt look the same. Here's the circuit for the marshall tone stack that I used...just cut it before it goes to the coupling capacitor going to the line preamp. Notice how the treble, bass and midrange are in series, and as you roll the treble and bass towards ground, you're actually increasing current going into the midrange which I presume, boosts mids :
http://www.dogstar.dantimax.dk/tubestuf/dzart-8.htm
I'm thinking of adding a 3-10db gain stage before the tone stack using an FET. Maybe I can recover some of the lost drive due to the insertion loss.
Then...I found another great idea which I initially thought to be useless on the AX84 site :
http://195.178.239.50/ax84/media/ax84_m276.gif
It's a small 0.5 Watts power amp powered by one 12AU7 operating in push-pull. Just what I needed...a small power amp, powering an inductive wirewound resistor from which I can tap out a signal which I might be able to use in a solid state power section. Heck...methinks it's a great idea. If I can get that "hahhh" sound from it...okidoki na ! Plus it's a lower cost step rather than taking the full-tube plunge :D.
Edit: Yeah the FMV tone stack is a 3-knob Baxandall circuit pala.
Update : sinubukan ko gawin class A yung isang kalahati ng 12ax7 through a small output transformer. Numipis lalo tunog. Binalik ko sa dati.
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BAMF,
without any disrespect, but have you really heard what a good AC30 sounds like in person? If so, how many? If not, how do you know that you are voicing the correct sound?
this is my point... wala tayo sa position to make amps that sound good because we are not exposed... period
but we can always try :D maybe some day the marshalls and the fenders will give way to pinoy amp gurus :D
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what a disappointment... i was checking this thread for the vitriol and mudslinging but now it turned gay. pffft! ;-) :lol:
hahaha... delta naman oh. peace lang.
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Ready for submission !
Now since I don't think it would qualify for a tone party (ni wala pa ngang P 3,000 pesos ang halaga) , I'll have my band listen to it first, then maybe kanshooter, then...ahemm...Mr. Librero is it possible to meet you somehow, somewhere and maybe you an listen to this thing ? And tell me what you think of it ? I live quite close to Jun's place and do need to have a couple of guitars buzz-eliminated. What say you ? :D
One thing's for certain...the sh*tty JR amp sounds a lot sweeter with it !
BAMF
PS While soundclips are a good thing, there are too many permutations to the preamp, now having 6 knobs (gain, master, treble, mid, bass and solid-state drive) and two general settings (tube overdrive and solid-state clip). Plus, a soundclip will not capture the feel and dynamics that it brings.
I think my general direction right now is a very small tube amp, possibly this preamp configuration plus a small class B output stage (12AU7), "line-out" to a solid state amp. So far this early effort has been encouraging. Solid states are just so...cheap, ubiquitous, linear and robust. Like with any amp tinkerer, if I can get the authentic tube sound over solid states...well...:D.
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Ready for submission !
Like with any amp tinkerer, if I can get the authentic tube sound over solid states...well...:D.
niiiiiiiiiiice....hope i can hear it too.....or try it if its ok....galing dude...congratulations on your accomplishment...More power. Peace.
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Errr... why me? :lol:
Just about everyone else who's posted here are better judges than I am, actually. But hey, I always enjoy meeting people at Jun's house.
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Ready for submission !
Like with any amp tinkerer, if I can get the authentic tube sound over solid states...well...:D.
niiiiiiiiiiice....hope i can hear it too.....or try it if its ok....galing dude...congratulations on your accomplishment...More power. Peace.
Sure ! I'm free M-W-F afternoons. I live in Paco, Manila :D. Send me a PM and I'll return with my landline so I can tell you my exact coordinates :D.
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Errr... why me? :lol:
Just about everyone else who's posted here are better judges than I am, actually. But hey, I always enjoy meeting people at Jun's house.
Mmm...modest sir ha. :D . Maybe it's a question of credibility, and you got it in my book :D. And you tell things as it is, so if you say it's sh*tty, it's back to the drawing board for me :D. It's still got this hum...maybe because it's built inside a plastic case, but I'm interested in knowing what you'd think of it, hum aside :D
BAMF
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BAMF,
I'll be damned. You actually did it. Congrats dude on your new El Tubero amp! I'm happy for you. I will echo what deltaslim ealier said. If it's OK with you, maybe you can share your know-how with all of us. And maybe if you are no longer pressed for time, you could post a recap -- a mini HowTo of sorts -- of your first tube amp build.
Again, congrats and keep on tweaking until you get the ulimate Marchall tone!
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Pano naman kaming mga sumusunod ng kababanata dito na hindi makakapunta sa inyo? Gusto rin naming marinig ang final "READY FOR SUBMISSION" version ng El Tubero. This is one of those things that makes me proud to be a FILIPINO =D> , hehehe :lol: . BAMF, meron ka bang audio clip ng final version? Parinig naman. Gusto kong marinig ang gawang atin, hehehe.
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Dudes, El Tubero is just a tube preamp/overdrive ha :D.
