How Do You Break Cymbals?

[IncX]

i've seen some branded cymbals (zildjian and sabian) getting cracks in practice studios... i asked  one owner how these things happen, he told me, it happens when a hard hitting drummer meets the cymbals when it is recoiling from the impact of the first hit. he said the average of a cymbal is 2 months, that is why he uses cheap cymbals now.

so, how else do these things happen? do cymbals really have a short life span if you play aggressive music?

how would you avoid it? aside from hitting it softer of course  (which is a VERY difficult discipline because i notice ppl's adrenaline shoot up when the guitars and bass volume are pass the 12 o clock line and you are playing metallica).

will adding a 3rd cymbal in the kit prolong the life of my cymbals? the owner's style is that he has two sets of cymblas... after band A, he replaces the cymbals for band B to practice on as to let cymbal set A rest. i think its an urban legend... but ... is this true? letting cymbals "rest." i mean, do they actually heal?! ...

i've been concerned lately cause my cousin who's also a drummer in our "family band" is learning quite fast and his hits are getting harder ... im not sure if im willing to buy a crash or a ride cymbal to replace the one he might break.

one more thing... do hi-hats crack?

-*-

incidentally,  the reason why my sticks break all the time is because my drummer tends to treat the ride cymbla like a crash cymbal... i just dont know how many sticks he will crack before the ride cymbal cracks.

[mampupunit]

it really depends on the drummer. kung talagang alaga siya sa gamet, his cymbals would last for years. may mga cymbals din kase na maganda yung tunog pag medyo naluma na. ginawa ko na yang madameng cymbals para less hits ang nakukuha ng crashes. ganun pa din. talagang depende sa drummer yan talaga. ang nitara na lang saken ngayon hats ko. 

[Gep]

it really depends on the drummer. kung talagang alaga siya sa gamet, his cymbals would last for years. may mga cymbals din kase na maganda yung tunog pag medyo naluma na. ginawa ko na yang madameng cymbals para less hits ang nakukuha ng crashes. ganun pa din. talagang depende sa drummer yan talaga. ang nitara na lang saken ngayon hats ko. 

Oo nga e, nagdadala ka pa ng sarili mong stands dati haha.

Saan mo nabili yung stand na pwedeng mag-mount ng cymbal sa both ends ng boom arm?

[IncX]

it really depends on the drummer. kung talagang alaga siya sa gamet, his cymbals would last for years. may mga cymbals din kase na maganda yung tunog pag medyo naluma na. ginawa ko na yang madameng cymbals para less hits ang nakukuha ng crashes. ganun pa din. talagang depende sa drummer yan talaga. ang nitara na lang saken ngayon hats ko. 

nice nick, bagay sa topic, hehehe...

depends sa drummer in what sense? depends sa palo nya?

kung mahina sya pumalo = years mag last ang cymbals.

hindi ba parang gitara yang cymbals na tipong it will last forever? hehehe...

...ang hirap pala kung ganun... gagastos na ako sa double peds... at maghahanda na ng budget sa cymbals... haaayyy ...

gaano katagal ang lifespan ng Sabian B8 Pro?

[Gep]

Minsan sa angulo din ng palo magkakatalo yan.

Kung 180 degrees ang hit mo sa cymbal (e.g. buong stick na ang tatama) malaki ang damage sa cymbal.

Kung medyo tabingi, hindi matatanggap ng cymbal ang buong impact ng stick.

[mampupunit]

it really depends on the drummer. kung talagang alaga siya sa gamet, his cymbals would last for years. may mga cymbals din kase na maganda yung tunog pag medyo naluma na. ginawa ko na yang madameng cymbals para less hits ang nakukuha ng crashes. ganun pa din. talagang depende sa drummer yan talaga. ang nitara na lang saken ngayon hats ko. 

Oo nga e, nagdadala ka pa ng sarili mong stands dati haha.

Saan mo nabili yung stand na pwedeng mag-mount ng cymbal sa both ends ng boom arm?

ah yun! dito ko sa states nabili yun nung una kong punta. hassle pati yung mga lugs nun bumigay na hehehe. burara din kase ako sa gamet eh.

depende sa drummer ibig kong sabihin... kung gaano ka kaconscious sa pagpalo, sa pagstock ng gamet, etc. may kilala ko talagang punas bago at after gamitin. tapos may plastic pa yung loob ng cymbal bag para walang moist haha.

mahal talaga maging tambolero. pero masarap eh dba?

