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Author Topic: Groovy  (Read 3714 times)

Offline toybitz

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Groovy
« on: February 23, 2006, 11:51:11 PM »
When I listen and watch a drummer.  I judge the drummer by his "feel".  Unless, the drummer is doing a drum solo.

I notice here in our country, overplaying is almost always welcome to the average listener.  It has become their way of telling if the drummer is good.  Getting busy, playing over the top,...etc.   Like a guitar player once said, its always the song that's remembered more than what we guitar players do.  And I like to keep my drumming in the same perspective.  Vocal and song oriented.

When I play, I'm always hard on myself.  Always evaluating after the set if I helped the songs feel good and tight.  It don't matter to me if people noticed my moves, I'm more concerned if they're dancing, tapping or singing along with the band.  I learned to play the way I play in church.  Where a simple "bragging" costs a lot of distraction to the people praising and worshipping God.


That's just me.

Bitoy
Tele bought 20K. Upgraded pots.  FS: 30K  Trade Value BS: 85K.  Deal tayo?

Offline toybitz

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2007, 03:44:19 PM »
i realised i looked like a goof during all those days bouncin on the throne like a crazy monkey on a holiday in banana land. how embarrassing. they had a good laugh before saying "congratulations" i made it to the 'next level' of drum lessons which is adjusting my exaggerated groove! i wanted to kill those bastards right then and there but i had to see through their intentions while they were laughin their asses off.

hahaha! natawa ako dito Bro Jun, I can imagine you in your Bat mask and muscular pyshique pounding on 'em!

seriously naman...

have you seen Vinnie's "dance" while drumming? dude, natawa din ako (don't hurt me please...), he's like moving forward and backward on his throne...like, you know...mating.

and one time, my girlfriend was laughing at me too after a gig for "dancing" while playing and I never cared. I don't even remember how I danced.  so you shouldn't care too. we are not alone.


more recently, in drummer live 2007, i had a chance to sit down and have a chat with gerald heyward, kapal muks na pinakita ko some of my old drummin vids and pics in my player. after viewen em, he also said i have "too much wood" that i forgot to spend some time to sort out my feel and groove.  dance if i have to (ayun confirmed, dance nga!), and develop my creativity within those 3 gears alone. man, i have to say, i am loving the 'less is more' drumming principle coupled with the drum groove lessons i had from my buds here. im gona scale down my setup and focus on pocket drummin for the mean time since i am enjoyin it more these days. i guess it pays to be open minded rin and be willing accept criticisms to build upon. oh and im not sayin im a good drummer na ha, its an ongoing process, thanks to my drumming buds rin here in pinoydrums. i dont know where i would be in the drummin world without this pinoydrummin community to share my frustrated passion with, sniff 2x.

pareho tayo Bro.  ako naman, instead of asking drummers...I ask the audience, and the congregation (kun sa church) how well I did.  Mas natatakot ako magtanong sa church.  Kasi, if they praise me, I'm bothered whether I entertained them or I looked good playing.  So I follow up with the question, "why?"  If they reply "sakto lang yun ginagawa mo", ayun..I sigh.  It means for me, I did well.

But its still a struggle because I'm after that fine line, that border na I'm making music and I'm satisfied with how I MAKE music.  Which means, I get that itch to be creative, to put a note here, or there, or not all...or the amount of notes I put in a bar, how I can make this fill interesting.  That's what I find very hard too, yun self gratification.  It boils to being happy and making people happy at the same time.  Its endless.

"just like what he told the audience that day, he suggested that i start all over again with a kick-hat-snare setup and establish my genre's groove...get the feel of the groove,"

I forgot who said that "you can do so much with only a snare, a bass drum, and a pair of hats..."

I personally believe in this.  Creativity is barely tapped nowadays.  But don't get me wrong, I don't dismiss the use of toms and splashes,...etc.  Its just you can propel a song with the basics and spice em to your taste with the excesses.

don't apologize for the long reply Bro, I enjoyed every word of it.

PS
Grabe, may sumagot pa sa thread ko before the year ends! hahaha!

thanks Jun!
Tele bought 20K. Upgraded pots.  FS: 30K  Trade Value BS: 85K.  Deal tayo?

Offline cs_mapper

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2007, 04:09:42 PM »
i agree to all of that.

heto lang pansin ko.....

pag bata pa ang drummer nakow whipper snapper pa yan kung may talent
naman tlga at seryoso tlga sa pagtambol nya.

tapos pag tumatanda na ayun nagiging mature na sa taste nya sa drum kahit konting fills etc maasya na sya. he is playing more with the band
than playing off tha band. di na nya pinapangarap makatugtog
ng mga dream theater or chick corea na pyesa basta kung ano gusto ng
mga kabanda at ano maganda para sa kanta yun ang gagawin nya.

kung baga in my own experience it takes time and lots of time for a drummer to learn the art of playing a groove that he really feels good about thus making the band sounds good over all.

