Let's talk Preamps

[KitC]

mark,

Have you considered the Presonus Firestudio? It looks like a Firepod but it seems to address several of the Firepod's issues such as:

1. It now has a mixer application, something the original Firepod lacked.
2. It now has ADAT ports allowing you to expand it with that Octopre you've been GASsing with.
3. It has monitor control capabilities similar to Presonus' own Central Station.

Of course, a few Andrew Jacksons more than the Firepod but, all-in-all, a complete package, IMO.

[KitC]

At last some people here notice how important mic pre's are.  Some studios that charge ridiculously high plug their Mackie VLZ mixers to their "DAWs".  What's worse is some stupid folks plug from the stereo bus to their soundcard's Line-in.

Wow. If I were doing that, I wouldn't even have the gall to call my business a commercial studio. Anyone worth their salt should recognize that your sound is only as good as the weakest link in your signal chain. A preamp is not only a good idea to record your sound through if you are using a mic, it is an integral part of the signal chain if you want good quality audio to work with. Whether you are using a tube pre or a solid state pre, at least use something dedicated for the purpose, no?

Sorry man, but THAT IS THE CASE.  Some studios charge like 600+ per hour with a Digi001 Protools rig.  The dumb folks go there for "Protools."  So while the Digi 001 takes in two mics, the rest of the 6 channels goes through the channel line-outs of the mixer.  

But I have seen worse.  2 Channels of Soundblaster Live through an el cheapo mixer's stereo bus...

Buti nga dyan P600 lang eh. Dito talamak ang mga studios na may ganyang setup din (ganda pa naman sana nung room acoustics). And they charge you for 200 Dirhams (2,836.92 PHP)!!

Mga banda dito nagpapauto sa hitsura nung studio (lakas kasi nang dating eh). Pagdating naman sa signal chain, sablay din.

Over at your place, that could be considered downright thievery. It's a different matter here, however.

I'm not that quick to call anyone 'stupid' when all they have is a soundblaster in their computer. First of all, the 'blaster is the most ubiquitous soundcard available here next to the no-name CM soundcards which some people even use for recording. Since Audigy's and X-Fi's are in the top of the soundcard food chain here, most people assume that these cards have better quality and for the most part, they do.

I used an AWE32 to learn my craft and I'm not ashamed to say that I paired it with an SBLive later on. I owe my DAW training to these cards and in a midi environment, they're quite good. They are also quite passable for demos. Granted that their A/D/A converters aren't that great, but so longs as you use them in the proper context, you're fine.

As for the studios who use 'blasters in their DAWs and pass them off as digital recording, first off, it's a living and secondly, it's marketing. P. T. Barnum put it best, "there's a sucker born every minute", and this is part of the game. I guess it becomes our mandate to educate our fellow musicians on what is possible or not with a 'blaster.

[markthevirtuoso]

At last some people here notice how important mic pre's are.  Some studios that charge ridiculously high plug their Mackie VLZ mixers to their "DAWs".  What's worse is some stupid folks plug from the stereo bus to their soundcard's Line-in.

Wow. If I were doing that, I wouldn't even have the gall to call my business a commercial studio. Anyone worth their salt should recognize that your sound is only as good as the weakest link in your signal chain. A preamp is not only a good idea to record your sound through if you are using a mic, it is an integral part of the signal chain if you want good quality audio to work with. Whether you are using a tube pre or a solid state pre, at least use something dedicated for the purpose, no?

Sorry man, but THAT IS THE CASE.  Some studios charge like 600+ per hour with a Digi001 Protools rig.  The dumb folks go there for "Protools."  So while the Digi 001 takes in two mics, the rest of the 6 channels goes through the channel line-outs of the mixer.  

But I have seen worse.  2 Channels of Soundblaster Live through an el cheapo mixer's stereo bus...

Buti nga dyan P600 lang eh. Dito talamak ang mga studios na may ganyang setup din (ganda pa naman sana nung room acoustics). And they charge you for 200 Dirhams (2,836.92 PHP)!!

Mga banda dito nagpapauto sa hitsura nung studio (lakas kasi nang dating eh). Pagdating naman sa signal chain, sablay din.

Over at your place, that could be considered downright thievery. It's a different matter here, however.

I'm not that quick to call anyone 'stupid' when all they have is a soundblaster in their computer. First of all, the 'blaster is the most ubiquitous soundcard available here next to the no-name CM soundcards which some people even use for recording. Since Audigy's and X-Fi's are in the top of the soundcard food chain here, most people assume that these cards have better quality and for the most part, they do.

I used an AWE32 to learn my craft and I'm not ashamed to say that I paired it with an SBLive later on. I owe my DAW training to these cards and in a midi environment, they're quite good. They are also quite passable for demos. Granted that their A/D/A converters aren't that great, but so longs as you use them in the proper context, you're fine.

