Pieces of gear that everyone seems to like, except you...

[bluenote]

Ibanez Guitars -- all of them.  They ALL sound dead to me.

Thank God John Scofield, George Benson and Pat Metheney have better ears!    Haha just pulling your leg Alex hihihi couldn't resist it hehehe! 

[sonikyut]

Telecaster with rosewood fretboard 

[IncX]

If I'm a professional Guitarist, I should have at least one extra guitar every gig especially on stage. If I play guitar for a living, It worth an extras., 'm just saying

if you play guitar for a living, it usually does not mean you make a lot of money, hehehehehe

just saying.

[firemodel55]

Ever tried a J. custom Ibanez Alex?

Yup a blue Paul Gilbert at Audiophile MOA.  Sounded as dead.

[bluenote]

Yup a blue Paul Gilbert at Audiophile MOA.  Sounded as dead.

And by sounding dead you mean what? How come when Paul Gilbert plays it sounds good enough?

Did you play the guitar? 

[firemodel55]

Thank God John Scofield, George Benson and Pat Metheney have better ears!    Haha just pulling your leg Alex hihihi couldn't resist it hehehe!

Ask them if they ditched their Gibsons -- in short tanungin mo if they still have Gibsons at home -- for Ibanez.  I serisouly doubt that.  Besides, if they get paid a lot for edorsements, they can preteNd NOT to sacrifice tone.  Just my two cents. 

[firemodel55]

i believe a USA custom can deliver too

If this was true, why did they discontinue the USA custom line?  On the other hand, Jackson still continues with their USA line despite their Asian manufactured lines.  And I can tell you now that the USA line feels different than their Asian line.  Maskuha ng Jackson USA ang tamang metal/shred vibe.

[bluenote]

Ask them if they ditched their Gibsons -- in short tanungin mo if they still have Gibsons at home -- for Ibanez.  I serisouly doubt that.  Besides, if they get paid a lot for edorsements, they can preteNd NOT to sacrifice tone.  Just my two cents.

Oh come on... Scofield has been playing his Ibanez since the 70's, even before his endorsement deal.

They sound great playing these guitars don't they?

[firemodel55]

And by sounding dead you mean what? How come when Paul Gilbert plays it sounds good enough?

Did you play the guitar? 

Yes I played the guitar.  Paul Gilbert would sound much much better on a good sounding Suhr.  You have to experience an exceptional Jackson USA and an exceptional Suhr Custom to understand how far below the tone and character ranking Ibanez is.

[sonikyut]

  . . o o O O (popcorn)

[firemodel55]

Oh come on... Scofield has been playing his Ibanez since the 70's, even before his endorsement deal.

They sound great playing these guitars don't they?

Ask him if he owns a Gibson... Ask him what sounds better, his Gibson or his Ibanez...

[firemodel55]

I have tried out so many Ibanez guitars in my life ... more so than the other brands.  And I have always wished that it would be an exceptional sounding guitar because I like how Ibanez looks.  Fender USA -- on the American Standard Series -- has produced more exceptional sounding guitars than Ibanez in terms of percentage tried.  And I don't dig the looks of the American Standard Series but the exceptional ones just sound better than any Ibanez Made in Japan.

I wish and wish that Ibanez would concentrate on sound and character instead of coming up with more hardware gimmicks and colors.

[bluenote]

Ask him if he owns a Gibson... Ask him what sounds better, his Gibson or his Ibanez...

So what if he does? Why did he chose to use his Ibanez back when he didn't have an endorsement deal?

One of the most Iconic Jazz fusion pieces ever recorded.

Let's look at it from a logical point of view... Guitars are made of wood, hardware and electronics. Generally the same components to make a Gibson or an Ibanez or any other guitar except a few for that matter.

Why is it impossible for an Ibanez to sound better than a Gibson and a Gibson to sound less than an Ibanez?

[bluenote]

I have tried out so many Ibanez guitars in my life ... more so than the other brands.  And I have always wished that it would be an exceptional sounding guitar because I like how Ibanez looks.  Fender USA -- on the American Standard Series -- has produced more exceptional sounding guitars than Ibanez in terms of percentage tried.  And I don't dig the looks of the American Standard Series but the exceptional ones just sound better than any Ibanez Made in Japan.

I wish and wish that Ibanez would concentrate on sound and character instead of coming up with more hardware gimmicks and colors.

You are probably talking about just the super strat ones. I don't think this would qualify as a fair comparison as construction and set-up between the two guitars are worlds apart. These two guitars are geared towards very different styles of playing.

Don't look for a strat sound from something that isn't a strat. Do you think Steve Vai would have stuck with a strat if he didn't have an endorsement deal with Ibanez?

