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Author Topic: your pc as a sound module(live application)  (Read 6112 times)

Offline abyssinianson

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #25 on: April 16, 2007, 12:09:35 PM »

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bt's been known to fake his live performances though
he is? where did you read that? from the times I have seen him live the guy has done his set live pretty much to the tee - remixes, glitches, messups and all. if I see him at a local gig i might ask the guy if there is truth to this..lol

its pretty much common knowledge at em411, livepa.org, dancetech and other production sites that the major players (chems, crystal method, bt, prodigy) mostly run off a dat with some triggering and knob twisting going on...orbital and autechre are one of the few who actually do it "live"...of course how live is "live" ba talaga when we're talking sequencers etc?

the reason being is that these guys have a huge operation going on and any live mishaps could result in less than favorable reviews which could damage their rep, theres just too much at stake to have a bad show...hence the reliance on dat

"the guy has done his set live pretty much to the tee" well see that would explain a lot...bt's music is really intricate and it would be a logistical nightmare to pull of every little tweak and stutter live...of course everyones using ableton now so i imagine that makes it much easier and they are probably doing a lot more "live" now

the epitome of live electronic for me is someone like squarepusher, it seems like he plays a lot of prerecorded tracks but theres a lot of live bass improv going on and live fx freekery



some things that i would like to note just to clarify things: since you mentioned Orbital, there is a bit of info I know about the group's live rig because they are one of the few electronica groups that still use a hardware sequencer for things that can't be played live with hardware synths. the model that they use is particular, the Alesis MMT-8 (KitC might know about these), which is basically like a drum machine that loops pre-produced loops that you use in tracks from the studio. Orbital are not alone in their use of hardware sequencers and the extent of how much is ona sequencer depends on what you you deem as the foundation of your tracks that you can play over with your synths.

the live use of sequencers by electronic acts is what sets people apart from being just plain DJs. so if you don't play records and do live remixing, this is as close to "live"playing as you are going to get. also, people might run audio off a dat but as far as I know you can't trigger audio off a dat because a dat is pretty much like a casette tape in principle. now, you could do triggering with rack mounted samplers like the stuff Akai has around that are still being widely used and I have done that with my midi keys and v-drum triggers.

"the guy has done his set live pretty much to the tee." this statement was meant to explain that BT has stayed pretty much true to the live ethic that has helped him gain fans, ie. he does live remixing and extended versions of songs with generous amounts of edits. he does DJ gigs once in a while too but his rig has stayed consistent (to a tee) when he does live shows. i saw his laptop symphony show and his setup is becoming smaller with only particular pieces of kit to do stutter edits live using a system similar to the laser MIDI detector on the Roland MC-505. as far as I know, BT, Electric Sky Church, Telefon Tel Aviv, DeepSky, Orbital, The Crystal Method still do a lot of live shows that vary quite a bit from set to set and use quite a bit of hardware gear.

Now there will always be elements that will need to be run off a sequencer, this much is inevitable. i know BT runs stutter edits with a live hardware interface and I can only imagine how easier it would make my life if I had that tool. If I could do that, I wouldn't run audio for stutter but manipulate it live instead. Stutter edits, depending on the syncopation of the clips, will take me anywhere from 30 minutes to two hours to complete...sheeeesh.

for me, the epitome of a live electronic show is Aphex Twin. A close second is Tokyo's Boom Boom Satellites. I saw these guys at the Zep in Tokyo and they are absolutely sick.
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Offline chuck sabbath

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #26 on: April 16, 2007, 01:09:29 PM »
the Alesis MMT-8

im as familiar with the mmt8 as anyone who doesnt actually own one can be :-) came close to buying one (or 2) before but i went with a kawai q80ex, also a well regarded "live" sequencer

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the live use of sequencers by electronic acts is what sets people apart from being just plain DJs

well yeah youre preaching to the choir here...i run the q80ex, triggering an a3000 sampler and various analog and digital synths, also play some keys live, lots of knob tweaking and triggering samples and i just picked up a drum machine for more live tweakery...of course i havent played out in a while...

