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The Musician Forums => Guitar Central => Topic started by: 24242009 on October 12, 2009, 10:19:36 AM
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Can you consider yourself as a musician if you cant write your own tunes? Well a lot of guitarist claim they are "artist", but being an artist is not copying other's music. Some even claim that they are a "great" guitarist since according to them, they "know a lot of songs" and look down on other guitarist as if ther are the masters of the guitar world. what is the true essence of being a musician? is it that the quantity of copied materials?or the beauty of creating ones tunes? Well it is a fact that Jimi Hendrix songs are all original!!!
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Well a lot of guitarist claim they are "artist", but being an artist is not copying other's music.
Not necessarily. You have to make a distinction between copying and rendering. Making an exact or near exact likeness of an original, whether it be in the realm of music, graphic arts, etc., is no different from a photocopier doing its job. The essence of an artist's craft lies in the fact that he either takes an original or un-original concept and gives it his own personal "flavor". The fact that the concept is original or not is of no significance. What is important is the added-value the artist has given to the concept which is his or hers alone. Oh yeah, not all of Hendrix's songs were original. "All Along the Watchtower" is an old Bob Dylan staple. Does Jimi's doing an un-original piece make him less of an artist/musician? I don't think so. His version of "Watchtower" was quite distinct from Dylan, and Dave Matthews' version as well was quite distinct from Dylan and Hendrix's version (some people even mistake DM's version as a "Stairway to Heaven" clone). It's the personal contribution that sets the artist apart from the machine.
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It poetry, as with other arts, imitation is the best form of flattery for the original artist - hence the prevalence of forms such as parody, covers, remakes, adaptions and er-interpretations. Interestingly Bob Dylan seems to have a dismissive shake-yer-head attitude about covers of his songs becoming more famous than his originals, I didn't see him dissing on the other artists that covered him.
Creativity to me and artistry (ergo including being a musician) isn't limited to creation from without, but also from within. Potah ang lalim senscia na po nadala lang... anyway point is may compo ka or cover, if there's the same effort on your part to re-interpret, re-arrange and express some new idea out of the old or out of nothing, musikero ka pa rin. May pinaghuhugutan yan mga 'tol.
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if you are to consider willie nepomuceno, michael v, weird al yankovic among the few that i can think of, you'd agree that being an artist doesn't necessarily mean you have to create your own music but rather obvious being creative is a significant factor. putting a dash of your own seasoning or as jaco d would put it, your own flavor, i maysay can do magic. :wink:
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Huli mo bro! exactamundo! ALthough merong feeling creative already even if its not much effort really. What if straight cover as in placado... no creativity involved but strict adherence to the original? isn't that artistry din? So musician ka pa rin!
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if you play anything musical, from tansans or rocks, to sitars, you are still a musician.
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if you play anything musical, from tansans or rocks, to sitars, you are still a musician.
tama! si levi celerio nga dahon pa gamit. National artist!
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dapat may konting lasa para ok :-D
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an artist for me
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if you play music, you are a musician, as simple as that
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may pagkakaiba ba ang musician sa artist?
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may pagkakaiba ba ang musician sa artist?
parang actor and thespian ano hehehehe :wink:
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Musician parin, kasi you're making music. Kanya kanyang trip lang yan, some just get by with playing covers, and some love creating songs. Mas may weight para sakin ang originals - pero maganda pa rin syempre you don't get stuck with one aspect. Now kung may ibang gitarista na maangas (marami nyan hehe), yaan mo lang, you can't please everyone. Medyo may angst ka yata ah... :-P
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(http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af215/PATATIM09/1213494732249eh9.png)
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musician, artist, singer, songwriter.... these are just terms
basta maganda output ok! basta chicks ok!
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@jacod and parimari, yes I understand that. In reality musicians get inspirations from each others work as a part of evolution. Well in the 80's a member of the Beegees who used to sing love songs and disco tunes has a song inspired by new wave/dance its caled "boys do fall in love". My main point here is that some guitarist claim to be a guitar God because they know a lot of songs. where is the glory in copying??, well copying (covering songs in general) in my opinion is imitation and also a form of expression. a lot of revivals has a personal touch in it. .. and also listening to others music widens ones horizon musically. that is why music is evoloving constantly, as well as guitar playing.
thinking about the future of guitars is quite exciting, a lot of people will definitely come up with great tunes...I just dont know who in this decade can be the next Jimi hendrix, but a lot of good guitarist was inspired and thanks to him.
