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Author Topic: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41  (Read 37548 times)

Offline firemodel55

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #50 on: December 23, 2007, 11:43:23 PM »
CARABAO,

Will try to avoid Snidd and Deltaslim who are being provocative.  

Sorry I dont do clips.  Even if I did the clips, hindi naman aamin sina Snidd and Deltaslim dahil biased sila against me because it hurts to admit to own crappy guitars.  Never once did you hear Deltaslim ever say that he owned crappy equipment but the proof is that he has not retained anything for more than a year.  But I started out with crappy guitars too -- RJ and Santa Mesa or local for that matter.  I always doubted high end guitars and I continue to doubt others but these two Bakers changed it for me... and I wish it could be cheaper and more affordable for everyone but it ain't because its plainly so hard to make guitars on this performance level.  

Offline snidd

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #51 on: December 23, 2007, 11:56:16 PM »
Snidd,

So whats your claim to talent?
 

i prefer telling you who has talent. 99.5% of the guitar players in this forum. so meaning to say, almost everyone else except you. oh and i'll admit that i only own a dean and an ibby. they may be "crappy" because they aren't as expensive as your baker. but hell, i can play 'em like they're a million dollars worth of heavy ass riffs. but i do applaud you for making a $5000 guitar sound like crap. it's really hard to do for us who can actually play.

Offline nealyu

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #52 on: December 24, 2007, 12:01:48 AM »
Ouch... cool lang kayo guys  :-)

Offline titser_marco

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #53 on: December 24, 2007, 12:10:22 AM »

Titser marco,

Not sure when the next tone party will be because I still have to get new speaker cabinets which I have wanted to do for the longest time.  Suggest you just drive by my house one of these days and give it a go.  You really have to spend time with these guitars to discover their nuances.  Hindi lang ito for gigging to post a review but rather you have to bring your own guitar to compare. 

Nako, mahihirapan ako nyan since I don't have a car. But yeah, I'll PM you if I can find time to drop by at your place via cab. :)
I'd rather be sharp than flat.

Offline nealyu

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #54 on: December 24, 2007, 12:12:24 AM »

check this out. This guitar wails like crazy!!! Just my opinion but i think this would smoke the baker or would be on par with it :-)


Offline skunkyfunk

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #55 on: December 24, 2007, 12:44:07 AM »
OH NO NOT AGAIN.  :roll:

For the n^1.25671x10^2453th time, I want to state my reasons why this world is not a pretty place to live in with all these arguments:

1.  NOT everyone has the ears to hear the differences in different gear, be it cheap or boutique.  Proof in that is some parents won't buy you a Baker as a graduation gift when they think an Epiphone sounds just the same to them.  (Even if they can afford the Baker).

2.  Physical attributes to a person determine how he hears something.  Take note: HEARING.  I am not even talking about how an instrument responds to his playing.  Try this:  Listen to an amp in action.  Then, at the same standpoint, try to hold your ears and cup them to look more like FVR's or Mickey Mouse's.  You'll hear the difference in merely changing your ear shape!  How many ear shapes do we have in the world????

3.  How the number of brains in the world interpret what his ears tell him.  (See #2)

4.  Instrument response is a huge factor to a player's choice of gear.  But then again, how can instrument response be measured?  Is it the number of seconds a guitar should sustain?  Is it the ease of playing through a particular guitar?  These are all relative to the person... How many times did people say "ang taas ng action mo!"  On the same guitar, even through a Baker, I would assume a 1/16" action would be less-sustainful than if it were set-up for 3/32".

5.  Economic issues.  I yet have to try a Baker, but when someone close to Alex said, "Maganda ang Baker.  Pero sa presyo niya di ko pa rin siya papatulan..."  it gave me the idea that it is still an issue of economics.  What if everyone can afford a Baker?  At that, you are taking away its "special" character.  Reminds me of those Economics lessons in high school regarding law of diminishing returns... And the classic example:  What if there was as many diamonds as there were water?