I've heard an original roadstar series Ibanez sound better than most of the strats I've played.

[boybangs]

I hope this is not the beginning of the end of a very good thread. 

[bluenote]

I hope this is not the beginning of the end of a very good thread. 

Don't worry Alex and I are friends. 

[firemodel55]

So what if he does? Why did he chose to use his Ibanez back when he didn't have an endorsement deal?

One of the most Iconic Jazz fusion pieces ever recorded.

Let's look at it from a logical point of view... Guitars are made of wood, hardware and electronics. Generally the same components to make a Gibson or an Ibanez or any other guitar except a few for that matter.

Why is it impossible for an Ibanez to sound better than a Gibson and a Gibson to sound less than an Ibanez?

It matters that you ask him whether he prefers his Gibson or Ibanez?  He could tour with his Ibanez because he does not want his precious sounding Gibson to be beaten up on the road or stolen.  Besides, Gibson produced the 335.  Are you now saying that Ibanez produces a better 335 than Gibson? 

From a magical point of view, not all wood, hardware and electronics are equal even if they are from the same batch.  If you think that they are all the same, then all I can say is -- without any intention to insult or put you down -- you still have way to go in determining whether a guitar has character and 'tone.'  I don't mean this in any insulting way, its just a logical conclusion.  And lots of people don't know how to choose even musicians, because its hard and I can understand that.

Its like averages....  some brands have higher averages than others and I believe with regards to the 335, gibson has a higher average and bell curve distribution than Ibanez.

[sonikyut]

I hope this is not the beginning of the end of a very good thread. 

hinde yan..maganda nga yan e..malalaman mo mga point of view nila sa gitara

[bluenote]

It matters that you ask him whether he prefers his Gibson or Ibanez?  He could tour with his Ibanez because he does not want his precious sounding Gibson to be beaten up on the road or stolen.  Besides, Gibson produced the 335.  Are you now saying that Ibanez produces a better 335 than Gibson? 

From a magical point of view, not all wood, hardware and electronics are equal even if they are from the same batch.  If you think that they are all the same, then all I can say is -- without any intention to insult or put you down -- you still have way to go in determining whether a guitar has character and 'tone.'  I don't mean this in any insulting way, its just a logical conclusion.  And lots of people don't know how to choose even musicians, because its hard and I can understand that.

Its like averages....  some brands have higher averages than others and I believe with regards to the 335, gibson has a higher average and bell curve distribution than Ibanez.

But John Scofield uses his Ibanez even on recording sessions just check out the vid I posted. I talked to John and I did ask him about that. He said the Ibanez is all that he uses, well except of course if he's looking for a strat or a tele or any other guitar type sound.

Here's a picture of John Scofield and me

Yes this is true not all wood are the same even from the same batch. It takes a good mix of everything for any guitar to sound good.

But then again what's the difference? They can't all be bad right?

The magic is the same for any guitar to sound good. Can you really tell if Paul Gilbert would sound better? He has changed guitars over the years but you can never tell that just by listening to him play. Even Frank Gambale changed from a fender to an Ibanez to a Yamaha but you can never tell that just by listening. Eric Johnson changed from his vintage strat to his new signature strat but you can never tell the difference just by listening.

[sonikyut]

The magic is the same for any guitar to sound good. Can you really tell if Paul Gilbert would sound better? He has changed guitars over the years but you can never tell that just by listening to him play. Even Frank Gambale changed from a fender to an Ibanez to a Yamaha but you can never tell that just by listening. Eric Johnson changed from his vintage strat to his new signature strat but you can never tell the difference just by listening.

same in the case of Holdsworth he changed guitars over the years from gibson sg to ibanez roadstar to carvin and Steinberger and still sound the same.

minsan mahirap din isipin kung paano ma-retain ang signature tone mo e, is it on pedals? skills? or amp? but definitely not on guitars. IMO 

[bluenote]

same in the case of Holdsworth he changed guitars over the years from gibson sg to ibanez roadstar to carvin and Steinberger and still sound the same.

minsan mahirap din isipin kung paano ma-retain ang signature tone mo e, is it on pedals? skills? or amp? but definitely not on guitars. IMO 

It's in the player bro 

[firemodel55]

You are probably talking about just the super strat ones. I don't think this would qualify as a fair comparison as construction and set-up between the two guitars are worlds apart. These two guitars are geared towards very different styles of playing.

Don't look for a strat sound from something that isn't a strat. Do you think Steve Vai would have stuck with a strat if he didn't have an endorsement deal with Ibanez?

I've heard an original roadstar series Ibanez sound better than most of the strats I've played.