Elvis Presley for example, do cover a lot of songs in his entire career. But as a guitarist, Able to emulate slash guitar solo is something, but able to make your own guitar solo is monumental.
musician as defined "One who composes, conducts, or performs music, especially instrumental music" in short there is totality. If a band only sings cover songs its just a showband, but if it writes their own material for me they are real thing, most importantly a great guitarist can write the most beautiful guitar riffs with his guitar...thats why I salute the greatest guitarists of all time, jimi hendrix, george harrison, eric clapton, bb king...and the others because they wrote all those good stuffs and has helped shape the music and guitar today
if guitarist all around th eworld had not wrote at all, by now i think we are all plyaing ukeleles playing the same tunes
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may pagkakaiba ba ang musician sa artist?
artist is so general kung musician in to music ka lang tlga hehehee
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artist is so general kung musician in to music ka lang tlga hehehee
yes I agree and all pertains to expression, just like: martial artist, grafitti artist, tatoo artist etc... whereas music is to music alone :)
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Kaya ako Artist ako hehehehe di lang musician
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Music is an art.
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Hmmmm, bahala na sya dun kung ano gusto nya itawag sa sarili nya., haha., tawag ko sa sarili ko musician , haha, kahit wala pa ako nagagawa ni isa.,puro kopya lang,haha,
pabayaan ko na lang sila., lahat tayo may karapatang lumigaya., :lol: lalim
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ako mukhang artist-tah haha :lol:
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ako mukhang artist-tah haha :lol:
wow arkee! artistahin :-D ako call it what ever you want :wink:
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Can you consider yourself as a musician if you cant write your own tunes? Well a lot of guitarist claim they are "artist", but being an artist is not copying other's music. Some even claim that they are a "great" guitarist since according to them, they "know a lot of songs" and look down on other guitarist as if ther are the masters of the guitar world. what is the true essence of being a musician? is it that the quantity of copied materials?or the beauty of creating ones tunes? Well it is a fact that Jimi Hendrix songs are all original!!!
All great artists learned thier crafts by studying someone elses stuff at one point or another. How can you learn an art without something to study technicaly? being an artist involves learning through others to improve on your own... can you give one truly great artist who didn't study someone elses work first?
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ako mukhang artist-tah haha :lol:
hanggang dito ba naman boss ark?? :lol: :lol:
BTT:
bakit kaylangan pa bang tawagin ka munang chef para malaman ng tao na marunong/magaling ka magluto? hehe. :-D syempre pwede naman nilang tikman ka, este yung niluto mo. :lol:
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All great artists learned thier crafts by studying someone elses stuff at one point or another. How can you learn an art without something to study technicaly? being an artist involves learning through others to improve on your own... can you give one truly great artist who didn't study someone elses work first?
like what ive said in my earlier posts,musicians get inspiration from other musicians as well :) apparently it involves, imitating, emulating and getting inspired from others work :) by then one has not only gained abilities, also confidence and skill to express oneself in music. Rolling stones started out as a cover band, but later writes their own music.
I just dont like the idea that some people claim to be a music master well in fact all they ever do is copy (cover songs) in gigs alike.
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hindi.
para sakin basta marunong tumugtog musikero na agad, 8-)
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like what ive said in my earlier posts,musicians get inspiration from other musicians as well :) apparently it involves, imitating, emulating and getting inspired from others work :) by then one has not only gained abilities, also confidence and skill to express oneself in music. Rolling stones started out as a cover band, but later writes their own music.
I just dont like the idea that some people claim to be a music master well in fact all they ever do is copy (cover songs) in gigs alike.
but what about classical musicians? most of them do not compose thier own music but they do interpret some classic sheet music differently... imitation is an art by itself you know... no one can master art perse though you can master a technique or a form or even an instrument......
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but what about classical musicians? most of them do not compose thier own music but they do interpret some classic sheet music differently... imitation is an art by itself you know... no one can master art perse though you can master a technique or a form or even an instrument......
im not really familiar with names of classical musicians, but I know some classical tunes had been written in our present time. Star trek soundtrack and star wars for example; those musical scores are written by composers and performed with an orchestra (lots of classical musical instruments there). Superman movie as well. And various musical plays and lots of movies do have soundtracks that has written music sheets all over.
yes imitation is an art as well, we can call it interpretation and doing it better than the original is really cool. As I remember many musical artists had copied, performed, recorded some beatles song, but frankly speaking beatles does it best :) Even Jimi Hendrix covered the beatles song "day tripper" also covering songs is a way to show respect to musicians you adore and like, a tribute per se.