[Gep]

Ako din alagang punas sa cymbals, before and after gig. Pag walang felt yung stands na paglalagyan, lalagyan ko ng sarili kong felt o improvised felt gawa sa electrical tape. Tapos naka-wrap sa pillowcase ang bawat cymbal ko, naka-cymbal soft case pa hehe.

Ano'ng brand yang stand mo? Kung ayaw mo na, ako ang mag-aayos, akin na lang! 

[mampupunit]

gibraltar siya. hahaha gusto ko pa siya hehehe sorry. nag iipon ako para i-ship yung mga natirang gamet na hindi nasira.

actually matagal ko nang tanong yan pagsira ng cymbal eh.

yung sa sabian B8 pro... naalala ko dati, madalas kame mag jam noon sa perfect pitch sm fairview. wala pa masyadong banda na nagjajam dun noon kase mahal pa... tumagal yung cymbal mga isang taon din... yung ride medyo matagal na sira... hahaha

[Gep]

Ui off-topic ha: ano'ng model ng Gibraltar yan? Baka pwede natin ipa-deliver sa JB.

Si John Bonham din, madalas makabasag ng cymbals dati. Kaya pinili niya ang 2002 e dahil yun lang ang cymbals na hindi nababasag sa kanya.

E diba, B8 lang din yun? 

Kaya siguro wala sa alloy yan.

[mampupunit]

waaah! naku po sorry nde ko na matandaan yung model! hehehe tignan mo sa website ng gibraltar mismo. meron dun alam ko yung ganung type din.

[sandico street]

may jam studio po ako, at isa ito sa malaking problema namin, kasama na rin ang mga nakakaputol ng stick.

pati hi-hats namin nagkaron ng maraming crack, minsan walang budget pamalit kaya ipapagamit pa rin namin hanggang maging China na tunog niya, at pagtagal ay mas maganda pa ang tunog ng yero.

karamihan kasi ng nagjajam sa amin ay mga baguhan kaya walang disiplina. May isa nga sa min na paglabas dumudugo yung kamay, di kasi marunong pumalo pero sobrang lakas humataw, Narda lang naman ang tinutugtog. Meron naman yung Black Metal ang banatan pero saktong-sakto lang ang treatment  ng drummer sa cymbals, kahit loud, masarap pa rin pakinggan, at hindi basta2 mapupunit yung cymbals.

[inigo]

Know your clients na lang. Pag magjajamming na ang isang banda na matino pumalo yung drummer, bigyan mo ng matinong cymbals. Kung papasok na yung pakiramdam mo magpupunit, bigyan mo ng medyo sira na. This way, mapapatagal mo buhay ng good cymbals mo, and mamamaximize mo naman ang gamit ng mga sirang cymbals mo.

Pano kung ikulob na lang ng plexi glass ang drums, para dinig na dinig na ng drummer ang sarili niya kahit na malakas ang guitars?

[jandara]

Know your clients na lang. Pag magjajamming na ang isang banda na matino pumalo yung drummer, bigyan mo ng matinong cymbals. Kung papasok na yung pakiramdam mo magpupunit, bigyan mo ng medyo sira na. This way, mapapatagal mo buhay ng good cymbals mo, and mamamaximize mo naman ang gamit ng mga sirang cymbals mo.

sa tingin ko hindi pwede yung ganito, kasi pag nalaman nung mga mampupunit na panget yung pinapagamit mong cymbals sa kanila tapos sa iba maganda, magrereklamo yun.. pareho naman silang nagbabayad tapos magka iba ng treatment.. kahit ikaw magrereklamo di ba? sa tingin ko, the best way para maiwasan yung pagkakapunit ng cymbals sa mga studio eh yung maglagay ng multa.. pag nasira nya yung cymbals, pabayaran mo.. para matakot sila at maging disiplinado sa pagpalo.. yun kasi ang mga problema sa mga kabataan ngayon, akala nila pag nakasira sila ng cymbals at nakabali ng stick, magaling na sila.. akala nila, pag malakas ka pumalo magaling ka.. at ipagyayabang pa nila na nakasira sila.. hindi nila alam, tinuturing silang salot ng mga studio owners... hindi nila naiintindihan na wala naman sa lakas ng palo yan, nasa ganda tunog na nalilikha yan..

