Do you think ANALOG TAPE RECORDING should still be taught...

[skunkyfunk]

...in Recording and Music Production school?  It is pretty much like teaching 35mm and 16mm film for motion picture school, and film cameras for still photography.  I know analog is far more expensive, but the discipline and "ear training" is one big endeavor you can get from working with tape.

Whatyathink?

[BAMF]

History lesson ?

[skunkyfunk]

History lesson ?

 

So marami pa palang HISTORICAL PIECES OF EQUIPMENT kang makikita sa malalaking studios hehehe.  Sana di na lang sila maging pangdisplay.

[BAMF]

Well...those things are verrrrry expensive, it wouldn't be surprising that the owners of those studios will want to maximize the life of those.

But IMHO lang naman, they're on the way out, and analog tape will be used in a different mode (as pointed by abyssinianson)...putting the tracks to analog but further mixing will be done on the DAW, so as to still capture the analog warmth.

Analog mixing engineers will be (if not yet) a dying breed, like programmers of COBOL, or animators who still use a pencil.

Tubes nga din e, dapat obsolete na sya, but they found an irreplaceable home in audio and broadcast applications.

IMHO, school time is very precious, specially these days in schools with 15-week semesters. It could be nice to have a curriculum that's more "forward-looking" so as not to produce graduates who are unusable. Siguro a session or two of analog, para alam nila how it works and for appreciation lang ba. But an entire course for it, for me lang, is superflous.  Elective siguro at most, kung talagang mapilit ang estudyante, or they can go and apprentice with our legendary analog engineers after school.

Parang ako nung pagka-graduate ko...I was so brimming with pride. I was armed with the knowledge to  design and implement a 600-channel analog microwave system. Pagdating ko sa workplace...ngek...the world has gone digital and I was absolutely clueless about the Digital Microwave Hierarchy.

[KitC]

There are still a lot of 4- and 8-track casette portastudios out there. At the very least, people should be made to understand what they can and cannot do with these machines, as well as proper maintenance. You can't beat these things when it comes to ease and immediacy of use, though.

[BAMF]

A laptop with a very portable  A/D and Firewire/USB 2.0 interface  is fast catching up tho', IMHO.

[skunkyfunk]

Nothing beats knowing how to work with THESE:



and these:



And using a console like this:



And a bunch of racks like these:





NO DX, VST and RTAS plugins allowed in ANREC 101...  

[BAMF]

Otari hagureta...hinadori mo...itsukawa, yasashii...meguri ayii...hehehe wala lang.

No offense bro, but the word "dinosaur" comes to my mind.

[KitC]

A lot of the things we take for granted in digital technology had their beginnings in the analog world. Any linear based recording program, Pro Tools for example, was based on tape recording. Cubase VST even has an emulation mode which simulates tape monitoring characteristics; VST32 even had a tape saturation mode. Even today's hard disk portastudios closely follow their casette counterparts with the recording medium as the major change.

I'm reminded of the adage, "how will you know where you are going if you don't know where you've been?" It's perfectly ok to embrace digital technology - I, for one, was an early adopter. But knowing the analog counterparts has helped me understand the technology immensely and also to appreciate each medium's strength and faults.

A lot of music software today emulate their analog counterparts and failing to understand the why's and wherefor's, one may never get to appreciate the rationale behind why a certain emulation was designed as such.

[BAMF]

Yup. Appreciation is truly very useful. But application...well...that's another matter altogether

[stringman]

It's hard cutting tape to tape. Been there done that, but the knowledge of analog recording is the best lesson an aspiring engineer can get.

Also the passage of the inputs going to the outputs. How signals travel thru the mixing console (bussing, panning, EFX insert).

[abyssinianson]

THAT is one huge SSL console. Nice mic pres too.

[tele-tubby]

the best recorded stuff were done with tape.  unless you love rap recordings:) i dunno, something about the hiss, the warmth... and bottomline, it's is really more 3d.  i mean come on, LedZep III sounds more vibrant, robust, than let's say, John Mayer's 1st album. diba?

may "kanto" yung digital na halata eh... i dunno if anybody would get my imagery hehe...

well in the end tama si BAMF, magastos kasi at syempre hindi lahat makaka afford nito lalo na si Pinas.

pero pare, i long for those days!!!! hehehe

[skunkyfunk]

the best recorded stuff were done with tape.  unless you love rap recordings:)

Dude, those crazy rack and console pics were from DR. DRE'S STUDIO.

[stringman]

Sa Greenhills sound buhay pa mga analog console ate tape recorders nila. It's still in use pa rin.

[abyssinianson]

the best recorded stuff were done with tape.  unless you love rap recordings:)

Dude, those crazy rack and console pics were from DR. DRE'S STUDIO.

I wouldn't be surprised. Usher's studio in georgia (atlanta) used to be owned by LA Reid, the music mogul, even he has an SSL and a complete set of monitors for every genre.

[starfugger]

in schools, yes analog should be taught as analog gear is still widely used (and often prefered) in major studios all over the world.

so right, KitC.  u gotta know where ur coming from so u also know where you're headed.  this reminds me of Mr. Charles Dye's approach of emulating solid state distortion in an ITB mix.  how does one emulate something he has never heard? it's true we're missing out big time on all these harmonic distortion from analog consoles and outboard gear... the sad part is most of us who use only digital recoding equipment can only take their word for it since we have very little experience with analog.