There are certain guitar properties that transcend construction and set up.  I was not looking for a vintage or modern strat sound.  In fact, when I test guitars I have learnt how to isolate those properties to determine the charcter and sould of a guitar. Steve Vai might stick with a strat loaded with humbuckers.  Checkout Wayne Charvel's take on the Green Meanie available from wayneguitars.com.  I have also owned signature series Japanese made Ibanez and I can tell you the standard production in the 90s is equal to J.Craft made Ibanez today if not better.  Basically, the average quality of Ibanez has deteriorated over time not to mention sound. 

[sonikyut]

It's in the player bro 

agree.

[firemodel55]

But John Scofield uses his Ibanez even on recording sessions just check out the vid I posted. I talked to John and I did ask him about that. He said the Ibanez is all that he uses, well except of course if he's looking for a strat or a tele or any other guitar type sound.

Here's a picture of John Scofield and me

Yes this is true not all wood are the same even from the same batch. It takes a good mix of everything for any guitar to sound good.

But then again what's the difference? They can't all be bad right?

The magic is the same for any guitar to sound good. Can you really tell if Paul Gilbert would sound better? He has changed guitars over the years but you can never tell that just by listening to him play. Even Frank Gambale changed from a fender to an Ibanez to a Yamaha but you can never tell that just by listening. Eric Johnson changed from his vintage strat to his new signature strat but you can never tell the difference just by listening.

Nice pic... and I guess we have to take John Scofield for what he said.    Apparently the differences are significant enough if 99.99% of all Ibanez guitars sound bad.  For Fender, I can get it every 5%.  For Gibson USA, about 1%.  For PRS, 1%.  Suhr generally scores around 15%.  A guitar either has magic or it does not unfortunately.  Well, I can say that Paul Gilbert sounded better with his sound at FAT than at Araneta Coliseum but thats a host of factors at play.  So, if we can never tell what changed, then it goes on to say that since all of them sound the same, I can say that the Gibson 335 is better than the Ibanez version of the 335 because its made in the USA and the Gibson guys are more experienced than the Ibanez guys at making 335s because Gibson sells more 335 style guitars than Ibanez.  Its a very logical conclusion but unfortunately, magic is the final determinant.  Its so happens that the magic is so elusive for Ibanez.

Where do we listen?  Thru you tube?  Thru CDs?  Thru mp3?  Have you plugged into his whole rig to tell the difference?  Its easy to say that they all sound the same thru equipment changes, yet we never plugged into their whole rig with their guitars to determine just that -- I bet not even hear their personal A/B live with their past, present, and future guitars.

[bluenote]

Nice pic... and I guess we have to take John Scofield for what he said.    Apparently the differences are significant enough if 99.99% of all Ibanez guitars sound bad.  For Fender, I can get it every 5%.  For Gibson USA, about 1%.  For PRS, 1%.  Suhr generally scores around 15%.  A guitar either has magic or it does not unfortunately.  Well, I can say that Paul Gilbert sounded better with his sound at FAT than at Araneta Coliseum but thats a host of factors at play.  So, if we can never tell what changed, then it goes on to say that since all of them sound the same, I can say that the Gibson 335 is better than the Ibanez version of the 335 because its made in the USA and the Gibson guys are more experienced than the Ibanez guys at making 335s because Gibson sells more 335 style guitars than Ibanez.  Its a very logical conclusion but unfortunately, magic is the final determinant.  Its so happens that the magic is so elusive for Ibanez.

Where do we listen?  Thru you tube?  Thru CDs?  Thru mp3?  Have you plugged into his whole rig to tell the difference?  Its easy to say that they all sound the same thru equipment changes, yet we never plugged into their whole rig with their guitars to determine just that -- I bet not even hear their personal A/B live with their past, present, and future guitars.

There are certain guitar properties that transcend construction and set up.  I was not looking for a vintage or modern strat sound.  In fact, when I test guitars I have learnt how to isolate those properties to determine the charcter and sould of a guitar. Steve Vai might stick with a strat loaded with humbuckers.  Checkout Wayne Charvel's take on the Green Meanie available from wayneguitars.com.  I have also owned signature series Japanese made Ibanez and I can tell you the standard production in the 90s is equal to J.Craft made Ibanez today if not better.  Basically, the average quality of Ibanez has deteriorated over time not to mention sound.

But that's just the thing the difference is so little when you are just listening that it doesn't seem to be that relevant to most of us.

I agree Ibanez quality may have deteriorated over the years but I still think that the sound is still very much dependent on who's playing the instrument and that there are still some magic left for some though maybe few.
The magic as we all know is inexplicable and I don't believe that the "magic" has something to do with production quality.

Bottom line is, though to us the Ibanez sound may not be the best thing (yes including me), others may find its sound more suitable to their playing than any other guitar that sounds better in our opinion.