6.  From a recording engineer's perspective, I still think no amount of recording tools, even the best A/D converters and signal processors can duplicate the nuances of  a real instrument.  Even on an ideal playback system, a recording shall always be a less-than-perfect reproduction of the source.  But then again, I do not condone settling for POS gear when recording because of the GIGO principle.

7.  Buy the best gear to optimize your playing, and optimize your gear by being a good player. 

8.  When you talk gear, argue about gear.  When you talk about technique, argue about technique.  When you talk about finding gear that can enhance your technique, no amount of reading, recommendations, or reviews can help you UNLESS YOU TRY THE GEAR IN QUESTION FOR YOURSELF. 

PS  On Anton smoking on an Elegee and Firemodel sucking on a Baker...  Selective editing is really lame if you ask me.  I've seen Alex play and that video showcasing his whaling este wailing notes is NOT at all representative of what he can do.  I've seen far worse and they have the guts to record in a studio despite their ill-preparedness!  :x   Kudos to Anton for making a nice video. 

« Last Edit: December 24, 2007, 12:47:22 AM by skunkyfunk »

Offline dan_sparta

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #56 on: December 24, 2007, 01:01:34 AM »
CARABAO,

Will try to avoid Snidd and Deltaslim who are being provocative.  

Sorry I dont do clips.  Even if I did the clips, hindi naman aamin sina Snidd and Deltaslim dahil biased sila against me because it hurts to admit to own crappy guitars.  Never once did you hear Deltaslim ever say that he owned crappy equipment but the proof is that he has not retained anything for more than a year.  But I started out with crappy guitars too -- RJ and Santa Mesa or local for that matter.  I always doubted high end guitars and I continue to doubt others but these two Bakers changed it for me... and I wish it could be cheaper and more affordable for everyone but it ain't because its plainly so hard to make guitars on this performance level.  
sir maglagay ka nalang ng clips tapos request natin ke delta at snidd na wag mag komento para d baised sayo kamo tapos yung mga makikinig ang magkokomento tapos kung me matapang na tapatan yung clips mo ng ibang gitara na pede nilang masabi na maipanglaban dyan sa baker mo. sabi ko nga beauty is in the ears of the beholder pero naisip ko din pano YUNG NAKIKINIG na publiko. kung ikaw lang magsasabi na maganda ang baker mo at iba naman nagsasabing may pang tapat na LOW end na gitara dyan pano nila mapapatunayan kung ala ka clips  :-) kasi wala nanaman katapusan na diskusyon ito.he!he!he!  :-D maganda siguro mag sced ka nang oras at public venue tapos isang amp at isang setting lang tapos magdala yung nagsasabing me pang tapat dyan sa baker para yung mga makikinig ang magdesisyon at isang d baised na gitarista para isang tema lang ng tugtog tapos score card na ang publiko ang magiiskor :-D parang guitar shootout :-D at isa nga pala sir lahat ba nang iniidolo nating mga banyagang gitarista baker ang gamit o kaya yung mga mayayaman nalang sa us baker lang ba ang gamit? yung mga matinding mga jazzer,rocker,blueser baker lang b ang gamit? peace po! :-)
Mga BRO click nyo link sa baba may " FOR SALE" pa ako dito. Txt 0916-7590926(GLOBE)09298522810(SMART) SALAMAT
http://dansparta.multiply.com/