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If I could do that, I wouldn't run audio for stutter but manipulate it live instead. Stutter edits, depending on the syncopation of the clips, will take me anywhere from 30 minutes to two hours to complete...sheeeesh

if youre not adverse to using computers live (or want to glitch out in the studio) check dbglitch, its freeware that makes it almost too easy...im not 100% enamored with glitch, but this is a fun piece of code...its midi controllable too, really cool

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for me, the epitome of a live electronic show is Aphex Twin

yeah richard james and tom jenkinson for me are really cut from the same cloth but squarepusher is just so over the top electronics mixed with live playing, so its s.pusher by a narrow margin for me 8-)
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Offline chuck sabbath

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #27 on: April 16, 2007, 01:11:05 PM »
i always end up thread jacking instead of starting my own threads :(
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Offline abyssinianson

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #28 on: April 17, 2007, 12:38:44 AM »
i tried dbglitch and I actualy use it for weird syncopation. Josh Eustis (Telefon Tel Aviv) turned me onto it a few years back. For a long time, I was really resistant to using lappys to do work on the road because most of my stuff is very much hardware based so i figured i couldn't do as much productively if i were sitting at home or in a studio environment. much has changed to say the least. there had to be something better to do waiting for flights to board than sleeping and reading everything the airport bookstore has to offer...

holy mackarel, a kawai q80ex? i haven't seen those in a while. if there is anything really good about hardware sequencers, it is that they will run like a lapdog consistently.

i haven't done a live electronic show in years. i mainly DJ these days because i do most of my live playing with an instrument versus doing the electronica bit now. i still love electronica but the ease of transporting guitar or bass gear is much better to watch over than multiple pieces of electronic kit. basically, i transitioned into more of a studio head years ago when the electronica/ warehouse rave underground began becoming more mainstream during the mid 90's in the US. the crowd began to change and there was more coporate tomfoolery going around than I liked to be associated with...
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Offline chuck sabbath

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #29 on: April 17, 2007, 08:18:57 AM »
i hear you...wala naman talagang electronic "scene" dito sa pinas e (lalo na sa davao where im at) just little pockets of resistance here and there

there is a fairly active group of musicians centered around the electronica manila yahoo groups
In an expanding universe, time is on the side of the outcast. Those who once inhabited the suburbs of human contempt find that without changing their address they eventually live in the metropolis


Offline abyssinianson

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #30 on: April 17, 2007, 09:12:47 AM »
there is still a scene for electronica here in the US but every city is different and the new music coming out now in the underground is not as brash and groundbreaking as it once was back in the early-mid 90s. Broken beat was making some sort of scene but nothing really came out of it.

i still frequently go to the Winter Music Conference in Miami or the Detriot Electronic Festival just to check things out for the trade shows and production seminars but the music hasn't changed much in years. The music scene in Japan was much more vibrant from what I could sense when I was these last year. Then again, Japan's music climate is always chock full of weird but interesting stuff that is a refreshing change from what I am exposed to at home. i feel that it is always nice to see and hear what others around the world have to offer as far as making new styles of music and remixing old stuff into interesting new genres.
ako si mimordz. 友だちからよろしくです!

Offline nichteque

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #31 on: May 05, 2007, 09:34:18 PM »
i hear you...wala naman talagang electronic "scene" dito sa pinas e (lalo na sa davao where im at) just little pockets of resistance here and there

marami ring gusto talaga magsimula, kaya lang shempre alam nating lahat na mahal ang gamit...kaya ayun, nauuwi sa emo at rock ang mga tao kasi nga naman yung dalawang libo mo dalin mo lang sa sta. mesa eh ready to rock ka na. of course, hindi rin maganda yung gitara na yun but hey, nakapagsimula ka sa music mo. whereas sa electronic music, hmmm..anu-ano ba ang kailangan mo para magstart? depende, but i'm sure it costs more than a slammer guitar from sta. mesa! ü peace.

Offline KitC

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #32 on: May 05, 2007, 09:55:59 PM »
It depends, Kim. If you are an avid collector of Future Music mag especially the ones that come with cds/dvds, their reader demos are sometimes inspiring. I have this one cd from a few years back where the contributors were a couple of 16-yr old kids using a soundblaster 16 and tracker software, with a Pentium 166 and little else. The track they produced was truly surprising considering the tools they had on hand.