As for the studios who use 'blasters in their DAWs and pass them off as digital recording, first off, it's a living and secondly, it's marketing. P. T. Barnum put it best, "there's a sucker born every minute", and this is part of the game. I guess it becomes our mandate to educate our fellow musicians on what is possible or not with a 'blaster.

Amen to that!

Even i started out on my Audigy Platinum. (Imagine for a personal band recording)

mark,

Have you considered the Presonus Firestudio? It looks like a Firepod but it seems to address several of the Firepod's issues such as:

1. It now has a mixer application, something the original Firepod lacked.
2. It now has ADAT ports allowing you to expand it with that Octopre you've been GASsing with.
3. It has monitor control capabilities similar to Presonus' own Central Station.

Of course, a few Andrew Jacksons more than the Firepod but, all-in-all, a complete package, IMO

I'm actually considering that. Specs are awesome. Kaso for $900, i think it's way more practical to consider the Firepod (kukuha din kasi ako ng mics eh).

By the way, how come Firestudio's not on Presonus' website anymore?

[KitC]

By the way, how come Firestudio's not on Presonus' website anymore?

I'm just as perplexed why the Firestudio isn't on the Presonus site but since the product was kinda released during Winter NAMM, that could probably be why (lazy site programmers, perhaps?). It still goes against the grain since they should be marketing the stuff on their site.

[abyssinianson]

At last some people here notice how important mic pre's are.  Some studios that charge ridiculously high plug their Mackie VLZ mixers to their "DAWs".  What's worse is some stupid folks plug from the stereo bus to their soundcard's Line-in.

Wow. If I were doing that, I wouldn't even have the gall to call my business a commercial studio. Anyone worth their salt should recognize that your sound is only as good as the weakest link in your signal chain. A preamp is not only a good idea to record your sound through if you are using a mic, it is an integral part of the signal chain if you want good quality audio to work with. Whether you are using a tube pre or a solid state pre, at least use something dedicated for the purpose, no?

Sorry man, but THAT IS THE CASE.  Some studios charge like 600+ per hour with a Digi001 Protools rig.  The dumb folks go there for "Protools."  So while the Digi 001 takes in two mics, the rest of the 6 channels goes through the channel line-outs of the mixer.  

But I have seen worse.  2 Channels of Soundblaster Live through an el cheapo mixer's stereo bus...

Buti nga dyan P600 lang eh. Dito talamak ang mga studios na may ganyang setup din (ganda pa naman sana nung room acoustics). And they charge you for 200 Dirhams (2,836.92 PHP)!!

Mga banda dito nagpapauto sa hitsura nung studio (lakas kasi nang dating eh). Pagdating naman sa signal chain, sablay din.

Over at your place, that could be considered downright thievery. It's a different matter here, however.

I'm not that quick to call anyone 'stupid' when all they have is a soundblaster in their computer. First of all, the 'blaster is the most ubiquitous soundcard available here next to the no-name CM soundcards which some people even use for recording. Since Audigy's and X-Fi's are in the top of the soundcard food chain here, most people assume that these cards have better quality and for the most part, they do.

I used an AWE32 to learn my craft and I'm not ashamed to say that I paired it with an SBLive later on. I owe my DAW training to these cards and in a midi environment, they're quite good. They are also quite passable for demos. Granted that their A/D/A converters aren't that great, but so longs as you use them in the proper context, you're fine.

As for the studios who use 'blasters in their DAWs and pass them off as digital recording, first off, it's a living and secondly, it's marketing. P. T. Barnum put it best, "there's a sucker born every minute", and this is part of the game. I guess it becomes our mandate to educate our fellow musicians on what is possible or not with a 'blaster.

I used a SB to start out as well, however, I never thought about marketing SB services as part of a "commecial"studio's" core set of equipment.  I mean, back in the day, I thought the Sb was awesome and I thought that was the end of that but, as things worked out, it wasn't even the tip of the iceberg. Then again, to each his own; you can't blame someone who wouldn't know any better, or worse, knows better but chooses to sucker people in anyway. I guess I am too idealistic for my own good sometimes since I've always believed - strongly - in the fact that you work for an honest buck, and that is that. I mean, even if I didn't know the difference between a Digi 001 and full blown PT rig, I would expect the guy offering the services to be at least fair to me, no?

On a different note, I don't know if things got any better back home but I would be very uncomfortable having a lot of pricey gear at home. It was my experience that having something of value at home made you a prime candidate for robbery or a kidnapping scheme.

[starfugger]

that's true Kit.  educating musicians would help them appreciate the tools of the trade, so that at the very least they know what they are paying for when hiring a studio.

[YJMCowboy]

I'm using a Vibra 128 now and I aint stupid.

I'm smart enough to know what it can and can't do. I've
been in a real studio, played and sang in one. But I also
know it's MORE practical to use a soundblaster when one is
passing a demo. I can also make a great demo using a soundblaster.