Offline fraudulentzodiac

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #57 on: December 24, 2007, 01:05:48 AM »
sir maglagay ka nalang ng clips tapos request natin ke delta at snidd na wag mag komento para d baised sayo kamo tapos yung mga makikinig ang magkokomento tapos kung me matapang na tapatan yung clips mo ng ibang gitara na pede nilang masabi na maipanglaban dyan sa baker mo. sabi ko nga beauty is in the ears of the beholder pero naisip ko din pano YUNG NAKIKINIG na publiko. kung ikaw lang magsasabi na maganda ang baker mo at iba naman nagsasabing may pang tapat na LOW end na gitara dyan pano nila mapapatunayan kung ala ka clips  :-) kasi wala nanaman katapusan na diskusyon ito.he!he!he!  :-D maganda siguro mag sced ka nang oras at public venue tapos isang amp at isang setting lang tapos magdala yung nagsasabing me pang tapat dyan sa baker para yung mga makikinig ang magdesisyon at isang d baised na gitarista para isang tema lang ng tugtog tapos score card na ang publiko ang magiiskor :-D parang guitar shootout :-D at isa nga pala sir lahat ba nang iniidolo nating mga banyagang gitarista baker ang gamit o kaya yung mga mayayaman nalang sa us baker lang ba ang gamit? yung mga matinding mga jazzer,rocker,blueser baker lang b ang gamit? peace po! :-)
+ 1 kay sir Dan.
not meaning anything bad, but I think to end some arguments if ever sir firemodel55 would make new clips, please do a more "ear-friendly" demo rather than an "off-key" bend galore with fingers pointing towards the good Lord. try doing a rendition of something popular, I think that would be easier to digest and, for the general public, to assess the tone of your super guitars. just my two cents. :wink:

Offline bumbum

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #58 on: December 24, 2007, 01:45:18 AM »
that's right mr firemodem..este firemodel..  ang gitara, hindi lang yan gawa sa kahoy at kuryente... may puso at damdamin din yan.. ano kaya ang nararamdaman ng gitara mo habang tinitipa ng maiinit at banayad mong mga daliri? sabi mo gitara mo ang may pinakamagandang tone sa buong mundo. ang sabi naman ng mga guitar greats, tone is in the hands... pano ba yan. sila na  nagsabi nun.. tsaka anu naman kung walang baker si deltaslim?  malupet naman syang maggitara..tsaka bakit ba nagpost ka pa ng thread na ganyan e alam mo namang ikaw lang ang may ganyang gitara dito sa forum..nanlalait ka pa ng mga astig na gitarista dito. try mo nga makipagshowdown sa maga gitaristang pinagtatawanan mo dito sa forum? baka manginig ang tuhod mo.jam kaya kayo ni deltaslim. hehe. peace. :evil:
« Last Edit: December 24, 2007, 01:51:19 AM by bumbum »

Offline nealyu

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #59 on: December 24, 2007, 02:11:15 AM »
Dapat walang laitan kasi dito sa forum e. Constructive critisism lang.

Offline Lahed92801

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #60 on: December 24, 2007, 02:12:09 AM »
Does Gene make guitars that can sound a bit thinner? Like funky strat type tones?  :-)

Offline eders19

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #61 on: December 24, 2007, 03:18:05 AM »
sweet guitars! hopefully one day i'll be able to spend money on a really good guitar that fits me well. hahahaha!

congrats on the buy!  :-D
with or without you...

Offline vhunter

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #62 on: December 24, 2007, 03:39:10 AM »
Man snidd, youre outa line. Youre just being an @$$. Let the man have his opinion and you can have yours. No need to go on about his talent and money vs yours. Alex isnt as "matapobre" as before so give him a break. I think hes making an effort to behave... except vs delta... which is fun to read anyway. Only reason youre acting the way you are is your jealous, or youre jealous. Umm.. i think its coz your jealous. Anyway I also think its below the belt that you guys reference that elegee vs baker video coz it was obviously put up to deface alex. Thats just childish and wrong. Just grow up man

Anyway... I wanna hear this guitar! Post a video man! It looks awesome.

Lahed > Yup hes got thinner sounding guitars but hes not really famous for them. Hes got teh "Firebird" type series thats neck thru and has the mini hums. That one is a bit more open sounding. I think the earth (#41) would be one of the thinner sounding ones coz of the P90 bite and korina wood.

