SD-1 to TS808 mod

[XFree]

any one who has done this mod? any reviews pls...planning to have mine moded

[BAMF]

First off, the 808 wears a different chip, so it's not *just* a three-component change

You'll get a fatter tone (there is one cap in the SD-1's signal path that makes it tinny-sounding) and you'll get a *tad* more gain because the two resistors you'll replace will make the output transistor work a little harder. But that tranny aint the source of distortion.

Overall...and maybe this is just me...baka ma-bitin ka pa din.

Plug: try my M-sushi mod for the SD-1 instead

[XFree]

First off, the 808 wears a different chip, so it's not *just* a three-component change

You'll get a fatter tone (there is one cap in the SD-1's signal path that makes it tinny-sounding) and you'll get a *tad* more gain because the two resistors you'll replace will make the output transistor work a little harder. But that tranny aint the source of distortion.

Overall...and maybe this is just me...baka ma-bitin ka pa din.

Plug: try my M-sushi mod for the SD-1 instead

I'm ok with the grit actually, though I want it to sound more open, i want to sound it blunt

[markv]

I'm ok with the grit actually, though I want it to sound more open, i want to sound it blunt

bro, to make it more 'open sounding' remove C6 capacitor...


Ako lang yata ang sd-1 user na gusto yung pedal as stock e hehehe.

[XFree]

bro, to make it more 'open sounding' remove C6 capacitor...


Ako lang yata ang sd-1 user na gusto yung pedal as stock e hehehe.

noted! 

[BAMF]

Kung OK ka na sa tonal features ng SD-1, replace na lang the diodes with something more open sounding. like 2 LED's and a diode (leave one diode in).

This un-compresses the pedal.

[deadlifted]

bro, to make it more 'open sounding' remove C6 capacitor...


Ako lang yata ang sd-1 user na gusto yung pedal as stock e hehehe.

uy ako din, mas gusto ko yung stock SD-1.

[XFree]

ok naman sya nung mga unang hours kong gamit, though i find it thin sounding abit shrilling to the ear after some time-i want that high pitch cut out- i want to sound it a bit blunt this time. maybe sir bamf advise on replacing c2 is the best option say 0.1uf cap is ok? what type of capacitor sir?

[BAMF]

ok naman sya nung mga unang hours kong gamit, though i find it thin sounding abit shrilly to the ear after some time-i want that high pitch cut out- i want to sound it a bit blunt this time maybe sir bamf advise on replaceing c2 is the best option say 0.1uf cap os ok?

Replace C2 with at least a 0.047 uF or if you want, as big as a 0.1 uF. To remove shrill tone, don't remove C6 and replace C4 with something bigger, experiment with 0.047, then 0.1 and to hit tubescreamer specs, 0.22 uF. Personally, 0.1 uF at C4 sounds juusst right.

[XFree]

Replace C2 with at least a 0.047 uF or if you want, as big as a 0.1 uF. To remove shrill tone, don't remove C6 and replace C4 with something bigger, experiment with 0.047, then 0.1 and to hit tubescreamer specs, 0.22 uF. Personally, 0.1 uF at C4 sounds juusst right.

option for my pref:

1.keep c6
2.for shrill tone replace c4
3.for tiny-sound tone replace c2( 0.047uf)

what type of cap should I buy sir?

nice! il keep this thread saved!

[BAMF]

option for my pref:

1.keep c6
2.for shrill tone replace c4 (0.22uf-for TS specs)
3.for tiny-sound tone replace c2( 0.047uf)

what type of cap should I buy sir?

nice! il keep this thread saved!

For audio, avoid electrolytic caps. Yeah I know...they are not available in the ranges you listed but I think there are electrolytic caps that are 0.22 uF. Don't buy electrolytics for audio.

Then, avoid ceramics for audio. Unless you want a grainy-sound (and I know some that do).

Use only film type caps. Mylar (Polyethylene film), metal film, tantalum .

This refers only to capacitors directly in the signal path (coupling) such as C2. Treble burning caps such as C4, you can use any type, but still, just go with mylar so as to make it a "modding habit".

[guitbox]

Ako lang yata ang sd-1 user na gusto yung pedal as stock e hehehe.

teka---ako ren.   
palagay ko gusto mo ren nung brit mod?   

