Stainless steel frets pros and cons

[gijira]

i had one accoustic guitar custom made which i specified to have it installed with ss fretwires. Tone wise, i can not discern any difference bet. n.s. and that. tinanong ko luthier regarding his take on that. he told me to pluck an open string and fretted string (first fret lang para hindi malayo) and asked if i hear a difference. maybe with my untrained ear, wala..nada! he said the composition and the density between bone nut and nickel fret is far greater than the difference bet. nickel and stainless steel. he said to me to do the math! gets ko nga sya!

heto pros and cons:

pros:
- super dulas sa bending
- no sign of fretwear, kahit panay bending.
- always shiny, parang bago

cons:
- mahirap na kumbinsihin yung luthier ko na maginstall ulit ng stainless steel na fret wires. palit sya lahat ng nagamit nyang files

[bryanarzaga]

I don't think you could compensate with just EQ I think it would affect even your technique...

not eq alone, also the overall setup of the guitar

But I guess it would still boil down to taste...

pretty much..i have asked alot when its about NS or SS frets..builders offer them..Roy of TomAnderson guitars offers them no extra charge(complete base price of 2499), Bunker offers them $50 extra on trekker no charge on custom series, suhr offers them at $100 extra(custom)..

Also take into consideration that most of the greats still use nickel frets...

of course, they did that with NS and plus some of the things they didnt have back then..(multifx's,PLEK, true temperament frets etc)

but lets put that phrase in a different light because some will be quick to jump here and add the (if it good enough for '(insert artist name') its good enough for me, or fingers-tone discussion),

but  to focus that -'yes' fret material can significantly alter a guitars sound..i believe that..just imagine having frets made of wood(some say ah it will sound warmer, what if the material was stone? that would be twice as hard to work with as NS frets lol..but it wouldnt be brighter in my mind)

so pretty much its all about options for your preferences..

me i like to have both..its just a good to have..guitars with SS(6105's) and NS(6105)..both great materials for frets

[bryanarzaga]

he said the composition and the density between bone nut and nickel fret is far greater than the difference bet. nickel and stainless steel. he said to me to do the math! gets ko nga sya!

i know of nut density and fret material density but how can both contribute as greater based on what you said? care to share?

[gijira]

i know of nut density and fret material density but how can both contribute as greater based on what you said? care to share?

teka po ha! medyo hindi ko gano maintindihan tanong pero ill try to answer based on the explanation of the luthier saken.

the comparison between fretted and unfretted string tone doesnt really make any discenable difference to our mortal ears (saming dalawang tenga lang po). baka kase iba talagang rinig ang difference. he has just proven to me that it doesnt make any perceivable tonal difference (at least siguro in musicality/iba na siguro if we would use instruments to measure frequency response) kung paguusapan fret wire materials. makes sense to me, kahit hindi rocket science explanation nya saken.

[bryanarzaga]

teka po ha! medyo hindi ko gano maintindihan tanong pero ill try to answer based on the explanation of the luthier saken.

the comparison between fretted and unfretted string tone doesnt really make any discenable difference to our mortal ears (saming dalawang tenga lang po). baka kase iba talagang rinig ang difference.

ill just quote what im really after because the above is a different topic to itself but since you added that and this was an acoustic correct? no internal pickups? what is the clearance betweent the fretted fret and the adjacent fret to that? but you know that once you start lowering your action the guitar can sound more trebley?

he has just proven to me that it doesnt make any perceivable tonal difference (at least siguro in musicality/iba na siguro if we would use instruments to measure frequency response) kung paguusapan fret wire materials. makes sense to me, kahit hindi rocket science explanation nya saken.

and with the same low action what if your frets were composite plastic? will the same unfretted / fretted sound difference still apply?


IMA just interested with answers

[gijira]

correct boss! accoustic with no pick ups. regarding action! pag binaba nag brighten tunog, inunplug namin electric and check if theres buzzing somewhere. hirap kase madetect buzzing pag plugged electric.

regarding sa composite fretwires sir. parang ayoko magtry nyan if ever meron man gumawa! safe na ko sa either nisckel or stainless kung makumbinsi ko pa yung gumagawa, pero mukang bomalabs ser! para nga akong sinumbatan nung pinakita yung wear ng mga kikil nya.

