need help in acoustic guitar recording

[bone]

Good day sir. i'm new in recording. just want to record  my new project
cajon, acoustic guitar and some percs.

in recording the guitar dapat bang direct na sa mixer or naka-mic dapat?
pls teach me naman mga sirs how to do it the proper way.

salamat po.

[KitC]

Acoustics usually have piezo pickups which sound harsh when plugged direct to the mixer. I suggest passing the signal thru a guitar DI box first. An acoustic sounds best when miked. Start with a condenser above the 12th fret aimed at the neck/body joint, then move it towards the body until you hit the sweet spot

[xjepoyx]

you can also refer to this http://talk.philmusic.com/board/index.php/topic,33156.0.html for micing a cajon

[starfugger]

i use two mics.  when i still had my pencil condenser (it disappeared one day come back come back wherever you are) id point the pencil condenser at the 12 fret, then a large diaphragm condenser at the other side of the guitar, about 6 inches at the lower side of the body pointing almost toward the sound hole.  now that i lost the pencil condenser i use a large diaphragm on the 12th fret.  then i pan left and right for a stereo effect. 

[abyssinianson]

I use either 2 Shure SM81-LC's condensers miked in stereo (one pointed at the 12th fret and the other at the body of the guitar slightly behind the soundhole) or a Rode Stereo mic pointed at the 12th fret of the guitar. The working distance for most mic configs is usually 12-15 inches depending on the boom of the guitar.

[terencek]

a Rode Stereo mic pointed at the 12th fret of the guitar. The working distance for most mic configs is usually 12-15 inches depending on the boom of the guitar.

yeah A RODE NT4 does get the sound in most cases

[x_taxi]

ako rin noob.  just startin out with recordin acoustic guitar myself.

i've been usin a shure pg81 condenser with satisfactory results.  just put a bit of reverb to taste.  before, i tried usin the piezo pickups but it didn't capture the dynamics of strummin chords.  but with enough tweakin and effects, slow plucked notes seemed ok.

however, if you have an aura fishman modeller na setup, it sounds very good direct.  heard it from a friend who's drilled a hole in his martin just to put in the fishman transducer.

bottomline, i'd suggest the mic'd route for acoustic guitar.

 

[bone]

thanks for the suggestions.

God Bless.

[skunkyfunk]

For dreadnoughts, I like XY miking the 12th fret somewhere 6-8 inches away.  For Concert models (such as Martin 000s and OMs) I prefer miking the 12th fret and the bridge, with the 3:1 rule.  But what really plays a big role here is the inherent sound of the acoustic guitar itself.  Laminate tops sound dead to me.  Ebony fretboards seem to bright so maybe some silk+steel strings or 80/20s would help.  For dark-sounding acoustics like Martin dreads I prefer Martin Phosphor Bronze strings.

BTW, if the player uses a pick, a thinner pick can sound churpier.  Thicker picks sound brighter to me.

And lastly, DON'T FORGET THE COMPRESSION!  It really evens out the performance...

[KitC]

Nice one, skunk!

Any favorite compressor/compression settings you would like to share?

[abyssinianson]

I would say that compression is dependent on the design of the guitar body. A boomier sounding jumbo would rely more on a heavier compression ratio than, say, an OM or parlor sized acoustic. In either case, applying compression short of hearing the obvious pumping would be an ideal way of sweetening up the mix using compression. A common measure is to use 2 compressors as part of a chain - the first one with a fast attack and a second one with a slower attack to even out the resulting mix and avoid transients. A good starting point would be the following settings:

-release: 250ms-350ms
-attack: 10-15ms
-ratio: 2:1 (try 4:1 also if a smaller ratio sounds too boxy)
-threshold: mine is set at a default of 5db for acoustic guitars and 8db or so for percussion stuff.

hope this helps.

[mikep]

I normally start off things with 4:1 ratio, increase or decrease depending how things sound.  No set rules.  I use my ears to set things as part of the mix.  I never compress or limit (unless necessary) when tracking.  Just do all of these during the mix for an over-all sound.

FWIW

[skunkyfunk]

I normally start off things with 4:1 ratio, increase or decrease depending how things sound.  No set rules.  I use my ears to set things as part of the mix.  I never compress or limit (unless necessary) when tracking.  Just do all of these during the mix for an over-all sound.

FWIW

Sir, I understand you track at Tracks to analog 2".  But in the digital world it won't sound as great.  I think slamming the mic preamp to a nice compressor can give that analog feel of recording for acoustic guitars.  Plugins might help but the feel is so different WHILE tracking when you don't use compression...

[mikep]

Aside from analog, we track using SADiE and RME Fireface 800.  Unless necessary, we track without compression.  If needed, we normally start with 4 : 1.  We take it up from there, whether to increase or decrease compression. 

FWIW

[KitC]

Sir, I understand you track at Tracks to analog 2".  But in the digital world it won't sound as great.  I think slamming the mic preamp to a nice compressor can give that analog feel of recording for acoustic guitars.  Plugins might help but the feel is so different WHILE tracking when you don't use compression...

Analog is more forgiving of overs than digital. With analog, distortion sounds more warm and fuzzy while digital distortion sounds downright cold and harsh; not the thing you would like to commit to tape or hard disk. All the more reason to put a limiter before the A/D converters. Thing is though, when using 24 bit A/D converters, there is a lot more headroom vs. noise compared to older 16-bit A/D converters where you had to slam them a bit with compression (to avoid the noise floor) then put a limiter before A/D to avoid over driving the inputs. Most people I talk to hardly put a compressor before a good 24-bit converter and perform compression and processing in the digital domain.

[mikep]

I normally put my VU within acceptable limits, the reason why I do not use even limiting when tracking.  My VUs become hot and set during the mix.

FWIW