[ubersam]

BAMF and markv gave some good pointers. And as BAMF mentioned, it will take more than three parts to turn the SD1 to a TS. Each have their own character and personally, I prefer to make improvements on an SD1 instead of trying to make it sound like a TS.

option for my pref:

1.keep c6

1. You have a few options here. One, you can install sip/dip sockets. That way, you can play with different cap values without having to solder and unsolder them. Start with no caps then work your way up from 1nf (0.001uF) up to the stock value (10nF/0.01uF). Two, you can install a SPST toggle in series with the 10nF cap so you can toggle the cap in and out of the circuit. Or, have an on-off-on SPDT toggle and have a 10nF on one side and something like a 2.2nF on the other side of the toggle, in the middle, neither one is in the circuit. Anyway, just some ideas.

2.for shrill tone replace c4 (0.22uf-for TS specs)

2. Uhm... don't do that. You'll cut out the shrill highs alright, but you'll be cutting out everything else above 72Hz. A 0.022uF (22nF) would be a better value, a 0.027uf or 0.033uf wouldn't be bad either.

3.for tiny-sound tone replace c2( 0.047uf)

3. That is a good value, you can go as high as 0.1uF (100nF).

Another area where the tinny/shrill tone can be addressed is in the tone control section itself. Change C5 (0.027uF) to a larger value: any value from 0.047uF up to 0.1uf would be o.k. I like 0.1uF because it allows you to turn up the tone control higher, up to about 3 o'clock, without getting shrill. And an additional advantage of being able to turn up the tone control is that your output level goes up as well.

what type of cap should I buy sir?

As BAMF mentioned, avoid electrolytic or ceramic caps in the audio path, polyester film would be better. I'm not sure how the resources are over there but polyester film caps are available in values from 0.001uF (1nF) up to 1uF. Polypropylene film caps are also nice but they cost more than polyester. There are polystyrene caps in the picofarad (pF) range that is a nice alternative to small ceramic caps. In some cases, I like polystyrene caps better than silver mica caps.

[XFree]

3. That is a good value, you can go as high as 0.1uF (100nF).

Another area where the tinny/shrill tone can be addressed is in the tone control section itself. Change C5 (0.027uF) to a larger value: any value from 0.047uF up to 0.1uf would be o.k. I like 0.1uF because it allows you to turn up the tone control higher, up to about 3 o'clock, without getting shrill. And an additional advantage of being able to turn up the tone control is that your output level goes up as well.

i will keep this noted!

[BAMF]

BAMF and markv gave some good pointers. And as BAMF mentioned, it will take more than three parts to turn the SD1 to a TS. Each have their own character and personally, I prefer to make improvements on an SD1 instead of trying to make it sound like a TS.

1. You have a few options here. One, you can install sip/dip sockets. That way, you can play with different cap values without having to solder and unsolder them. Start with no caps then work your way up from 1nf (0.001uF) up to the stock value (10nF/0.01uF). Two, you can install a SPST toggle in series with the 10nF cap so you can toggle the cap in and out of the circuit. Or, have an on-off-on SPDT toggle and have a 10nF on one side and something like a 2.2nF on the other side of the toggle, in the middle, neither one is in the circuit. Anyway, just some ideas.


2. Uhm... don't do that. You'll cut out the shrill highs alright, but you'll be cutting out everything else above 72Hz. A 0.022uF (22nF) would be a better value, a 0.027uf or 0.033uf wouldn't be bad either.


3. That is a good value, you can go as high as 0.1uF (100nF).

Another area where the tinny/shrill tone can be addressed is in the tone control section itself. Change C5 (0.027uF) to a larger value: any value from 0.047uF up to 0.1uf would be o.k. I like 0.1uF because it allows you to turn up the tone control higher, up to about 3 o'clock, without getting shrill. And an additional advantage of being able to turn up the tone control is that your output level goes up as well.


As BAMF mentioned, avoid electrolytic or ceramic caps in the audio path, polyester film would be better. I'm not sure how the resources are over there but polyester film caps are available in values from 0.001uF (1nF) up to 1uF. Polypropylene film caps are also nice but they cost more than polyester. There are polystyrene caps in the picofarad (pF) range that is a nice alternative to small ceramic caps. In some cases, I like polystyrene caps better than silver mica caps.