[ortigas]

Know your clients na lang. Pag magjajamming na ang isang banda na matino pumalo yung drummer, bigyan mo ng matinong cymbals. Kung papasok na yung pakiramdam mo magpupunit, bigyan mo ng medyo sira na. This way, mapapatagal mo buhay ng good cymbals mo, and mamamaximize mo naman ang gamit ng mga sirang cymbals mo.

sa tingin ko hindi pwede yung ganito, kasi pag nalaman nung mga mampupunit na panget yung pinapagamit mong cymbals sa kanila tapos sa iba maganda, magrereklamo yun.. pareho naman silang nagbabayad tapos magka iba ng treatment.. kahit ikaw magrereklamo di ba? sa tingin ko, the best way para maiwasan yung pagkakapunit ng cymbals sa mga studio eh yung maglagay ng multa.. pag nasira nya yung cymbals, pabayaran mo.. para matakot sila at maging disiplinado sa pagpalo.. yun kasi ang mga problema sa mga kabataan ngayon, akala nila pag nakasira sila ng cymbals at nakabali ng stick, magaling na sila.. akala nila, pag malakas ka pumalo magaling ka.. at ipagyayabang pa nila na nakasira sila.. hindi nila alam, tinuturing silang salot ng mga studio owners... hindi nila naiintindihan na wala naman sa lakas ng palo yan, nasa ganda tunog na nalilikha yan..

Very well put. Tama ka bro. Practice studios should have an "If you break it, you bought it" policy. End of story. Tignan natin kung hahatawin pa rin ng todo ng mga mokong ang cymbals sa studio. Kahit mabigat naman ang kamay ng drummer, basta may technique, hindi mababasag ang cymbals and they will last a loooong time.

[jpmb]

it really depends on the drummer. kung talagang alaga siya sa gamet, his cymbals would last for years. may mga cymbals din kase na maganda yung tunog pag medyo naluma na. ginawa ko na yang madameng cymbals para less hits ang nakukuha ng crashes. ganun pa din. talagang depende sa drummer yan talaga. ang nitara na lang saken ngayon hats ko. 

nice nick, bagay sa topic, hehehe...

depends sa drummer in what sense? depends sa palo nya?

kung mahina sya pumalo = years mag last ang cymbals.

hindi ba parang gitara yang cymbals na tipong it will last forever? hehehe...

...ang hirap pala kung ganun... gagastos na ako sa double peds... at maghahanda na ng budget sa cymbals... haaayyy ...

gaano katagal ang lifespan ng Sabian B8 Pro?

heeeya there...i aint no cymbal guru but this might help...yes bro mampupunit is right..it depends also how you take care of your cymbals...another factor i think also is your cymbals set up should be based also on the genre you are playin, ive been a metal drummer most of my life thats why i prefer bigger crashes like size 18 and up...what i mean is if you play in a music manifested by distorted guitars and pounding basslines then chances are, its the bigger crashes that will cut thru with this kind of genre..always remember the bigger the cymbals the longer sustain and explosion the smaller the cymbal the faster it sustains, once a cymbal doesnt cut thru with a certain type of music, the natural reaction of a drummer is he will hit it harder, giving the cymbal a job thats he is not suited for..another thing is make sure the cymbals sway freely and its not put on the stands too tight...man i've been a user of sabian aax cymbal for so many years and im glad that ive never broken a cymbals thru my entire drumming life...check out cymbal websites man and informations there will help you a lot choosing and taking care on your cymbals...cheers

btw this are all based on my experienced as a drummer and as part of the sabian team..hope this helps you

JP Buduan
Sabian Cymbals Department
899-9804

[IncX]

it really depends on the drummer. kung talagang alaga siya sa gamet, his cymbals would last for years. may mga cymbals din kase na maganda yung tunog pag medyo naluma na. ginawa ko na yang madameng cymbals para less hits ang nakukuha ng crashes. ganun pa din. talagang depende sa drummer yan talaga. ang nitara na lang saken ngayon hats ko. 

nice nick, bagay sa topic, hehehe...

depends sa drummer in what sense? depends sa palo nya?

kung mahina sya pumalo = years mag last ang cymbals.

hindi ba parang gitara yang cymbals na tipong it will last forever? hehehe...

...ang hirap pala kung ganun... gagastos na ako sa double peds... at maghahanda na ng budget sa cymbals... haaayyy ...

gaano katagal ang lifespan ng Sabian B8 Pro?

heeeya there...i aint no cymbal guru but this might help...yes bro mampupunit is right..it depends also how you take care of your cymbals...another factor i think also is your cymbals set up should be based also on the genre you are playin, ive been a metal drummer most of my life thats why i prefer bigger crashes like size 18 and up...what i mean is if you play in a music manifested by distorted guitars and pounding basslines then chances are, its the bigger crashes that will cut thru with this kind of genre..always remember the bigger the cymbals the longer sustain and explosion the smaller the cymbal the faster it sustains, once a cymbal doesnt cut thru with a certain type of music, the natural reaction of a drummer is he will hit it harder, giving the cymbal a job thats he is not suited for..another thing is make sure the cymbals sway freely and its not put on the stands too tight...man i've been a user of sabian aax cymbal for so many years and im glad that ive never broken a cymbals thru my entire drumming life...check out cymbal websites man and informations there will help you a lot choosing and taking care on your cymbals...cheers

btw this are all based on my experienced as a drummer and as part of the sabian team..hope this helps you

JP Buduan
Sabian Cymbals Department
899-9804

thanks a lot man... i think i'll be buying bigger crashes. thanks pala for answering my phone inquiry two days ago about the pearl eliminator pedals... im looking for a friend who will get the pedals for me para ship na lang kaagad, hehehe.

