TALK @ PhilMusic.com - The Online Home of the Pinoy Musician
The Musician Forums => Guitar Central => Topic started by: royc on March 17, 2014, 08:40:05 AM
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Three decades ago, my personal goal was making sure that I copy the lead parts right, using a cheap acoustic guitar that does not have a truss rod. All my friends in our neighborhood knows how to play the guitar, and we brag on our copying skills.
Fast forward today. Most of the topics I see in guitar forums are about copying the tone, or bragging about having the best tone. Have we changed our priorities? Has the internet made it less challenging to copy lead parts that we now put emphasis on sounding right (tone) instead of playing it right (skills)?
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Skills and tone for the win.
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Skills first, tone will follow soon after the discovery of your personal skill.
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as long as it sounds close to the original solo, I don't give a **** on any shortcuts you did to play or execute it. it means you're creative enough to find an easier way on playing the solo without butchering it.
can't please everyone :)
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I can settle with close enough as long as I land on the correct roots wahahaha. Sayang ang toanz kapag mali ang last note.
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The hardest part is that tone and feel actually helps you find the right notes. :-D
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60% - playing it right
40% - sounding right
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Sometimes...you have to play it right to sound right. :-)
Example: Hotel California (Eagles) intro
Kailangan naka 12 string ka and capo on the 7th fret. Yes you can play the intro using the Bm (x244322) and the other chords in their somewhat "traditional" position pero its not gonna sound the same as the ones in the record. Same goes for the Smoke on the Water riff. Parallel fourths ang chord fingerings at hindi power chord style.
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^^good point! ang maganda rin dyan is mapa-practice yung tenga mo if you try to copy the solo or riffs note per note, para din ma-capture mo yung feel :D
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play right 1st...tone later. :-D
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as long as it sounds close to the original solo, I don't give a **** on any shortcuts you did to play or execute it. it means you're creative enough to find an easier way on playing the solo without butchering it.
can't please everyone :)
+1. Even the professional artists themselves don't always stick to how they played a song in the recording especially when performing live
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Kailangan naka 12 string ka and capo on the 7th fret. Yes you can play the intro using the Bm (x244322) and the other chords in their somewhat "traditional" position pero its not gonna sound the same as the ones in the record.
fully agree on this. intro don't sound right with traditional positions.
i say play it right, tone e bahala na sa timpla natin since it's our "voice"
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Your tone is your identity, so nobody have the right to say that your tone sucks. That's you, that's your feel, that's your tone. Noong 70's na tugtugan, hindi importante ang tone mo kasi wala pang multifx nuon. Ang uso lang distortion at fuzz tone. Ang labanan nuon ay kung plakado mo ang solo. Van Halen has his own tone. Ted Tugent also has his own tone. Every guitarist have their own tone na kahit hindi mo nakikita kapag nadinig mo ang tunog niya alam mo na kung sino ang tumutugtog. Kaya for me mas important sa akin ang how to play it right and tone will follow.
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For the nth time, both are equally important. All those famous names had the right gear that they felt would give them the right tone for them to play at their best, but they also had the chops to play all those classic riffs and solos that we know and love.
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Write your own song then you don't have to worry about copying the notes or the tone.
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playing right or sounding right?
feeling it right :-D
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Write your own song then you don't have to worry about copying the notes or the tone.
Not everyone can write "good" songs, unless you're ok with hearing your composition being regarded as mediocre.
Plus we all have loved, at one point in our lives, somebody else's song so yeah... I think writing your own song may be a different story.
Just my two cents
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For the nth time, both are equally important. All those famous names had the right gear that they felt would give them the right tone for them to play at their best, but they also had the chops to play all those classic riffs and solos that we know and love.
+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
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Creativity trumps both gear and technique. :razz:
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Not everyone can write "good" songs, unless you're ok with hearing your composition being regarded as mediocre.
Plus we all have loved, at one point in our lives, somebody else's song so yeah... I think writing your own song may be a different story.
Just my two cents
Everyone can develop good writing skills. Once you have it, you'll notice your skills and tone have improved too.
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I think that the spirit of this thread is about covers. I'll stay clear of debating about creativity because IMO, its out of topic.
In the case of covers, both playing it right and sounding right should be important. In recent years, the emergence of more manufacturers, modeling technology, gear re-issues, local distributors, online retailers, and even custom shops have made gear and tools more accessible. More than ever, this gave guitarists the ability to dial-in the specific tone they desire. Thus the increasing popularity and emphasis on gear and tone.