I looked at the schematic of a TS9 again...the shunt capacitor after the first stage of the op-amp is really 0.22 uF, ditto with the TS7 (normal channel) and TS5. It's the equivalent of C4 @ .018uF stock, so I'm quite certain that replacing C4 with 0.22 uF will make it approach TS specs. I don't like it either, I usually replace that 0.22 uF on a TS with 0.1 which sounds so much better and yet sufficiently fat to my ears. Changing the RC filters in the feedback loop also helps raise treble to overcome the big shunting cap.

[ubersam]

I looked at the schematic of a TS9 again...the shunt capacitor after the first stage of the op-amp is really 0.22 uF, ditto with the TS7 (normal channel) and TS5. It's the equivalent of C4 @ .018uF stock, so I'm quite certain that replacing C4 with 0.22 uF will make it approach TS specs.

Correct, it is 0.22uF in the TS, but don't overlook the preceding resistor, the one inline with the output of the first opamp stage. It is 1K in the TS whereas it is 10K in the SD1. In the TS, the RC pair would be 1K & 0.22uF, setting the low pass roll-off point at 723.8 Hz. In the SD1 the RC pair is 10K & 0.018uF, setting the roll-off at 884.6Hz (one of the reasons the SD1 can be shrill). If you change C4 in the SD1 from 0.018uF to 0.22uF (same value as in the TS), the roll-off point of the RC low-pass filter becomes 72.38 Hz, way lower than the roll-off of the TS. So, to capture the same roll-off point in the SD1, C4 needs to be changed to 0.022uF.

...I don't like it either, I usually replace that 0.22 uF on a TS with 0.1 which sounds so much better and yet sufficiently fat to my ears. Changing the RC filters in the feedback loop also helps raise treble to overcome the big shunting cap.

I don't like the 0.22uF either but I go in the other direction with a 0.27uF.

[BAMF]

Great input sam. So maybe that explains why I never liked the .22 uF in an SD-1, it results in an over-muddy pedal. Anyway, like I said, I use 0.1 in that position and that's just right for me.

O Xfree...change R7 to 1k also if you're going 0.22 uF

[XFree]

Great input sam. So maybe that explains why I never liked the .22 uF in an SD-1, it results in an over-muddy pedal. Anyway, like I said, I use 0.1 in that position and that's just right for me.

O Xfree...change R7 to 1k also if you're going 0.22 uF

noted

[XFree]

@ubersam

If you change C4 in the SD1 from 0.018uF to 0.22uF (same value as in the TS), the roll-off point of the RC low-pass filter becomes 72.38 Hz, way lower than the roll-off of the TS. So, to capture the same roll-off point in the SD1, C4 needs to be changed to 0.022uF

c4 change to 0.022uF (0.22nF)

or

thru the tone op-amp by changing

c5 change to 0.1uF

do you have any idea what this will do to the sound?
makuha kaya nito ang tone, the thickness of the mid freq gaya ng TS?

which is better to change between the 2? c4 or c5?

[ubersam]

I do both. Let me explain a bit.

First, stock R7 (10K) & C4 (0.018uF) forms a low-pass filter with a roll-off point at 884.6 Hz. This means that at the signal is attenuated by -3dbs @ 884.6 Hz and -20dbs @ 8.846 KHz. Too high for me.

Second, the tone control bleeds treble to ground from 12.54 KHz through the C5 (0.027uF) & R8 (470 ohms) RC filter. How much is bled to ground is determined by the tone pot. 12.54 KHz is also too high for me.

If you replace C4 with a 0.022uF (BTW, that is 22nF, not 0.22nF), the roll-off then becomes 723.8 Hz, just like in the TS. So, it will be -3dbs @ 723.8 Hz and -20dbs @ 7.238 KHz. Much manageable, IMO.

Then, if you change C5 to 0.1uF (100nF), the tone control will be pulling treble to ground from 3.39 KHz, giving you a better range of treble control.

So, that is why I do both.

[XFree]

I do both. Let me explain a bit.

First, stock R7 (10K) & C4 (0.018uF) forms a low-pass filter with a roll-off point at 884.6 Hz. This means that at the signal is attenuated by -3dbs @ 884.6 Hz and -20dbs @ 8.846 KHz. Too high for me.