[bryanarzaga]

correct boss! accoustic with no pick ups. regarding action! pag binaba nag brighten tunog, inunplug namin electric and check if theres buzzing somewhere. hirap kase madetect buzzing pag plugged electric.

if done right you can lower the action of even an acoustic, the thing is..what can happen is that you can get undesirable overtones..and SS frets can give that..

regarding sa composite fretwires sir. parang ayoko magtry nyan if ever meron man gumawa! safe na ko sa either nisckel or stainless kung makumbinsi ko pa yung gumagawa, pero mukang bomalabs ser! para nga akong sinumbatan nung pinakita yung wear ng mga kikil nya.

OT:

those highlighted text i dont know what they mean

anyway frets themselves can be of any material, lots of old world string instruments dont have the frets we have in guitars(i almost bought myself a pipa)

here's the frets of a saz..so what if our beloved guitars had frets like these? would the tone not create any 'discenable difference to our mortal ears'?

[gijira]

boss, "kikil"= file. sa probinsya namin yan ang tawag ng mga alwage (carpenters), bomalabs=malabo, sinumbatan= naku mahirap to, parang "being held accountable", sorry di ko gano to maexplain.

thanks for the info ser regarding dif'rent fret materials.

now, overtones... maybe im just too lazy too really appreciate the difference between two metal fret materials. dont get me wrong po, its just me. i admire people who can tell the make of a guitars fret by just listening to its sound. pero cguro natututo na rin ako, medyo rinig ko difference ng overtones between an ordinary d28 and hd28.

[bryanarzaga]

boss, "kikil"= file. sa probinsya namin yan ang tawag ng mga alwage (carpenters), bomalabs=malabo, sinumbatan= naku mahirap to, parang "being held accountable", sorry di ko gano to maexplain.

thanks for the info ser regarding dif'rent fret materials.

cool thanks for sharing that

now, overtones... maybe im just too lazy too really appreciate the difference between two metal fret materials. dont get me wrong po, its just me.

i dont think its or your lazy, maybe as some try out many things they start picking the one's that do work for them...i know my previous drummer was really picky(especially cymbals) about every piece of component in his kit and he can make an average kit sound good but already has build a preference that worked for him

i admire people who can tell the make of a guitars fret by just listening to its sound. pero cguro natututo na rin ako, medyo rinig ko difference ng overtones between an ordinary d28 and hd28.

I do too..but the difference will not always consistent..and will not work for everybody..its just best to keep an open mind on things, thats is why personally i dont draw absolute statements such as 'mahogany is better than alder' or SS vs NS tonally..there is just too many factors involved..

OT aside, thanks for sharing your insights and your luthiers' as well

[bluenote]

not eq alone, also the overall setup of the guitar



of course, they did that with NS and plus some of the things they didnt have back then..(multifx's,PLEK, true temperament frets etc)

but lets put that phrase in a different light because some will be quick to jump here and add the (if it good enough for '(insert artist name') its good enough for me, or fingers-tone discussion),

but  to focus that -'yes' fret material can significantly alter a guitars sound..i believe that..just imagine having frets made of wood(some say ah it will sound warmer, what if the material was stone? that would be twice as hard to work with as NS frets lol..but it wouldnt be brighter in my mind)

so pretty much its all about options for your preferences..

me i like to have both..its just a good to have..guitars with SS(6105's) and NS(6105)..both great materials for frets

What I was saying is that they still prefer nickle over stainless frets even up to this day.... 

I guess I just have dog ears... 

[bryanarzaga]

What I was saying is that they still prefer nickle over stainless frets even up to this day.... 

no doubt..some do try new stuff and some dont, its their mojo..

I guess I just have dog ears... 

yup, you most likely do because no one knows your guitar better than the player himself(in your level that is)...

its just the re-occuring band wagon of those who havent tried it and will get stuck into a notion that something is bad because it was a google result..its best to have those try it and for them to decide without some google result coaxing them if they like it or not..

[bluenote]

no doubt..some do try new stuff and some dont, its their mojo..
yup, you most likely do because no one knows your guitar better than the player himself(in your level that is)...

its just the re-occuring band wagon of those who havent tried it and will get stuck into a notion that something is bad because it was a google result..its best to have those try it and for them to decide without some google result coaxing them if they like it or not..