[toybitz]

hitting on the same spot most of time...

hitting hard everytime...

almost a ninety degree angle at point of impact between stick and cymbal edge...

no matter how thick your cymbal is, if you're a hard hitter who hits at an exteme angle..chances are you're killing your or somebody else's cymbal much faster.

i don't understand why most bands are playing their instruments at an outdoor level when they're inside a close, acoustic treated and soundproofed room.   

Kawawa din yun owner.  Sayang, kasi maganda yun mga cymbals sa Gig Studio...ngayon..dahil napunit na...low end na pinalit. 

Wawa naman mga vox natin.  It happens to them during gigs and PRACTICES.  Walang takas.

[jpmb]

my 18 aax metal crash is the one crash that survived my metal years..hahaha..im planin to partner it with an aa metal x crash size 18 also...and also the size 20 aax chinese that dom famularo did used during his clinic here survive his whipping action hahaha..(or else he would give me two..hahaha..thats our deal.. )..

[nerol1i4a]

sabian is the best..
kame ay may studio din..
di nagtagal planetz hihat at 18" na crashride ko.. kawawang studio..
buti nakakuha ko ng b8 na ride at kahit papano ng susurvive haha..
planning to have b8 crash at hihat.pang studio talaga!

[vaisteen2003]

with my experience sa drums which is 6 years lang, heheh. Ive never experience a stick much less a cymbal. with my observation, cymbals has sweet spots. Lets say you want to through a band situation with loud guitars and other instruments it does not equate that you hit the cymbal stronger to produce louder sound, instead hit the sweet spot of the cymbals. it will require a lot of time but its definitely worth it and less pain sa palm. heheh. i hold the stick loose kasi eh.

[jacobus]

cymbal life span depends on how you hit ur cymbal.. but more or less sheet bronze breaks easily rather than a cast bronze. so planetz cymbals are made of sheet so therefor it would break easier. b8 sabians are sheet din so sooner or later they will break. but if kung ang pag hit mosa cymbals parang baliw na tao sira for sure cymbals mo. pero if u hit ur cymbals in a manner na insakto then no worries.

but if u want to hit ur cymbals hard but di sisira bili ka ng high grade.. yung mahal

[drummerboy827]

Thats why proper technique is extremely impotant.....

[RazeLJoeY]

dapat ma ingat lang sa hataw...

marami kasing drummers na balahura humataw tapos nde pa correct ang pag palo...

ako kasi once naka punit na ako ng cymbals...
planet Z cya...pero may crack na rin yun a malapit na bumigay...

[harugrugrug]

mejo slant ang tama sa cymbals... para hindi direct hit ang cymbals... at mas maganda ang tunog niya compared to a direct hit na 90 degrees...
e panu naman nagkakapunit ang cymbals mula sa butas nung cymbal?
kasi wala namang metal to metal contact ung cymbal.. in between nun e ung plastic tube thing ng gibrlatar(sorry di ko alam e.. hehe) ayun.. dun naman ung tama ng maguumpisang crack.. panu nagsimula ung crack kaya?

[daemonite]

mejo slant ang tama sa cymbals... para hindi direct hit ang cymbals... at mas maganda ang tunog niya compared to a direct hit na 90 degrees...
e panu naman nagkakapunit ang cymbals mula sa butas nung cymbal?
kasi wala namang metal to metal contact ung cymbal.. in between nun e ung plastic tube thing ng gibrlatar(sorry di ko alam e.. hehe) ayun.. dun naman ung tama ng maguumpisang crack.. panu nagsimula ung crack kaya?

Observation ko lang, baka tight ang pagkaka-screw dun sa cymbals kasi tutal may rubber tubing naman tulad ng sabi mo. Like my knucklehead drummer dati. Alam naman na nya na may hairline crack na yung 20" Oriental China Trash nya na binili nya kay Jun-Jun Regalado, mahigpit pa rin ang  pagkakascrew nya. ayun lumaki lalo....