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im not really familiar with names of classical musicians, but I know some classical tunes had been written in our present time. Star trek soundtrack and star wars for example; those are musical scores are written by composers and performed via orchestra (lots of classical musical instruments there). Super movie as well. And various musical plays and lots of movies do have soundtracks that has written music sheets all over.
yes imitation is an art as well, we can call it interpretation and doing it better than the original is really cool. As I remember many musical artists had copied, performed, recorded some beatles song, but frankly speaking beatles does it best :) Even Jimi Hendrix covered the beatles song "day tripper" also covering songs is a way to show respect to musicians you adore and like, a tribute per se.
I didn't say that there are no more new classical pieces being composed presently... what Im trying to say is not all of the musicians in an orchestra writes thier own music... can you call them anything else but musicians or artists if they dont write their own music? your second argument about the original always being better than when interpreted by other musicians is highly subjective...did you know that hey joe is not a
hendrix original? most of us heard it first from him because the original version did not make as much of an impact as hendrix's version...
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I didn't say that there are no more new classical pieces being composed presently... what Im trying to say is not all of the musicians in an orchestra writes thier own music... can you call them anything else but musicians or artists if they dont write their own music? your second argument about the original always being better than when interpreted by other musicians is highly subjective... hey joe is not a
hendrix original? most of us heard it first from him because the original version did not make as much of an impact as hendrix's version...
I dont excatly know classical stuffs, hmm good point but in my opinion they can be called a violin player since they play violin without writing a violin piece, but if they express themselves with their instruments, writes their music in musical staffs well they are musicians per se. I think there is nothing like the original singer who sang the song. Eraserheads for example are legendary, even if the tribute album made by today's bands does not sound like the original e-heads eventhough we all know that this is mere an interpretation of the original.
Off topic well star trek the next generation tv series is cool but nothings like the original star trek. On certain aspects some people even make interpretations better than the original speaking in guitar terms I can recall a spefic name but on singing Charice Pempengco, sang better than the original singers in her renditions :-D
On guitar, I forgot the name of the guy who is a regular contributor of tabs at guitar world magazine. He has even made a Jimi Hendrix DVD, in the guitar dvd magazine. I forgot the name, but he plays it like jimi...
But on certain aspects if a person plays a guitar like we all do, it does not mean one has to write a song and jump on stage and stage dive to fans. A person maybe happy just playing the tunes of his idols some just play for a relief, some for hobby, others for passion. Some people wanted to become famous and speaking of famous people Ive never heard a guitarist who became famous just by playing covers, the famous people ive seen on public are people who writes beautiful songs...some do became famous by doing acoustic guitar covers but it doesnt last that long..or maybe the song it good by itself.
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I dont excatly know classical stuffs, hmm good point but in my opinion they can be called a violin player since they play violin without writing a violin piece, but if they express themselves with their instruments, writes their music in musical staffs well they are musicians per se. I think there is nothing like the original singer who sang the song. Eraserheads for example are legendary, even if the tribute album made by today's bands does not sound like the original e-heads eventhough we all know that this is mere an interpretation of the original.
Off topic well star trek the next generation tv series is cool but nothings like the original star trek. On certain aspects some people even make interpretations better than the original speaking in guitar terms I can recall a spefic name but on singing Charice Pempengco, sang better than the original singers in her renditions :-D
On guitar, I forgot the name of the guy who is a regular contributor of tabs at guitar world magazine. He has even made a Jimi Hendrix DVD, in the guitar dvd magazine. I forgot the name, but he plays it like jimi...
But on certain aspects if a person plays a guitar like we all do, it does not mean one has to write a song and jump on stage and stage dive to fans. A person maybe happy just playing the tunes of his idols some just play for a relief, some for hobby, others for passion. Some people wanted to become famous and speaking of famous people Ive never heard a guitarist who became famous just by playing covers, the famous people ive seen on public are people who writes beautiful songs...some do became famous by doing acoustic guitar covers but it doesnt last that long..or maybe the song it good by itself.
what ever floats your boat....
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pornographist pa rin!!
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@bluenote Im just a guitar hobbyist just an ordinary guitar player and just sharing my opinion on things, thanks for exchanging views :)
@ermonski, si steven segal martial artist at guitarist din :)
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"I don't want to get into a semantic argument, I just want the protein"
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@bluenote Im just a guitar hobbyist just an ordinary guitar player and just sharing my opinion on things, thanks for exchanging views :)
@ermonski, si steven segal martial artist at guitarist din :)
so am I... everyone is entitled to have an opinion... i respect your's...
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Big deal ba masyado yang "musician" na term???
Well, in my case, my musical ability is not even close to those people I consider great players but I have a music degree from a conservatory and people pay me to play and give lessons. Maybe, that makes me a musician or whatever you want to call it...
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I just dont like the idea that some people claim to be a music master well in fact all they ever do is copy (cover songs) in gigs alike.