Can get a "marshalesque sound" using plug ins and a direct recorded guitar.   Recorded via mixer into soundblaster. You can only do that if
your ears "know" to an extent what a recorded marshall tube amp actually sounds like, on a record, in a video, live or when you actually play it. I've got one, played some, have ALL of Yngwie's records. Listening since 87.  

I Got some decent vocal recordings using the soundblaster. Ehem, or was it just my singin' Come on now guys, I just said decent , not great.
I mean if anyone is even considering recording his or her voice atleast
it's gotta be decent right?  

I can use my PC with the soundblaster to control various bad ass
synths and tons of soundfonts which can beat or be equal to many Hardware keyboards recording wise. Actually i havent heared a Keyboard anywhere that can sound more like a real cello  than some of the Cello soundfonts i have. The soundfonts which were true instrument samples are hard to beat. Even the noise of the real instrument is there. Like piano clicks and noises. Granting a Triton sounds better ( haven't tried one ), atleast i didn't have to spend that much to get a good sound on a demo.
And it's all because of a soundblaster. And a Casio controller.

The soundblaster is tough to beat in terms of practicality.
Lalo na sa pinas. FOR HOME DEMOS ONLY, anything commercial
deserves better for the sake of the paying band. I guess as long as the band knows there's a soundblater in the chain, walang lokohan.
May lokohan lang kung magpapaloko yun banda. Dati I paid a commercial studio to digitally remaster my Tape demos on CD. The first thing i asked the engineer was, "ano soundcard Nyo?". Audiomedia III daw. I gave him the go. Pwede na yun sabi ko. Eh meron naman shang Spirit Ghost
na Mixing desk, floor to ceiling na rack gear. Siguro naman hindi ito
magtitipid sa soundcard.  I knew the card was around 700 dollars then.
Used widely in production studios. It pays when You know. And all that time I was using a soundblaster.  

If you know what it's like to work with a 4-track tascam, a
cheapo mixer plugged into a pc with soundblaster, some midi,
and a DAW is like a lifelong dream come true. The musician's
Demo Studio in a box. It's got hiss, but if the signals hot enough,
who cares. As long as it was mixed right and if the music is good
i don't think someone will say, uhhh u know there's some hiss
when you crank the car stereo.

It's been said before that the ears are the greatest intstruments
we have. Greater than the greatest of gear since these are merely
tools subordinate to the god given gifts on the side of our heads.
We use the gear, the gear doesn't use us. Or does it at times.

If i could afford renting one,
I would like to use a Neve ( moded by Brent Avril,
like you read in the mags ), or a Manley, or some
box by George Massenberg ( tama ba spelling
Kit? ) but i would NEVER consider buying one of these because
I'm a songwriter and singer, not a Commercial Studio owner.
It's just not practical for my use even if I could afford it.

The soundblater has and is serving me well.

BUT......

( drum roll )

But someday I want a 2496 Audiophile,
A VTB1 and an SP B1. Also need a budget stereo
Pre with a tube in it.

Because i'm also smart enough to know
when you gotta go you gotta go.

Someday, out goes that soundblaster

But for know I'm happy with it. I'm mean it's not like I hate
my demos because they were done in a soundblaster you know.
I actually like my demos. It's still a great way to get the music into the PC.

Peace.

P.S. I'm pretty sure Kit has done great recordings using his soundblaster

[mariuo]

i've been reading alot about mic preamps and well.. its mostly the same thing. Groove Tubes brick, FMR RNP, and Grace 101.. too bad none are available locally though  

[abyssinianson]

Massenburg's compressors and EQs are great as are Manley pieces of gear. However, musicians are musicians, first and foremost, lets get THAT straightened out. No amount of software and outboard analog gear can fix a crappy singer, singing a crappy song, playing with crappy technique. Moreover, you don't have to have good recording gear because this is a purely optional investment. However, one must ask, is it worth it? It can, sure, depending on what you want out of having your equipment. Personally, I like being able to have compatibility to work with others without having to extend more money into a studio if I can get a good foundation at home and tweak it with as little studio paying time as possible. I mean, you don't have to have mountains of gear. As long as you have a set of few, but well thoughout, quality purchases, you will be in a very good position to produce material that will be quite acceptable for mixing and mastering.

[markthevirtuoso]

The soundblaster is tough to beat in terms of practicality.
Lalo na sa pinas. FOR HOME DEMOS ONLY, anything commercial
deserves better for the sake of the paying band. I guess as long as the band knows there's a soundblater in the chain, walang lokohan.

Ika nga nila...

"Mixing (and Mastering) is an art in its own right"

"Being a muso is another thing"

 



Di na ako makapag-GAS sa gitara since i got into studes and all those stuffs.    

Gusto ko studio naman!