« Last Edit: November 01, 2007, 04:11:38 PM by cs_mapper »

Offline bangbus

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2007, 05:19:27 PM »
shucks, any way i can recover my long post? my little cousin here is really wreckin havoc and managed to delete that post, emails, whatever was on my desktop, gone. i know now imagine how much of an animal i was as a kid. i spent a good amount of time composing that before hittin the lights last night.

hahaha! natawa ako dito Bro Jun, I can imagine you in your Bat mask and muscular pyshique pounding on 'em!

haha bro toybitz wala na yung batmask and im 30lbs leaner these days...i initially believed that my weightlifting bouts do not affect my playing, but upon careful scrutiny, i have to admit it did. hence since May of this year, i have not lifted a bar and focused lang on cardio. and coz of this, i feel lighter, looser, and faster.

I forgot who said that "you can do so much with only a snare, a bass drum, and a pair of hats..."

I personally believe in this.  Creativity is barely tapped nowadays.  But don't get me wrong, I don't dismiss the use of toms and splashes,...etc.  Its just you can propel a song with the basics and spice em to your taste with the excesses.

there you go. yeah and i really enjoy just pocket drummin these days, just closing the eyes developing the vibe and feeling the groove instead of focusing on hitting all those fill notes spot on and spending too much time on the technical side. yep i still love all those technical drummin bits but im puttin it aside first coz i overlooked groovin and now im just enjoyin this back to basics regime.

i agree to all of that.

heto lang pansin ko.....

pag bata pa ang drummer nakow whipper snapper pa yan kung may talent
naman tlga at seryoso tlga sa pagtambol nya.

tapos pag tumatanda na ayun nagiging mature na sa taste nya sa drum kahit konting fills etc maasya na sya. he is playing more with the band
than playing off tha band. di na nya pinapangarap makatugtog
ng mga dream theater or chick corea na pyesa basta kung ano gusto ng
mga kabanda at ano maganda para sa kanta yun ang gagawin nya.

kung baga in my own experience it takes time and lots of time for a drummer to learn the art of playing a groove that he really feels good about thus making the band sounds good over all.

yep well said, i guess tumatanda na nga ako at last, late bloomer talga ako in most aspects in life. well i guess its better late than never for me, if i could go back in time, i would knock my head and tell myself to make a pass on the fills and focus on feel first. and im not sure ha, but i observed (probably generally) that chicks dig sensual/groovy/emotive drummin more than the "crazy fill/solo" drumming. i know its musically irrelevant but its just a personal observation i wana share rin. recently ive been trading spots with a drummer bud of mine in his rnb band and im gettin a lot of good responses from some people from the audience din after the gig, mostly within the lines of "i love that expression you did on..." i initially thought they were being sarcastic (knowin brits, you gotta 'read between the lines' most of the time with what they say), but the band said finally im gettin my feel and groove sorted. sana nga. but bottomline is im having fun and enjoyin pocket drummin more.

 :-)
« Last Edit: November 01, 2007, 05:26:37 PM by bangbus »

Offline cs_mapper

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2007, 12:57:32 PM »
again totally agree on that.

chicks will dig you more if you can make their booty shake ika nga hehe.
kasi malay nila mga polyrhythmns or mga backward beat displacements lol!
now if you can mix both techincal and groovy stuff that would be really great
as well and that would be bands like TOTO, TOWER of Power, etc.
Groovy pero kung di mo covered yung technical stuff na kailangan para dito hirap
i-groove mga to imo. KAhit mga kanta ng THe Cure or THe beatles kung
ala yung little bitty swinging feel hehe di tlga mag-gru-groove yung
beat imo ulit haha!

Like for example Rosanna hehe. Persoanlly I'm still working on this
on and off now
check out those kids at youtube trying to play this beat at
mapapansin mo na may kulang pa tlga. Mostly my technical
problem pa sila lalu na yung pag swing ng right hand nila hehe.
Stiff approach most of the time as far as i can tell hehe dahil
ang hirap tlga naman kasi ng half-time shuffle beat na to.


Offline toybitz

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2007, 01:45:09 AM »
I like the complexity yet groovy drumming of Vinnie in Sting albums...

yun mga odd time...grabe creativity ni VC....

check out I Hung My Head or Hung My Head ( :?) from Mercury Rising.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2007, 01:51:22 AM by toybitz »
Tele bought 20K. Upgraded pots.  FS: 30K  Trade Value BS: 85K.  Deal tayo?