I think you're selling yourself short here. Music....ok, lets forget about music and generalize,...."Art" is such as broad concept that trying to define where it begins and where it ends is an exercise in futility. Medyo mahirap sabihing "this is art" and "that is not art". However, you, and only you can say "this is bad art" and "this is good art", subjecting the object to as many adjectives as you can think of (but that's another thing to discuss better saved for another day). In the same manner, mahirap sabihing "this is art" or "that is not art" on the basis of whether the concept is original or not, and you can extend the reasoning to the doer of the concept as well: mahirap sabihing "he (she) is an artist" or "he (she) is not an artist" based on whether he does original stuff or not. Art is such a broad concept that if we were to say that the only way to call one's self an "artist" is to cover art in its entirety (how you're gonna do that I don't know since we don't know its boundaries to begin with) - from origination to execution, then I suggest that the concept of "artist" does not exist. Man has his limitations, so he either specializes and never wanders away from his specialization or does "a little bit of this and a little bit of that". With that in mind, an "Artist" can either originate stuff, just do covers, or do "a little bit of this and a little bit of that" (hmm, that's an old Lee Riteneour song!), with the common thread running through them being "I contributed my own input based on my experience".
At the end of the day, as Bluenote put it: "Whatever floats your boat", and I'll take it at that.
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@bluenote, thanks yes I do respect your post as well. Maybe I should have rephrased the title of the thread and I think I may be wrong. Well musician is a broad term naturally and all of people related to creating and performing music are associated. Just like the term "guitarist" one may be a bass guitarist, acoustic guitarist and all sorts..
@william25, thats nice so youre a professional musician :)
@JacoD, yes just like what Ive just said to bluenote. Yes all people related to music are musicians but on a defined sector. A band may be a rock band, pop or metal etc..classifiying it more a band can be a showband(cover band) or a recording artist(records their materials) and expressing oneself through different mediums made it such :)
And no offense or anything just trying to discuss matters here :)
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musician as defined "One who composes, conducts, or performs music, especially instrumental music" in short there is totality.
With all due respect, you missed the definition bro. To keep things short, I would consider anyone who performs artistry, an artist.
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you are what you think you are
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wow arkee! artistahin :-D ako call it what ever you want :wink:
haha! makapal lang mukha ko haha
nice! :lol:
hanggang dito ba naman boss ark?? :lol: :lol:
BTT:
bakit kaylangan pa bang tawagin ka munang chef para malaman ng tao na marunong/magaling ka magluto? hehe. :-D syempre pwede naman nilang tikman ka, este yung niluto mo. :lol:
hehe you know me haha
hmmm ok yung point mo... mas may karapatan lang magsabi ang chef na "magaling ako magluto" kasi pinag aralan nila yan...
pero hindi rin natin pwedeng sabihin na chef lang ang magaling di ba :lol:
hindi lahat ng mainstream at sumikat magaling (uhm magaling din pala kasi sumikat nga eh hehe), yung iba kulang lang sa exposure at connections... marami d'yan nasa sulok sulok ng bahay o kung saan man...
kmas may say lang yung mainstream dahil sila exposed...
ganun din sa pagiging artist/musician or kung ano man itawag...
you are what you think you are
sakto! :mrgreen:
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"art" is subjective eh.
pag tuma3 ang aso sa daan at pinicturan, at finrame, sa iba art yan.
sa iba, ta3 lang talaga yan na naka frame
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"art" is subjective eh.
pag tuma3 ang aso sa daan at pinicturan, at finrame, sa iba art yan.
sa iba, ta3 lang talaga yan na naka frame
oo nga 'no, may mga psycho na nakakagawa ng weird/horrible/ o kung ano man... sa kanila "art"
ako gagawa ng "Weapon of mass destruction" at tatawagin ko itong "art" hahaha (http://smileyicons.net/s/370.gif)
(http://smileyicons.net/s/1063.gif)(http://smileyicons.net/s/1063.gif)(http://smileyicons.net/s/1063.gif)
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yang mga emoticons mo arkee, art yan :wink:
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Those who buy guitars and use it for playing music are called musicians. The ones who buys guitars for the purpose of saying they have a guitar with a tone that sounds good, are called "toneicians". :-D :-D :-D
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Those who buy guitars and use it for playing music are called musicians. The ones who buys guitars for the purpose of saying they have a guitar with a tone that sounds good, are called "toneicians". :-D :-D :-D
"toneicians" me likey :-D Mr. Chito pa patent mo na yang term na yan :-D ngayun ko lang narinig yan eh... so there are musicians and there are toneicians... ayuz
anyway to me Music is just a technical concept (nothing more than frequencies triggered at particular moments on a particular rhythmic pulse) ....it becomes an artform depending on the individual trying to express it.... siguro anybody can be a musician but being an artist is something else.. if music becomes a medium of expression then it becomes an artform
Playing exact covers is an artform in itself too (kahit na im not into that anymore for more than 15 years), but interpreting an already written material and then stands on its own is more special in my opinion.
