Effect chain/Equipment if i want to plug my analog pedals>>multiFX>>amp

[luin_theblue]

The BBE process is real, not a hoopia. Unlike an EQ pedal, it works to generate clarity in the signal by delaying certain frequencies and letting other frequencies pass through, in order to prevent "envelope distortion", or muddiness, etc., whatever. By setting up the Sonic Maximizer/Stomp, you can fix which frequencies (the high ones or the lower ones) need to pass through first so that what you hear from the speaker is a clear and alive sound, not the muddy or dead sound (which comes from certain frequencies reaching your ear first when other frequencies need to reach your ear the same time or later).

... something like that.

I hope I was understood. If not, sorry. Hahahahaha.

So now I wonder how the Aural Xciters work. The scalarizers add harmonic overtones and rely on the energy of the guitar signal...

[BAMF]

Yes. As far back as the 90's, I've encountered BBE products already. They were not yet for guitar but rather for Pro Audio. Yes, I believe it was called the Aural Exciter (sounds kinky aint it).

The technical description back then was that it also adds musically-related overtones and harmonics.

Later in the 21st century, I seem to have come across a different explanation...it now filters and selects frequencies for delaying so that all of the sound "arrives" at the same time. Which is quite good when playing music for large venues...it would be awkward to hear the bass notes first before the treble notes. Or is it the other way around...anyway, that's what it does.

[luin_theblue]

OT: I have my brother's sonic maximizer + di-100. Over ten years old and still runs well.

So to answer Siore's question. Yes, the BBE sonic stomp and Aphex aural exciters attempt to restore the level of a chopped signal very well.

[siore]

So I guess that's the compensation pedal the TS is looking for eh?   

[luin_theblue]

Possibly. But my personal favored option is to modify the mfx, take out the tonesuckers and add a scalarizer. Much cheaper than buying a signal exciter/maximizer. But hey that's just me. Having both is not overkill.

[BAMF]

So I guess that's the compensation pedal the TS is looking for eh?   

Could be, but it's an artificially inserted enrichment signal. Wouldn't it be great to preserve the original signal rather than try to reconstruct a chopped up one ?

[luin_theblue]

Could be, but it's an artificially inserted enrichment signal. Wouldn't it be great to preserve the original signal rather than try to reconstruct a chopped up one ?

Yeah. Rather than recreate the signal, why not prevent the tone loss in the first place.

Which leads me back to my first point, why not try modding and scalarizing the mfx.

[Stratzkiboy]

Thanks for the wealth of information guys!!!

So the best value for money it seems is

Locally made looper pedal => Scalarized Multifx!!!

But the info's opening up a ton of exploration and research!! Funny how a problem sheds light on a lot of different questions. Ahhh!! the things we do for that elusive "TONE" that we have in our heads!!

So basically the aural exicter is a sonic stomp with the add on value of "exciting" harmonic overtones!! Correct me guys if im wrong...

Seems i got a pending appointment with sir BAMF!! hehehehe...

hmmmm.... what if i scalarize the return or send of the looper that will be in the multifx's path?? same effect without opening up the multi??

if money's no object id get this then!!! May DI out pa!!

Pasensiya na sa mga tanong this topic really tickled my curiosity



Aural Exciter(tm)
Countless albums and CD's owe part of their success to the Aphex Aural Exciter It's been a 'secret weapon' of top producers and artists for over 24 years. This patented process adds transient discriminate harmonic details to the sound - without turning it into distortion. If you want distortion, then use any distortion effect you like. The Aural Exciter will still add something good. No other so-called 'exciter' or 'maximizer' even comes close to the genuine Aphex Aural Exciter. You're going to hear that for yourself.

Big Bottom(tm)
Not a sub-synth, or static boost, Big Bottom is a smart system that adapts and improves what's already there. Speakers gain an extension of their low end, yet amplifiers and speakers are not overloaded. You get better sustain, but still get all the transient punch. Beyond bass, however, Big Bottom adds warmth and roundness to any instrument. Optical Big Bottom is the latest technology advancement using an optical compression device for smoother and punchier

[simon_divitico]

eto baka makatulong din, kasi nag-chain din ako ng multi effects at analog peds eh. Nung una kong ginawa yung chain sa maliit kong amp, medyo hindi lumitaw yung mga "flaws" so ok lang muna sa dati kong timpla. Pero nung nagjam na kami gamit ang malaking amp, may mali na.

Ang na-discover ko eto:
1. pangit i-set ang equalizer ng multi effects kung i-chchain mo i-disable mo lang yun (kahit anong timpla ang gawin parang may mali, sa amp ko na lang tinimpla)

2. pati yung noise reduction function, nawawala yung responsiveness nung analog sound eh para sakin  tapos wag nang gumamit ng reverb sa multi effects. Yung sa amp na lang

Ako lang naman yun 

[luin_theblue]

eto baka makatulong din, kasi nag-chain din ako ng multi effects at analog peds eh. Nung una kong ginawa yung chain sa maliit kong amp, medyo hindi lumitaw yung mga "flaws" so ok lang muna sa dati kong timpla. Pero nung nagjam na kami gamit ang malaking amp, may mali na.