Just sharing; this has to be my favorite cover performance of recent times. Lenny Kravitz and his band covering the Beatles' "Get Back". They really paid homage to the song, and got both playing it right and sounding right spot on.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jTW6ZXdCkM
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It is because others are IMPROVISING pag hindi nila kaya kunin yung ibang piyesa. Ako, i don`t want to sound like anyone, i want my signature lick, tone, tune, sounds, iba parin pag meron kang pang sarili, look at Hendrix and Clapton, they are both using a strat, but they sound different, nakilala sila hindi lang sa skills, kundi sa signature Tone nila. Eric Johnson plays two of his main guitar, his ES and Strat, try mong pumikit at pakinggan siya, you won`t notice kung ano ang gamit niya, makikilala mo lang na siya yun dahil sa signature sound, lick and tone niya. That`s why skills and tones are important than replicating or emulating one another`s style. Sa panahon kasi ngayon, nangunguna na ang IMPROVISATION at pagiging maarte sa TONE.
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For me since i don't have all those high end gears. I'm trying to play it right to sound right or close enough. Playing with feel will make you look sounding right for me though.
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i agree that this thread pertains to covers, not song writing.
my thoughts on covers are: the only reason why i play a lot of them is because people like them. i really do not care much about them, unless i learn something from it - song writing patterns, new scales, etc.
good luck learning new things with the tired old favorites people want (at my age, even classic songs and popular faves bore me).
next is, nailing a guitar sound is good and all, but if you go through all the trouble to get a certain sound, it is pretty useless, unless your vocalist nailing the singing parts too. i have heard bands who nailed the sweet child o mine sound, but their singer aint anywhere close to axl, so it did not impress any of the music geeks around.
another is, people who like cover songs are non-musicians, and they wouldnt know the difference between a les paul sound from a strat sound ... they wont also know the difference if you hit an Eb on a passing note instead of an E. they only know when you are out of key, extremely out of tempo, or too loud.
having said that. my take on cover songs is: as long as the audience loves it. some parts you have to nail note for note, some parts you can just do a sound-alike.
as for tone, the audience doesnt care about the specifics, so unless i am crazy about the song, i really dont care much about it.
and finally, you cannot please music geeks. they also comprise a small part of the audience, they usally do not pay to get in, they also usually do not order much, they also wont book you good gigs. so its ok for them to hate you really :)
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Re: playing it right or sounding right?
pareho :)
madedefeat yung meaning ng pag cover kung hindi pareho e
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I prefer DOING it right.
IMHO, you don't have to nail the tone, or play the solo note for note.
You just have to do it right, and give justice to your interpretation of the song.
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Glad to know that there are guitarists who remember that skills improvement should not take a back seat to gas. I believe that once you have acquired decent gears, you can no longer expect a significant improvement in tone unless you pair that with a major skills upgrade. I was guilty of this, gradually upgrading my gears, but too lazy to learn new things.
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Glad to know that there are guitarists who remember that skills improvement should not take a back seat to gas. I believe that once you have acquired decent gears, you can no longer expect a significant improvement in tone unless you pair that with a major skills upgrade. I was guilty of this, gradually upgrading my gears, but too lazy to learn new things.
True, I can feel you too, when the GAS started, you`ll forget the things that you should learn, big regrets for knowing about gear and tone at my early age back then.
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Should be both... dapat malaman nang mga nakikinig (lalo na yung mga hindi musicians) na yung kanta na yun yung kino-cover mo..
Iba yung nag-cover ka nang song sa gumawa ka nung own version mo nung song....
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Playing it right and sounding as good as your gear can handle/produce.
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Minsan kailangan ng "right sound" para matugtog mo ng tama ex. kailangan sakto yung speed ng delay pag U2 songs ang cover.
All things taken into consideration mas appreciate ng audience yung tamang tipa kaysa magandang tone, so play right.
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Glad to know that there are guitarists who remember that skills improvement should not take a back seat to gas. I believe that once you have acquired decent gears, you can no longer expect a significant improvement in tone unless you pair that with a major skills upgrade. I was guilty of this, gradually upgrading my gears, but too lazy to learn new things.
ako din, pag GAS ako, nawawala ang practice routine. :eek:
Anyway, playing it right is the priority to me(I'm into details), copying the tone is just a bonus or afterwards. :)
minsan dun ako nakakakuha ng style, phrasing, ideas, and different vibrato approach.
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IMO, you would sound right once you play it right. If you play a song (cover in particular), package dapat yung tamang notes at tamang tone to nail it. Otherwise, the song would just sound like your own 'version'.
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Relate ako dito.for my opinion, in my skills of playing, meron laging limitasyon lalo sa pagcover ng solos.hirap ako sa speed. pero kung sa tonal medyo nakakahabol ako. before lumanog akustik lang gamit ko, mula ng matuto ako sa mga effects at analog at nagkaron ng purchasing power sa gear, lumawak ang experimentation at ang sarap pakiramdam kapag nakokopya mo mga tones..(e.g. Tom Morello, Greenday..etc.
At meron ako tropa na mahusay ang skills sa playing..pero poor sa timplahan. halos walang progress sa tonal skill in the years of playing. ewan ko baka kasi mas focused siya sa playing.so kelangan ko pa timplahan siya pag may jam session kame.
Sa tingin ko ,dapat laging balanse. 50/50.. to got it almost perfect.