but one music music professor once told me...he said a musician is someone who greatly contributed to the art of it..... so that would be guys like Mozart, Bob Mareley, Jimi Hendrix, Eddie Van Halen, The Edge, Tom Morello, Frank Zappa, Curt Cobain, the Beatles, etc. and that makes us all "Merely Players"
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Anyone that can produce music is called a musician. :wink:
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Trivia lang: Even poets have arguments about what is poetry, what is poetic, what is art, what is beauty, etc. Same banana din since wala kaming nasesettle pag lasing na... Good thing about musicians, or at least people who know how to play is, pag whatever definition you have pag jamming time na somehow it works...
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ah ok...
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Playing exact covers is an artform in itself too (kahit na im not into that anymore for more than 15 years), but interpreting an already written material and then stands on its own is more special in my opinion.
but one music music professor once told me...he said a musician is someone who greatly contributed to the art of it..... so that would be guys like Mozart, Bob Mareley, Jimi Hendrix, Eddie Van Halen, The Edge, Tom Morello, Frank Zappa, Curt Cobain, the Beatles, etc. and that makes us all "Merely Players"
AMEN :-D nice quote from your prof :) tom morelo and kurt cobain are truly great musicians I love them
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Katarantaduhan naman yata yung kahit anong gusto mong art, art na! I freakin’ don’t believe that.
Kaya nga may conservatory and fine arts school eh. Usually art that’s any worth at all have a rich history and very talented people who raised their craft in to an art form, i.e. jazz, some good pop and rock, classical music etc.
Example, some crap at mtv, I compare it to junk foods i.e. french fries, greasy food etc. it’s easily consumable to the public but you’ll never really get that much out of it.
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Katarantaduhan naman yata yung kahit anong gusto mong art, art na! I freakin’ don’t believe that.
Kaya nga may conservatory and fine arts school eh. Usually art that’s any worth at all have a rich history and very talented people who raised their craft in to an art form, i.e. jazz, some good pop and rock, classical music etc.
Example, some crap at mtv, I compare it to junk foods i.e. french fries, greasy food etc. it’s easily consumable to the public but you’ll never really get that much out of it.
hmmm your refering to the masters who have bee shaping the world of music. Well I agree with that, Jazz guitar gods, rock guitar gods and alike..
well youre also right about crap at mtv, so much quantity but substance lacking these days.
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sad to say, nowadays na cheapen na yung word na art. look around you, trash made into a sculpture, music from the armpit, painting by an elephant, yaiks!!.... tamad na yung mga tao eh.
IMHO, true art takes time and dedication.
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Katarantaduhan naman yata yung kahit anong gusto mong art, art na! I freakin’ don’t believe that.
Kaya nga may conservatory and fine arts school eh. Usually art that’s any worth at all have a rich history and very talented people who raised their craft in to an art form, i.e. jazz, some good pop and rock, classical music etc.
Example, some crap at mtv, I compare it to junk foods i.e. french fries, greasy food etc. it’s easily consumable to the public but you’ll never really get that much out of it.
yung point ko naman, hindi lang yung pumasok sa conservatory ang pwede makagawa ng "art". regardless kung talagang art nga or hindi...
agree ako sa point n'yo na...
sad to say, nowadays na cheapen na yung word na art. look around you, trash made into a sculpture, music from the armpit, painting by an elephant, yaiks!!.... tamad na yung mga tao eh.
IMHO, true art takes time and dedication.
yes :lol:
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yang mga emoticons mo arkee, art yan :wink:
haha :lol:
Those who buy guitars and use it for playing music are called musicians. The ones who buys guitars for the purpose of saying they have a guitar with a tone that sounds good, are called "toneicians". :-D :-D :-D
wow! bagong term :lol:
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^^ano ang example ng "tonecians??" :-D
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ang totoong art ay gawa ni artkeetart. :lol: isa syang toneicians. :lol:
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^^ano ang example ng "tonecians??" :-D
haha breed yan ng mga gitaristang mahilig maghanap ng tone pero hindi pa rin nila mahanap haha :lol:
ang totoong art ay gawa ni artkeetart. :lol: isa syang toneicians. :lol:
(http://smileyicons.net/s/504.gif)
makulay na umbrella para s'yo (http://smileyicons.net/s/515.gif)