Ang na-discover ko eto:
1. pangit i-set ang equalizer ng multi effects kung i-chchain mo i-disable mo lang yun (kahit anong timpla ang gawin parang may mali, sa amp ko na lang tinimpla)

2. pati yung noise reduction function, nawawala yung responsiveness nung analog sound eh para sakin  tapos wag nang gumamit ng reverb sa multi effects. Yung sa amp na lang

Ako lang naman yun 

First, peace bro, hindi away ang hinahanap ko. I just want to share my extra two centavos.

1. In my modded g2.1u (ricabb and BAMF tweaked), I find the 3 band eq very helpful with amp simulation (condenser @ 2). With the eq tweaked, to my ears I seem to find a pretty transparent setting. Still kinda digital but hey, it's a digital mfx after all (but it's much more analog-y and warm and tube amp-like now). Haha. My rig is like this: guitar > od heavy > comp > od transparent > zoom g2.1u > eq. But my setting nowadays I like setting my patches to somewhat dirty so that when I kick in my analog ods I get rhythm dirty to lead settings (by turning all my analog ods and comp too, it doesn't get noisy).  The Zoom noise gate (nr) is pretty good. The response from my analogs with the gate turned on seems fine to me. I don't make a high gate setting anyway.

2. You're right about the reverb. However, in a live setting, it's better not to use massive amounts reverb in the first place. At least that's what I was taught and I believe in now. Natural reverb is always better or set an echo-y delay.

Stratzkiboy, look at my rig (in #1 above) just for ideas. I'm not complaining with the sound I get and I use it live.

[Stratzkiboy]

First, peace bro, hindi away ang hinahanap ko. I just want to share my extra two centavos.

1. In my modded g2.1u (ricabb and BAMF tweaked), I find the 3 band eq very helpful with amp simulation (condenser @ 2). With the eq tweaked, to my ears I seem to find a pretty transparent setting. Still kinda digital but hey, it's a digital mfx after all (but it's much more analog-y and warm and tube amp-like now). Haha. My rig is like this: guitar > od heavy > comp > od transparent > zoom g2.1u > eq. But my setting nowadays I like setting my patches to somewhat dirty so that when I kick in my analog ods I get rhythm dirty to lead settings (by turning all my analog ods and comp too, it doesn't get noisy).  The Zoom noise gate (nr) is pretty good. The response from my analogs with the gate turned on seems fine to me. I don't make a high gate setting anyway.

2. You're right about the reverb. However, in a live setting, it's better not to use massive amounts reverb in the first place. At least that's what I was taught and I believe in now. Natural reverb is always better or set an echo-y delay.

Stratzkiboy, look at my rig (in #1 above) just for ideas. I'm not complaining with the sound I get and I use it live.

Thanks dude!! im getting closer to what i want!!

oh...

What kinda tweaks did ricabb and BAMF do?

 

[luin_theblue]

my reviews on -

ricabb7 (zoom g2.1u): http://talk.philmusic.com/board/index.php/topic,81058.180.html

BAMF (all peds): http://talk.philmusic.com/board/index.php/topic,49128.585.html

Take note that I changed switched my hm100 before the compressor because it's really mid heavy. Over boosting the signal before the overdriven hm100 caused it to sound too fart-y.

In a nutshell, Ricabb7 revved up and brightened the sound of my g2.1u (wider and more 3D sound, alive and less processed sound, real-er chorus and delay), BAMF warmed and zapped it up all the more (uber warmth, harmonics and overall improvement of emulations).

The two mods are perfect together (although BAMF discovered part of the ricabb7 mod by taking out some parts, si sir Ricabb7 says he removes AND ADDS parts, but the hardware changes I can't seem to find hehe, but ricabb7 did improve tone).



May I also mention that I have a scalarizer on both my guitar and digital fx. I don't mean to put a promo plug but I just think that fact can shows how much I invested in this scalarizer technology, not that it's a new fad but it works for a surprising amount of investment.

[simon_divitico]

First, peace bro, hindi away ang hinahanap ko. I just want to share my extra two centavos.

1. In my modded g2.1u (ricabb and BAMF tweaked), I find the 3 band eq very helpful with amp simulation (condenser @ 2). With the eq tweaked, to my ears I seem to find a pretty transparent setting. Still kinda digital but hey, it's a digital mfx after all (but it's much more analog-y and warm and tube amp-like now). Haha. My rig is like this: guitar > od heavy > comp > od transparent > zoom g2.1u > eq. But my setting nowadays I like setting my patches to somewhat dirty so that when I kick in my analog ods I get rhythm dirty to lead settings (by turning all my analog ods and comp too, it doesn't get noisy).  The Zoom noise gate (nr) is pretty good. The response from my analogs with the gate turned on seems fine to me. I don't make a high gate setting anyway.

2. You're right about the reverb. However, in a live setting, it's better not to use massive amounts reverb in the first place. At least that's what I was taught and I believe in now. Natural reverb is always better or set an echo-y delay.

Stratzkiboy, look at my rig (in #1 above) just for ideas. I'm not complaining with the sound I get and I use it live.