Alex > Kung ayaw mo gumawa ng clips.. ako na ... heheheh! Gas nanaman yan.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2007, 03:43:54 AM by vhunter »

Offline Lahed92801

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #63 on: December 24, 2007, 03:43:34 AM »
Hey man, still awake? haha it's 3am, i cant sleep

Thin as in can get funk rhythm thin? Talking about a guitar as versatile as a superstrat  :-D

Most of em are nice but never seen one of Baker-esque level quality or heard of one... Ran?  :lol:
« Last Edit: December 24, 2007, 03:44:53 AM by Lahed92801 »

Offline vhunter

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #64 on: December 24, 2007, 03:50:53 AM »
Lahed - I dunno ... hahaha... strat parin ako when i think funk rhythm. I just woke up and saw the thread ... so I thought I'd jump in :D.

For high end strats its kinda hard to beat fender custom shop. Mga master built strats rock and so do the teambuilt ones. Fender is definately putting out botique quality strats from their custom shop. Also there are the Suhrs (classic) that just own that sound. Theres also the GVCG guitars and the vinettos. All up there with Baker in terms of build quality.

Check em out
http://www.vinettoguitars.com/index_files/dc60sb.htm

Beautiful guitars!

Offline skunkyfunk

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #65 on: December 24, 2007, 04:05:00 AM »
Man snidd, youre outa line. Youre just being an @$$. Let the man have his opinion and you can have yours. No need to go on about his talent and money vs yours. Alex isnt as "matapobre" as before so give him a break. I think hes making an effort to behave... except vs delta... which is fun to read anyway. Only reason youre acting the way you are is your jealous, or youre jealous. Umm.. i think its coz your jealous. Anyway I also think its below the belt that you guys reference that elegee vs baker video coz it was obviously put up to deface alex. Thats just childish and wrong. Just grow up man

Anyway... I wanna hear this guitar! Post a video man! It looks awesome.

Lahed > Yup hes got thinner sounding guitars but hes not really famous for them. Hes got teh "Firebird" type series thats neck thru and has the mini hums. That one is a bit more open sounding. I think the earth (#41) would be one of the thinner sounding ones coz of the P90 bite and korina wood.

Alex > Kung ayaw mo gumawa ng clips.. ako na ... heheheh! Gas nanaman yan.

I guess what I propose to snidd is he try the Baker alongside with his Ibby and Dean... 

@Alex, long time no see.  Are you still gonna need my 4x12?

Offline Lahed92801

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #66 on: December 24, 2007, 05:06:33 AM »
Haha, well tone IS objective... and it's not fair cause the players were different. The way you sound is in the hands. Tone is in da hands! The best way to compare gear is by having the same player play through the 2 different pieces IMO. If you get me to play through my own rig then someone else say sir anton to play through his, it's unfair because i definitely lose in terms of tone production. You won't get an accurate comparision there.

Offline firemodel55

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #67 on: December 24, 2007, 05:48:08 AM »
i prefer telling you who has talent. 99.5% of the guitar players in this forum. so meaning to say, almost everyone else except you. oh and i'll admit that i only own a dean and an ibby. they may be "crappy" because they aren't as expensive as your baker. but hell, i can play 'em like they're a million dollars worth of heavy ass riffs. but i do applaud you for making a $5000 guitar sound like crap. it's really hard to do for us who can actually play.

Snidd,

I can hand them off to really good players right now and make 99.5% of everyone here look like crap... BUT that is NOT the point.  I am not asking about your equipment.  I am asking about your guitar skills given that you choose to insult me on a video that I sincerely shared with elegee to help him build HIYAW into his guitars which currently do not have it.  Besides, why do you think he needed to video it?  Kasi hirap rin siya to build HIYAW into his guitars like everybody else. 

It will not change the fact that these two are really good guitars that appeal to emotion and soul.  I am very zealous about it because it proves one thing, that there are some luthiers in the world capable of producing similarly superior sounding instruments without one just being a freak or fluke. 