Agree bow... 

[spetsnaz1123]

Wow, ang ganda ng mga palitan ng kuro-kuro...very informative...Thank you mga bossing ...

[analog.matt]

maki share din ako.

i'm no expert nor very experienced like some of our members here.

but i remember reading somewhere na modern luthiers daw in their building of their guitars compensate for the SS frets. sa pick ups daw ang compensation? don't ask me brothers, i'm just sharing what i read. how they compensate, i really don't know.

and sabi nga ni Leo Fender, some people just have extra ordinary ears. so i guess if it really bothers a person, switching back to NS frets is the best move.

[bryanarzaga]

maki share din ako.

i'm no expert nor very experienced like some of our members here.

but i remember reading somewhere na modern luthiers daw in their building of their guitars compensate for the SS frets. sa pick ups daw ang compensation? don't ask me brothers, i'm just sharing what i read. how they compensate, i really don't know.

its the overall set up, i really dont know how one could compensate it just by pickups alone..interesting share though

and sabi nga ni Leo Fender, some people just have extra ordinary ears. so i guess if it really bothers a person, switching back to NS frets is the best move.

correct'o

[pitongjerome]

its the overall set up, i really dont know how one could compensate it just by pickups alone..interesting share though

i think if your tone becomes trebly because of the SS frets, then just get a pickup with low treble lol..

and i think the higher your action, less treble it is, plus fatter tone.. thats in my experience only..

[kebs]

Does anyone know where I can get super jumbo ss fret wires (basta yung kasinlaki ng fret wires ng Ibanez RG)? Yep, i'll consider shipping if that's the only way. TIA.

[bryanarzaga]

Does anyone know where I can get super jumbo ss fret wires (basta yung kasinlaki ng fret wires ng Ibanez RG)? Yep, i'll consider shipping if that's the only way. TIA.

super jumbo? thats not really specific..i suggest you call or inquire lmii.com(luthiers mercantile)..so they can help you..

[kebs]

super jumbo? thats not really specific..i suggest you call or inquire lmii.com(luthiers mercantile)..so they can help you..

Oh ok. Thanks for the website! It was really helpful.

I actually forgot to mention that I would most probably be considering having the frets shipped here in the Philippines. Through some research, I found out I could have some of the frets I want shipped by our fellow forumite BossingBoss (the "jumboest" ones from AllParts). But I'm still considering other options. Any other better suggestions?

[bryanarzaga]

Oh ok. Thanks for the website! It was really helpful.

I actually forgot to mention that I would most probably be considering having the frets shipped here in the Philippines. Through some research, I found out I could have some of the frets I want shipped by our fellow forumite BossingBoss (the "jumboest" ones from AllParts). But I'm still considering other options. Any other better suggestions?

stewmac, lmii, molotov bros' well, some sellers will radius your frets by request..i think your luthier can do that..

[markezekiel]

nakaka intriga naman yan SS na yan.. sayang layo kasi ng mga guitar doctors dito. hehe.taga laguna pa kasi ko.

[region III]

bry, have you tried 6100s?

[bryanarzaga]

bry, have you tried 6100s?

yes they are wider,suhr pro m models is closest to have these stock and feel wise, frankly I prefer 6105

[kebs]

stewmac, lmii, molotov bros' well, some sellers will radius your frets by request..i think your luthier can do that..

Well that's nice, but yeah, I think teh luthier can do that. Though I've settled to having the frets shipped by mr. BossingBoss, since the deadline for the orders of his next shipment is at the end of this month (I can't wait haha). Ordered them 6100-sized SS frets. Thanks for the useful infos sir Bry!

[kawayan_strat]

To all GC experts, anong masasabi nyo sa stainless steel frets?

Pros & Cons please?

I have stainless steel frets on my kawayan strat and here are the pros and cons..

Pros:

Super strong
no wear(mine's already 9 yrs old)
 
Cons:

Bright sounding(if you like it that way,then good for you)
Kawawa yung luthier mo kasi mejo matigas
Expensive(but you only have to refret your guitar once)

So far yan lang yung mga nakita kong mga issues regarding stainless frets.