Ah gamit mo pala is G2.1, sakin kasi ang chnichain ko saanalog peds ko is a zoom G1... so napakhirap para sakin timplahan nun with a digitech bad monkey chained with it since ang alam ko, di parehas ng format ng chip or whatever ang Gi at G2.1... (masmaganda ang G2.1  )

Hmmm, pero sayang, nung mga Gfx8 ako, wala pa kong analog so di ko na-discover yun (I would have kept the gfx8 if only nalaman ko yun dati pa) 

[luin_theblue]

Medyo OT. Pasensiya na.

Simon:

Pareho lang ang chip ng g2 at g1 (zfx-3), iba lang yung firmware I think. The way the g1 effects are tweaked are similar to the 505,606 series, pero sound quality is at par w/ g2. So what I get with my g2 you can somehow get with your g1. Modded yung sakin so maybe that plays a big factor, but before it was modded I use it already with analog pedals.

Hmm. Try turning on booster (pick yung pinaka mid), flat eq, tapos pinaka transparent na cabinet simulation (asa znr/amp ata yun). Turn on your analog then try to tweak the booster, eq, and cabinet simulation to get a most transparent setting. Gets ba?

Peace.

[simon_divitico]

Medyo OT. Pasensiya na.

Simon:

Pareho lang ang chip ng g2 at g1 (zfx-3), iba lang yung firmware I think. The way the g1 effects are tweaked are similar to the 505,606 series, pero sound quality is at par w/ g2. So what I get with my g2 you can somehow get with your g1. Modded yung sakin so maybe that plays a big factor, but before it was modded I use it already with analog pedals.

Hmm. Try turning on booster (pick yung pinaka mid), flat eq, tapos pinaka transparent na cabinet simulation (asa znr/amp ata yun). Turn on your analog then try to tweak the booster, eq, and cabinet simulation to get a most transparent setting. Gets ba?

Peace.

When you said booster ba, did you mean yung externazl dist ko? everything is clear except for that one 

Anyway, kasi nung binili ko sa JB megamall yung G1 ko, may kasabay akong nagtetest ng G2 (artista pa nga eh, hehe, di ko alam yung pangalan). Parang iba kako tunog ng G2. Ayun lang 

[luin_theblue]

No. Yung booster ng g1. Sa may comp/efx ata.
Actually, if the analog pedal turned on sounds nice without the g1 booster, eh di huwag na.

Aaaaaah. Settings lang yun bro. Old school (505s/606s) kasi yung method ng settings ng g1 kaysa sa g2. I took some time learning it also because I had a 505II. I could pretty much get a g2 sound with a g1.

[Stratzkiboy]

thanx super for the info mga chong!!! 

just wanted to share...

talked to a friend about this and he came up with an expensive solution which got me laughing...

1.) sell my gear
2.) get these:

Line6 PODxt + midicontroller

wala lang....

sobrang tiwala kasi yun sa line 6 eh...

 

[luin_theblue]

It all boils down to what sound you want and can live with bro. Haha. Ang laki ng potential ng current setup mo. Why not work on it first before investing in another one...

[BAMF]

Well...just to add...

I made a simple pedalboard from a piece of plywood, velcro and a laptop bag. It houses a scalarized and modified zoom G2, an FP02  a modded Boston OD100 and a regulated power supply.

Looks like this is the gear I'll be taking with me on gigs. Love it !

[luin_theblue]

Speaking of home made boards:

Boston HM100 > Daphon E20CM > Ibanez TS7 > Zoom G2.1u + M-Audio Exp pedal > Boston EQ100 > Amp
All modded pedals (Except EQ).

+ Crybaby before everything else. Hehe.

[ghostalker]

speaking of fx+multi chain

ok lng ba yung chain ko?


AMp - volume ped - g2 - Hm200 - LP copy


OT:
I'm saving up for Digitech Bad monkey, should I sell my HM200 (mukhang hindi ko masyado need for Church) para mabilis makaipon ng money or Huwag ko muna sell and patiently mag-ipon ako for bad monkey?

[BAMF]

speaking of fx+multi chain

ok lng ba yung chain ko?


AMp - volume ped - g2 - Hm200 - LP copy


OT:
I'm saving up for Digitech Bad monkey, should I sell my HM200 (mukhang hindi ko masyado need for Church) para mabilis makaipon ng money or Huwag ko muna sell and patiently mag-ipon ako for bad monkey?

Wag ka na bili Bad Monkey pa mod mo na lang HM200 mo so it can go from overdrive to heavy metal.

[luin_theblue]

Second the motion. I have a modded Hm100. Turning it up brings my tone to a lead setting.

[ghostalker]

Wag ka na bili Bad Monkey pa mod mo na lang HM200 mo so it can go from overdrive to heavy metal.

nasa isip ko pa rin yan options na yan, nung PM mo sa akin yung mga mods mo for HM.
Actually pinag-pe-pray ko pa. I was thinking of Friday next week.

sandali lang ba un? (modding process)

Pa PM nung specific MOD na would match or outweigh the sound I'm looking for.
Pati yun price.
Then pag pray natin.

God bless (lalo na sa mga taong puyat)