You know Snidd, have you tried testing a dozen Gibson Historics and Custom Shops one whole afternoon and getting disappointed that your Dean and Ibby might actually sound better?  I have and its frustrating.  By the way, if you think you are heavy with those two guitars, think again -- just my personal opinion.



Offline firemodel55

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #68 on: December 24, 2007, 06:15:26 AM »
that's right mr firemodem..este firemodel..  ang gitara, hindi lang yan gawa sa kahoy at kuryente... may puso at damdamin din yan.. ano kaya ang nararamdaman ng gitara mo habang tinitipa ng maiinit at banayad mong mga daliri? sabi mo gitara mo ang may pinakamagandang tone sa buong mundo. ang sabi naman ng mga guitar greats, tone is in the hands... pano ba yan. sila na  nagsabi nun.. tsaka anu naman kung walang baker si deltaslim?  malupet naman syang maggitara..tsaka bakit ba nagpost ka pa ng thread na ganyan e alam mo namang ikaw lang ang may ganyang gitara dito sa forum..nanlalait ka pa ng mga astig na gitarista dito. try mo nga makipagshowdown sa maga gitaristang pinagtatawanan mo dito sa forum? baka manginig ang tuhod mo.jam kaya kayo ni deltaslim. hehe. peace. :evil:

If tone is all in the hands which is a brilliant excuse to make yabang by some people how come:

1) SRV uses his No.1 and Lenny despite his success.  At one point he was using a custom guitar with his SRV name inlaid on the fretboard but went back to No.1 and Lenny
2) Slash still keeps his Max Guitar Replica and still uses it for recording despite many Gibson Custom Shop examples
3) Kirk Hammet keeps his beat up KH 2 -- I dont see him using the KH 3 and KH 4 that followed as much or if ever
4) Steve Vai still used EVO and FLO ten years after he received them despite being beat up -- he also tried to justify keeping them by giving an explanation to how the unique combination of wood for these two guitars seemed to resonate at a certain interval
5) Joe Perry thanked slash for giving him back his 58 which he says was one guitar he missed
6) Clapton still misses the Gibby he lost
7) EVH still kept his frankenstein
8) Hetfield also keeps a very special white ESP explorer -- one of the first one that ESP made for him

Except for EVH and a lot of people on this forum, I have NEVER EVER HEARD ANY OF THESE ARTISTS SAY IN THEIR INTERVIEWS THAT ITS IN THE HANDS.

Bakit ako nag post? Dahil tama ka sobrang daming astig na gitarista dito pero iba sa kanila astig wala naman K...

Kagaya mo... Gear ang pinaguusapan, show down ang hinihingi mo.  Parang hindi yata matino ang pag iisip mo brad.

PEACE and Merry Xmas to you...

Offline dan_sparta

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #69 on: December 24, 2007, 06:22:21 AM »



In my opinion, these two guitar will kill 99.5% of the world's guitars and there is nothing better than them.  There may be a few guitars on their level but this for me is where I am at peace.  Finally, buying guitars I can say with 100% confidence is now truly fun because I have found a luthier who can get the sound I want and match it with great looks.

I use to think that I could get away with cheaper responsive guitars which were Japanese because I was so disappointed with a lot of the USA stuff.  Truly these two guitars give us a brief glimpse of the small core of handmade USA luthier guitars that really define what it is to be a proud owner of a USA made guitar.  These are truly works of art that seek to touch the emotion which will not be passe. 

Is there any locally made guitar that can touch any of them?  None.   These two guitars not only combine classic beauty, playability, sound, response and feel, but more importantly there is an immediate emotional connection.  The MAGIC of why we all GAS.  For me, it ends here.  Journey is finished.  Anytime, I need a new guitar with a different configuration, I will just go to Gene and Cliff to ask them to configure and cook it to my sound requirements more importantly because I am aligned with them thru the reference #55 and #41. 