First generation of my learning kumbaga. The output stage is still the JR amp. Next step ko is a small wattage amp 0.5 W line out to a solid state, then I'll finish up with either an EL84 based (18W) or 6550 (50w methinks). I've already canvassed and know na where to get all the parts...except the chassis punch which hopefully will save me from tons of drilling.
Next submission ko will be El Tubero II :D.
O sya, clips tonight. Wag nyo na ko hanapan ng riffs ha. G-Ionian scale lang saka strumming ng full chord saka power chord.
BAMF
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Go for the 6550 50 watters, man! Be loud, be proud!!!
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Dudes, El Tubero is just a tube preamp/overdrive ha :D.
First generation of my learning kumbaga. The output stage is still the JR amp. Next step ko is a small wattage amp 0.5 W line out to a solid state, then I'll finish up with either an EL84 based (18W) or 6550 (50w methinks). I've already canvassed and know na where to get all the parts...except the chassis punch which hopefully will save me from tons of drilling.
Next submission ko will be El Tubero II :D.
O sya, clips tonight. Wag nyo na ko hanapan ng riffs ha. G-Ionian scale lang saka strumming ng full chord saka power chord.
BAMF
kahit na "smoke on the water" intro para sa power chord riff....or Panama sa Van Halen.
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Dudes, El Tubero is just a tube preamp/overdrive ha :D.
First generation of my learning kumbaga. The output stage is still the JR amp. Next step ko is a small wattage amp 0.5 W line out to a solid state, then I'll finish up with either an EL84 based (18W) or 6550 (50w methinks). I've already canvassed and know na where to get all the parts...except the chassis punch which hopefully will save me from tons of drilling.
Next submission ko will be El Tubero II :D.
O sya, clips tonight. Wag nyo na ko hanapan ng riffs ha. G-Ionian scale lang saka strumming ng full chord saka power chord.
BAMF
kahit na "smoke on the water" intro para sa power chord riff....or Panama sa Van Halen.
Or... kahit na isang power chord lang... say... Em dim7th bb5th aug11th added9th ##15th or single E note at the 30th fret, hahaha :lol: :twisted: :shock: #-o =D>
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O mga ser. I finally got down to it. Here are three soundclips featuring na lang yung riffs ng "This Charming man" by The smiths.
Here it is, tube overdrive mode, no other effects :
http://rapidshare.de/files/12928818/tube_nofx_.mp3.html
Then here's the sound in solid state clip mode, no other effects :
http://rapidshare.de/files/12928893/ssclip_nofx__2_.mp3.html
Finally, turning on my zoom 505 in my "clean" preset (which is just a dash of chorus and reverb )
http://rapidshare.de/files/12928949/fx_ssclip.mp3.html
tone considerations :
All EQ controls flat, tube overdrive gain at 75%
Guitar is an Epiphone stratocaster, humbucker on bridge pickup
Pieces are finger-plucked.
Notes : I dunno if it's just how I miked it, but it really sounds buzzy on hard strumming. I think it's the sound of the tubes going into overdrive. Yan nga ang dynamics netong lintik na to. You can practically turn the distortion on and off just by how hard you strum.
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Eto pa mga sir. I'm not sure if my miking techniques are doing the preamp justice, but here's the "panama" opening bars, as requested. No other effects, just the preamp set on solid-state clip (which only means, putting an assymetrical diode clipping stage apart from the natural tube overdrive.
http://rapidshare.de/files/12930311/ssclipnofxpanama.mp3.html
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Wow!
BAMF, sayang na-miss ko entirely yung "lively" na diskusyon dito. Akala ko pa naman puro tech stuff pag uusapan, pati pala yung bagong bespren ng lahat nandito to give his thousands of dollars worth.
Tinatamad pa rin akong gumawa ng McTube. At saka magastos... Hehehehe.
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Wow!
BAMF, sayang na-miss ko entirely yung "lively" na diskusyon dito. Akala ko pa naman puro tech stuff pag uusapan, pati pala yung bagong bespren ng lahat nandito to give his thousands of dollars worth.
Tinatamad pa rin akong gumawa ng McTube. At saka magastos... Hehehehe.
Di masyado bro ! yung tubo lang ang single most expensive, 300 bux. Nakakita ako tube socket na mura, 35 bucks lang sa Watsons Electronics. Wala nga lang yung shroud, tube socket lang talaga sya. The rest of the parts mga 100 bucks lang (wag ka lang bibili ng Riken Ohm saka Oil in Paper caps lol). Case lagay mo na sa 100. Wire...mga 30 pesos.
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Eto pa mga sir. I'm not sure if my miking techniques are doing the preamp justice, but here's the "panama" opening bars, as requested. No other effects, just the preamp set on solid-state clip (which only means, putting an assymetrical diode clipping stage apart from the natural tube overdrive.
http://rapidshare.de/files/12930311/ssclipnofxpanama.mp3.html
cool.....awesome job, man.