Offline mampupunit

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2007, 09:50:44 AM »
d rin naten masisisi ang ibang tao. sa kanila kase ang magaleng lang eh yung laging mas mabilis at mas technical. minsan over looked yung pagiging "groovy". d naman kelangan maging sobrang bilis o sobrang technical para maging groovy eh dba?


magandang idea nga yun ah. snare, hat, kick. susubukan ko yan.
pumikit ka na lang nang hindi mo maramdaman...

Offline daemonite

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2007, 10:52:35 AM »
Sarap ng video ni Bernard Purdie sa youtube, may kasamang entertainment.

Groove drumming is often taken for granted lalo na ng mga technical drummers, kasi they don't feel the beat anymore but just compresses every possible rudiment they can put into a beat.

Just an opinion....

Hindi porke mabilis ka, magaling ka na....
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Offline cs_mapper

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2007, 08:03:43 PM »
totally agree on that mga serz.

minsan yung hehe karibal ko dito sa amin nung panahon namin eh
lol natyempuhan kong nageensayo ata sa kanilang church. so
napasubo ako pumasok at manood sa ensayo nya. naglagay na sya
as in puro double peds single strokes hehe.
nung napagod na ayun ako naman daw. hehe ginawa ko imbes na pagurin
ko din sarili ko eh ayun tinugtog ko lang yung rosanna beat hahaha!!!
medyo parang namutla sya hanggang sa sabihin nya na wow
kuhang kuha ko n daw yung beat hehe sabi nya.
eh sabi ko na lang... lalagayan din sana kita ng mga double peds
kaso ala ako dalang extra shirt in case pawisan ako ng todo...pabirong
sinabi ko. bandang huli eh tinuruan ko pa pano nya makuha yung buung beat
nakalibre pa sya ng drum lesson tuloy haha!

bottom line atleast for me - kahit nagsipag blast beats pa mga drummers sa
kanto tapatan mo lang sila ng matinding groove nakow taob mga yan hehe.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2007, 08:09:45 PM by cs_mapper »

Offline jeff_proX40

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2007, 03:51:14 AM »
A good groove and a nice crisp fill can make the fastest hand drumming drool on you. Believe me. I've seen fast drummer drool on groove drumming people. Why? Because Cool, Groovy beats are catchy and alot more easy to appreciate but it doesnt necessarily mean that the style is easy to do. it's even more complicated that doing fast and hard styles.
Just let your music fill the empty spaces in you. It's all you have so take advantage of it. It's a gift!

Offline sonnaqs

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2007, 05:09:19 AM »

hands down mga tsong!!
i was guilty of agaw-eksena drum rolls fills na turns out wala na sa hulog ang tugtugan, well lahat naman cguro dumaan dun sa get some attention part  :lol: lalu na nung nagsisimula palang.

and as we go mature on playing, loving more the music and the groovy thing ika nga, mas sumasarap tumugtog, na mas masya na marinig mo na solid tugtugan, maganda ang bagsakan, at --malinis--.  :lol:

also realized this when i started plotting drum patterns and fills on our original songs,, yeah astig ung mabilis na rolls at explosive na patterns,, but it ddint feel right. ^_^
"never let the music die down!!"
\m/ ^__^ \m/

Offline jeff_proX40

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2007, 07:56:03 AM »
hands down mga tsong!!
i was guilty of agaw-eksena drum rolls fills na turns out wala na sa hulog ang tugtugan, well lahat naman cguro dumaan dun sa get some attention part  :lol: lalu na nung nagsisimula palang.

and as we go mature on playing, loving more the music and the groovy thing ika nga, mas sumasarap tumugtog, na mas masya na marinig mo na solid tugtugan, maganda ang bagsakan, at --malinis--.  :lol:

also realized this when i started plotting drum patterns and fills on our original songs,, yeah astig ung mabilis na rolls at explosive na patterns,, but it ddint feel right. ^_^

Yeah +1 for you
Just let your music fill the empty spaces in you. It's all you have so take advantage of it. It's a gift!

Offline toybitz

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2007, 04:43:58 PM »
drummers seem to forget na...may kumakanta pala! like I used to!  hahaha!

nagiging fusion ang drumming ko for all genres eh.
Tele bought 20K. Upgraded pots.  FS: 30K  Trade Value BS: 85K.  Deal tayo?