I encourage every Pinoy in Philmusic to really save up and forget all the crappy name branding, purely looks game and nationalistic delusion and buy yourself a Baker.  If its anything that owning a 2nd Baker proves is that they can replicate their high standard and thats what I am pointing at. 

Recently, there have been a lot of threads about people admonishing their guitars but I believe this is the real deal because at almost US$10,000 on two guitars, this was a risky move for me.  With only a 14 guitar difference between both guitars -- the 41 being older by two months in age -- to get this level of response and harmonic richness is an achievement. 

However, I would like to point out that I am not saying there will be no bad sounding guitar from Gene and Cliff but rather they have the better chance of getting an amazing guitar because their minimum standard (worst sounding guitar) is already way above the maximum of so many guitar brands.

Truly for some luthiers, you really get what you pay for.

Sound differences?... stay posted for the next part of this review
mga kaibigan paki basa nalang ulit yung post nya, ang nasuri ko ay nakalagay naman lagi ay ang salitang IN MY o kaya I tapos salita,kanyang opinyon lang talaga yung pinagsasabi nya, at siguro sir OAS hinay hinay lang konte sa buhat ng bangko :-D kasi ilan ilan lang kayo na kaya bumile ng mamahaling gitara at halos lahat ng gitarista di naman mayaman pero mayaman sa  talento,at siguro sir pag nagpost ka ng gamit mo,wag mo na lagyan ng presyo. lagay mo nalang I LOVE THIS,I LOVE THAT! at wag ka na maglagay ng "this two guitar will kill 99.5%  of the worlds guitar" dahil sigurado madami kokontesta, peace po! :-)  
Mga BRO click nyo link sa baba may " FOR SALE" pa ako dito. Txt 0916-7590926(GLOBE)09298522810(SMART) SALAMAT
http://dansparta.multiply.com/

Offline swinger

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #70 on: December 24, 2007, 06:24:57 AM »
peace! nice guitar sir firemodel, but its way too expensive for me.  :-) its a full year and a half of my salary(walang kainan) :-D


merry christmas and a PEACEFUL new year to everyone! :-)

Offline firemodel55

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #71 on: December 24, 2007, 06:25:28 AM »
dan sparta,

Merry Xmas.  Sorry for being passionate.

Offline dan_sparta

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #72 on: December 24, 2007, 06:32:37 AM »
dan sparta,

Merry Xmas.  Sorry for being passionate.
merry xmas din sir! at isa pa hirit sir baka ayaw mo na talaga low ends mo mga gitara dyan pa raffle mo nalang dito sa philmu kagaya nung nag paraffle nung hyper lead na zoom fx noon,kahit isa langhe!he!  :-D merry xmas ulit!
Mga BRO click nyo link sa baba may " FOR SALE" pa ako dito. Txt 0916-7590926(GLOBE)09298522810(SMART) SALAMAT
http://dansparta.multiply.com/

Offline firemodel55

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #73 on: December 24, 2007, 06:32:52 AM »
Swinger,

Thanks.  Maybe Gene will make 800 more guitars in his remaining productive lifetime which is another 20 years.  Plenty of time for you to save.

I used to collect many many many guitars but I am now down to 2.  Eventually, you want to settle on one or two or maybe even three.  Easier on the maintenance and you know what? It kills Guitar GAS.  I still have AMP GAS though.  

Lately, with the arrival of #41, it killed my BOOST/OD/DISTORTION GAS.  Because both guitars can drive good sounding amps directly because of the richness in harmonic content and signal volume.  The pre amp gain is now down to around 9-10 o clock on most of my amps.  Despite the tons of pedals I have, these things are now relegated to presets more than basic tone generators. In short, dahil hindi mo naman pwede ipihit ang tone controls of the amp on the fly, I will just use the pedal to preset eq and gain settings vis a vis the amp.  

Offline firemodel55

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Re: Baker 55 vs. Baker 41
« Reply #74 on: December 24, 2007, 06:37:47 AM »
Vhunter,

You can borrow the #41 this wednesday or thursday...