We should not allow ourselves to be bound by what we think we need. We should allow ourselves to explore fully by what we have on hand, preferably exceeding what it was originally meant for.
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Offline chuck sabbath

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #33 on: May 06, 2007, 10:28:14 AM »
yup aside from the pc you can get started with pretty much zero cost...

i got lots of cool stuff done with an amd k6 450mhz, 128mb ram, yamaha waveforce soundcard (with onboard xg synth!) then i got some hardware synths, a decent soundcard and my output plummetted :(

most people who want to get into electronic music kasi always automatically think laptop or electribes etc. good tools but not the be all end all...theres a lot of cool old midi gear out there for cheap....
In an expanding universe, time is on the side of the outcast. Those who once inhabited the suburbs of human contempt find that without changing their address they eventually live in the metropolis

Offline DarkHorse

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #34 on: May 06, 2007, 10:13:46 PM »
basically..i just want a pc based soundmodule..coz a decent module costs a bajillion bucks...i dont hav that luxury....and my vintage (roland) SC55 and P55 and A-30 is really crappin out on me for like 3 years now...and i want to bash it real hard..but i cant coz its the only gear i hav..hehe...unlucky me....anyway..tnx for all yr help..really appreciate it...really..sana yumamn ako..so id get a EMU proteus running an Maudio prokeys....yun lang..masaya na ko...!..hehe!
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Offline marvinq

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #35 on: May 07, 2007, 06:44:10 AM »
proteus? well, that one is more powerful in software form. there's be no advantage to using the hardware version, other than being able to use it without a computer. just my opinion.

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Offline chuck sabbath

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #36 on: May 07, 2007, 08:24:53 AM »
coz a decent module costs a bajillion bucks...

did you miss my sig? two classic pieces that dont cost a bajillion bucks? :wink:

reminds me of a joke: rumsfeld was making his daily report to bush. he says: "mr president, im happy to report that in our latest operation only 3 brazilians were killed". bush says angrily "YOURE HAPPY?!?" then he turned away and seemed almost in tears. finally he turned to rumsfeld and said: "don, give it to me straight...a brazillion is more than a billion right?"
In an expanding universe, time is on the side of the outcast. Those who once inhabited the suburbs of human contempt find that without changing their address they eventually live in the metropolis

Offline DarkHorse

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #37 on: May 07, 2007, 10:17:35 PM »
chuck..

yes i read yr post..tnx for that...but most of the guys saying here is that it has to be a pc with super powers..or sumthing like that...like 2 gigs of ram..a pentium 4..top end sound card...and it has to be a dedicated "for module use only" pc...for it to perform smooth with no hindrance...coz its a live gig ryt?...thats y i said it costs a bajillion bucks..hehe...but again..tnx for yr info...and i think ima try that one of these days...
BE A DEMON HUNTER!


Offline KitC

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #38 on: May 07, 2007, 10:55:21 PM »
exactly what kind of software are you thinking of running on that 'super' pc?

if you want to spend bajillions (actually, only $1999 or P100k), get yourself one of these, Openlabs Miko:



no different from spending on a brand new Triton Pro or Fantom X8.
Sonar 4.04PE/5.2PE/7.02PE/8.31 PE, Project 5 v2.5.1, EmulatorX 1.5, Cubase SL2, Ableton Live 7.14,  Intel Q6600 MSI P43 Neo 4Gb Crucial Ballistix Tracer DDR2-800, Emu 1820m, Yamaha DSP Factory, Terratec DMX 6fire

Offline chuck sabbath

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #39 on: May 08, 2007, 08:39:01 AM »
@Darkhorse

i meant to draw attention to my signature, where i have a sampler and synth module for sale

ill stop advertising now  :-D
In an expanding universe, time is on the side of the outcast. Those who once inhabited the suburbs of human contempt find that without changing their address they eventually live in the metropolis

Offline DarkHorse

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #40 on: May 08, 2007, 08:52:43 AM »
@chuck

a ok....i see...
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Offline chowcjc

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #41 on: September 04, 2007, 09:45:45 AM »
what a great read!!!!

learned a lot from this thread... keep em coming guys...

i saw a DIY pc sound module running vsynth i think not sure though... looks cool kasi the lcd is embedded onto the opc case
para talaga cyang vsynth na rack...

hanapin ko pa ung link...

up muna to para may makabasa pang mga noobs... :) tnx po!

~peace po
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ain't no place like home...
ain't no place like home...

Offline xelalien

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Re: your pc as a sound module(live application)
« Reply #42 on: November 07, 2010, 03:44:09 PM »
up to this very informative thread!
 :)
any open-source alternatives for NI Kontakt/Halion that you can suggest, masters?