Offline waterfallbubinga

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2007, 10:29:38 PM »
Quote from: from: bangbus on November 01, 2007, 08:03:50 AM
i realised i looked like a goof during all those days bouncin on the throne like a crazy monkey on a holiday in banana land. how embarrassing. they had a good laugh before saying "congratulations" i made it to the 'next level' of drum lessons which is adjusting my exaggerated groove! i wanted to kill those bastards right then and there but i had to see through their intentions while they were laughin their asses off.

haha ngayon ko lang nabasa 'to...Na witness ko yan! kidding aside, magaling sumayaw yan si bangbus sa mga gimikan (gusto niyo video evidence?) and sabi namin sa kanya iadapt niya yung dance groove niya sa pagdrums niya, ayun nakuha rin! ang negative side ay hindi na siya rakista ngayon puro hiphop na gusto. bilang isang katambay sa pagdrums ni bangbus, nagbigay kami ng mga advice kasi humingi siya and napansin namin na mashado niya iniisip ang pagperfect ng execution pero wala yung feeling, sobrang nagconcentrate na di magkamali. oo buo nga yung execution kaso ang tanong ay naenjoy mo ba or pinakakita mo lang na kaya mo perfekin? pareng jun cencya na ha inexample ko lang pero cured ka na ngayon kaya wag ka magalala past is past haha.

Grooving is not just dancing or moving to the beat. it's the feeling talaga that drives each beat. how much feeling kailangan, yun din tanong mo sa sarili mo. kailangan galing sa puso and nagenjoy ka talaga, otherwise hindi grooving. hindi ako magaling na drummer tulad niyo ha pero para sakin oo pwede ka maging pinakamabilis at may pinakatechnical at kumplikadong fill na pasok pa rin sa beat, pero to groove while doing so is another story.  :wink:
aut viam inveniam aut faciam

Offline lil.drummerboy

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2007, 06:12:27 AM »
nice thread :) nag enjoy din ako basahin mga post nyo :) agree din ako sa inyo. mahilig kasi ako sa metal. kaya ako naman trying hard maging metal drummer. yung puro blast beat at fills. pero napansin ko na nakaka sawa din pala. lalo na pag hindi mo naman ma gawa ng malinis diba..hehe.
naalala ko tuloy yung sinabi sakin ng unang unang nag turo sakin ng drums kahit basic lang sabi nya  " yung groove ang importante kasi yun ang nagdadala sa buong kanta.. pag nawala ka sa groove mo wala na yung kanta. sira na.. pag nagkamali ka sa fills ok lang basta pag first count mo pasok ka ulit sa groove mo walang problema"
ang pinagtataka ko lang kasi lalo na pag yung wala alam sa drums. bakit yung mga nagwawala lagi ang sinsasbi nila na. galing pumalo nun ah. oi ang bilis nun ang galing.. mga ganun.. pero pag yung mga simple  pumalo at puro groove parang hindi pinapansin. di nila ma feel yung groove. sinasabi pa nila minsan. ay di magaling.. bagal eh.. T@nga pala sila eh. heheh.

Offline cavsdieagram

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2007, 10:29:58 AM »
There's a saying "Kung ano lang ung kylangan ng kanta, un ang ibigay mo" meaning not all the time dapat hyper ka...hehe alam nyo na un, kaya maraming nauunderestimate na drummers eh!!!Tsk, :x
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Offline daemonite

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #16 on: November 21, 2007, 12:40:25 PM »
What if, pano sa case ko na pop / r&b kami, and hindi masyado focused sa drums ang song, tapos basic tug-pak tug-tug-pak pa madalas ang beat nya. mas masarap kung may mga ghosts and fills sya diba?
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Offline lil.drummerboy

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2007, 05:16:43 PM »
oo paran nga daw may palaman sabi ni sir kibohead :lol:

Offline gelodrummer

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Re: Groovy
« Reply #18 on: November 21, 2007, 09:13:14 PM »
nice thread...

for me, i agree na sa pagpalo, groove is the most important.
it's also important to learn techniques and apply some rudiments pero hindi nman sa lahat ng bars ng kanta... tsk tsk tsk!
sakin, mas masarap pakinggan ung mga nakakagulat na licks pag minsanan lang... ung tipong all of a sudden e mapapatingin ka sa drummer (just like what Aaron Spears do --Usher). and one thing more, make sure na ung ilalagay mong fills ay napractice and mape-perfect mo. kakahiya lang kc pag nawala ka...
mga drummers, tayo ang didikitan sa tugtugan kaya tayo ang nagdadala non. pag tayo ang nawala... sorry! hehehe

so let's all GROOVE!

pahabol pa, sa mga nangangati talaga ang kamay sa mga techniques na gusto ilagay, my panahon for that. maglagay kau ng part sa set na solohan nman, just like wat we are doing. un saka mo ilabas yang tinatago mo... hehehe!

peace!