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BAMF,
I'm currently scouting for a power transformer for my ax84 project. I contacted Kinetic Audio technologies and what they have is the Hammond output transformer (Hammond 125-DSE). The price if quite good too. However, the cost of the power transformer (Hammond 369-ex) is off the scale so I'm planning to have one hand-built.
Herein lies the problem. I don't know what to tell the builder. Looking at the schematics of Ax84, would I be able to tell the specs of the power transformer that I need? I also checked the specs of the ax84 power transformer (Hammond 369-ex) and these are the numbers that I got:
Total PWR (VA) - 45
Secondary (RPMS) - 190-0-190
DC (ma) - 65
Bias Tap (VAC) - 50
Filament #1 (VAC) - 6.3Vct @ 2.5A
So what do I tell the builder? Thanks!
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I think that information is enough. Basically when you get a power transformer wound, you just tell the winder what voltages you need and at what current. If possible, draw him a tap diagram. Like the info you gave tells me that the amp is around 30-40Watts in power. Your primary winding should be 220-0, secondary winding is 190-0-190 with a 50 v bias winding (don't have it tapped out of a center-tapped winding !!!!) with 6.3V tap for the heaters. I can draw the tap diagram for you, but even if I did I don't have a scanner.
Would you be interested in sharing a beer ? I've already decided on a 50 W Marshall with 6550 power tubes. Sabi nila hindi daw maganda ang tunog ng 6550, mas matigas ata but heck, it's more durable than the EL34 and if ever I 'd want go do that, I just need to change a few resistors.
Let's trade notes. I've already compiled sources for parts like auricaps, Rikens, even someone who can wind output transformers. Apparently there's a very active audiphile network here in the Philippines.
Here: www.wiredstate.com
By the way I'm already a member of www.cedist.com. Very reasonably priced for a company that's in the US ha ! Like 30W Marshall output transformers only go for 54 dollars, reverb tanks for 15 dollars etc. You can "joint purchase" some stuff with me. Tubes...ubusin muna natin yung mga NOS (NOS nga kaya ???Hmmm) sa Deeco, mura dun the 6L6 only costs 800 bucks and the 12AX7's, only P300. 6550's at Audiophile only cost less than 1,200 for a matched pair. Tapusin ko muna mga pedal projects ko...mas instant gratification e but I've started collecting stuff for my 50 W like tube sockets etc.
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I think that information is enough. Basically when you get a power transformer wound, you just tell the winder what voltages you need and at what current. If possible, draw him a tap diagram. Like the info you gave tells me that the amp is around 30-40Watts in power. Your primary winding should be 220-0, secondary winding is 190-0-190 with a 50 v bias winding (don't have it tapped out of a center-tapped winding !!!!) with 6.3V tap for the heaters. I can draw the tap diagram for you, but even if I did I don't have a scanner.
Many thanks for the info. I called up Mang Rod of wiredstate yesterday. Very nice chap. Unfortunately he has a lot of pending stuff. He referred me to Podmon in Legarda as well.
Would you be interested in sharing a beer ? I've already decided on a 50 W Marshall with 6550 power tubes. Sabi nila hindi daw maganda ang tunog ng 6550, mas matigas ata but heck, it's more durable than the EL34 and if ever I 'd want go do that, I just need to change a few resistors.
Sure, mahaba-habang inuman ito! For now I will not even attempt to look at the Marshall schematics. Ayoko ng sakit ng ulo! I just want the clean sound and the "simple design" of the Ax84 P1. Later on, pag natututo na ako, I will try to explore the high gain variants of Ax84.
Let's trade notes. I've already compiled sources for parts like auricaps, Rikens, even someone who can wind output transformers. Apparently there's a very active audiphile network here in the Philippines.
Here: www.wiredstate.com
Oo ba. Right now, I'm still in the gathering phase. I will share whatever interesting information and sources I could gather. A few days ago I reactivated my account at wiredstate. Last time I inquired about Hammond transformers, a guru-member referred me to an overseas supplier. It was too expensive back then. I was surprised to learn from you about the local supplier.
By the way I'm already a member of www.cedist.com. Very reasonably priced for a company that's in the US ha ! Like 30W Marshall output transformers only go for 54 dollars, reverb tanks for 15 dollars etc. You can "joint purchase" some stuff with me. Tubes...ubusin muna natin yung mga NOS (NOS nga kaya ???Hmmm) sa Deeco, mura dun the 6L6 only costs 800 bucks and the 12AX7's, only P300. 6550's at Audiophile only cost less than 1,200 for a matched pair. Tapusin ko muna mga pedal projects ko...mas instant gratification e but I've started collecting stuff for my 50 W like tube sockets etc.
Thanks for the offer. Pag wala talaga akong mahanap na piyesa dito sa Pinas, makiki-ride ako sa account mo! Didn't know Deeco sells tubes pala. I'm sure you've already come accross this thread in wiredstate about sellers of fake tubes based in Hong Kong: http://wiredstate.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8539