[3rd world order]

tape is GOD.

digital is only good for making audio sound like a demo...

dont believe me?  PAY me to print mixes down to GP9 on my studer...  yeah, everyone wants something, eh?  

[KitC]

Nice to see you here, Aaron.

[skunkyfunk]

tape is GOD.

digital is only good for making audio sound like a demo...

dont believe me?  PAY me to print mixes down to GP9 on my studer...  yeah, everyone wants something, eh?  

Don't you think 456 is better than GP9 to get that more saturated feel?

[abyssinianson]

tape is GOD.

digital is only good for making audio sound like a demo...

dont believe me?  PAY me to print mixes down to GP9 on my studer...  yeah, everyone wants something, eh?  

everything has its purpose. whether you want tape as a purist or use digital for its flexibiity, it all depends on the sound that you want. Whether you use a Studer, a Neve, an SSL or even one of the more common 32 channel Mackies...everything has a purpose that should suit the direction and sound requirement of the artist. As such...I won't toss aside digital over tape for the very same reason why I won't discourage people from trying modern type amps like the Line 6 versus tube amps. Its all in the "Whatever-floats-your-boat" frame of mind.

I did some post production work on a Studer not too long ago - an M2 - for an indie film and the feel/ sound was great; very similar to the Sony Cambridge series digital consoles that they prefer over by Experience Studios (Seattle, WA). The new studers are nice and feel very old-school except that you have a choice of going analog or digital depending on what sound and purpose you are using the desk for.

The best desk I've used recently? the new SSL Aws 900 - this desk feels nice AND works great with Nuendo. Too bad the sucker costs $85,000. Maybe when the royalities start rolling in.......

[markthevirtuoso]

...in Recording and Music Production school?  It is pretty much like teaching 35mm and 16mm film for motion picture school, and film cameras for still photography.  I know analog is far more expensive, but the discipline and "ear training" is one big endeavor you can get from working with tape.

Whatyathink?

We're lucky enough to be taught atleast a bit of the history and concepts of straight ahead analogue recording. Kaso hanggang dun lang eh. Walang practical. Meron nga kaming mga analogue Neve inserts sa mga racks (which is supposed to promise us that Godly warmth and sweet saturation) kaso digital din naman ang console, wala rin.

I'd be very happy to make a project or production with everything done with analogue.

Kaso nagiging obsolete ng paunti-unti ang mga gamit na to. Tas ang mamahal pa.

[abyssinianson]

if you use the Neve channels as inserts in your signal chain or as a bus effect, mixing on a digital console shouldn't matter; in fact, it ought to be better unless you are mixing with a digital console that colors the sound of your work which is highly unlikey for professional level consoles. Whether you are working with a digital console from SSL, Midas, Digidesign, or from Sony's Oxford line, the flexibility to use the warmth from a variety of inserts should be available. My normal workflow liberally employs inserts and bus effects to add warmth to my signal if I didn't use a tube outboard piece to record/ process the recording.

The take away message: tape recording has its benefits, and learning how to do it certainly has its advantages but the availability of new gear, and updated recording techniques should be pursued with zest. If you've ever worked with tape, you know how distinctive tape saturation sounds and what driven pre can do for your music. By using new gear and exploiting its routing capabilities, you can get the same effect by combining digital and analog so you don't need to rely on a fully analog signal path.

Ananlog will never go obsolete - ever. Why? Because there is a signature sound that goes along with using such pieces of equipment. In a lot of cases analog pieces are annoying because they require a lot of servicing but, at the same time, it is sin't oout of the ordinary for a studio to have an analog setup or two in their catalog to offer a specific type of vintage sound.

[markthevirtuoso]

if you use the Neve channels as inserts in your signal chain or as a bus effect, mixing on a digital console shouldn't matter; in fact, it ought to be better unless you are mixing with a digital console that colors the sound of your work which is highly unlikey for professional level consoles. Whether you are working with a digital console from SSL, Midas, Digidesign, or from Sony's Oxford line, the flexibility to use the warmth from a variety of inserts should be available. My normal workflow liberally employs inserts and bus effects to add warmth to my signal if I didn't use a tube outboard piece to record/ process the recording.

The take away message: tape recording has its benefits, and learning how to do it certainly has its advantages but the availability of new gear, and updated recording techniques should be pursued with zest. If you've ever worked with tape, you know how distinctive tape saturation sounds and what driven pre can do for your music. By using new gear and exploiting its routing capabilities, you can get the same effect by combining digital and analog so you don't need to rely on a fully analog signal path.

Ananlog will never go obsolete - ever. Why? Because there is a signature sound that goes along with using such pieces of equipment. In a lot of cases analog pieces are annoying because they require a lot of servicing but, at the same time, it is sin't oout of the ordinary for a studio to have an analog setup or two in their catalog to offer a specific type of vintage sound.

Amen to that sir.

Sad to say though that Sony has stopped producing tape records.

But i'd still want to try out and see how it feels like working with straight-ahead analogue equipments someday.
 

[abyssinianson]

there are still a few companies that make tape but I don't know where to get a supply of them since I got into recording during the heyday of ADAT, DAT, and HD recording.