Second, the tone control bleeds treble to ground from 12.54 KHz through the C5 (0.027uF) & R8 (470 ohms) RC filter. How much is bled to ground is determined by the tone pot. 12.54 KHz is also too high for me.

If you replace C4 with a 0.022uF (BTW, that is 22nF, not 0.22nF), the roll-off then becomes 723.8 Hz, just like in the TS. So, it will be -3dbs @ 723.8 Hz and -20dbs @ 7.238 KHz. Much manageable, IMO.

Then, if you change C5 to 0.1uF (100nF), the tone control will be pulling treble to ground from 3.39 KHz, giving you a better range of treble control.

So, that is why I do both.

therefore
for opamp 2 stage
c4=0.022uf
I PREFER 0.022uf (than 0.22uf+ R7=1k ohm kung ito, diba)para di nako magpalit ng resistor, ryt?

for tone
c5=0.1uf

tama po ba analysis ko sir uber?

[XFree]

i've done c4 and c5 mod now and the mids are ok now no shrill tones

for the tiny sound...

Replace C2 with at least a 0.047 uF or if you want, as big as a 0.1 uF

si uber and sir Bamf ano po ba ang stock c2 capacitance rating ng sd-1 and ano po yung sa TS808/ts9/ts5?..you mentioned replace it with 0.047uf metalfilm cap for the direct signal path, i am going to replace c2 next to mod-off the tiny sounding- but no metalfilm type capacitor sa alexan, i only bought ceramic-papangit ba ang tunog sa ceramic?saan kaya makaka bili?

[ubersam]

therefore
for opamp 2 stage
c4=0.022uf
I PREFER 0.022uf (than 0.22uf+ R7=1k ohm kung ito, diba)para di nako magpalit ng resistor, ryt?

for tone
c5=0.1uf

tama po ba analysis ko sir uber?

Tama.

[ubersam]

i've done c4 and c5 mod now and the mids are ok now no shrill tones-i used ceramic cap

si uber and sir Bamf ano po ba ang stock c2 capacitance rating ng sd-1 and ano po yung sa TS808/ts9/ts5?..you mentioned replace it with 0.047uf metalfilm cap for the direct signal path, i am going to replace c2 next to mod-off the tiny sounding- but no metalfilm type capacitor sa alexan, i only bought ceramic-papangit ba ang tunog sa ceramic?saan kaya makaka bili?

Stock value of SD1's C2 is 0.018uF (film), the equivalent TS9/808 cap is 1uF (N/P electrolytic). But I would like to draw your attention to the biasing resistor right after C2. This is important to consider because it forms a high-pass filter with C2. In the SD1, R4 is 100K. The equivalent resistor in the TS is 10K. So, with the stock C2 & R4 values in the SD1, the high-pass filter roll-off point is 88.5Hz, the equivalent in the TS is 15.9 Hz. Frequencies below the high-pass roll-off point is progressively blocked. (Note: 88.5 Hz is about 6 Hz higher than the fundamental frequencies of the open low E string on guitar.)

To make a long story short, changing C2 in the SD1 to 0.047uF will lower the high-pass roll-off point to 33.9 Hz. Not as low as the TS but low enough to pass the even fundamental frequency of an open E string of a bass guitar! But, there is another high-pass filter in the first opamp stage that somewhat negates the effect of the previous RC filter (C2 & R4). The RC filter formed by R6 (4.7K) & C3 (0.047uF) limits the gain & clipping to frequencies from 720 Hz and above. Frequencies below that receive less gain and clipping. So, even if the C2 & R4 lest more bass through, R6 & C3 blocks the bass from 720 Hz down.

The give the SD1 circuit the full bass treatment, change C2 to 0.047uf (up to 0.1uF is fine). Then, change C3 to a larger value: 0.068uF (my preference), 0.082uF, or 0.1uF (could be too bassy). The larger the cap, the more bass.

No metal film caps? Ask for polyester film caps; or, caps that look like brown, green, orange, or blue 'chicklets'; or, caps in tiny yellow or red plastic boxes. Ceramic caps can sound 'gritty' but not in a good way. For C2, avoid ceramic as much as possible, for C3 you might be able to get away with using ceramic.

[jmorrero]

i'll mod it for free.. bayaran mo lang yung parts.