Author Topic: Is an original electric guitar matters than local? (Read 123862 times)

firemodel55 · « **Reply #350 on:** December 20, 2009, 11:18:22 PM »

Quote from: pitongjerome on December 20, 2009, 10:55:52 PM

i saw paul gilbert play an ibanez starter kit and he effin rocks..

anyway, ang skills pwede matakpan ang hindi kagandahang guitar, pero ang pinakamagandang guitar ay hindi matatakpan ang panget na pagtugtog.

pero mas maganda kung magaling kana, maganda pa gitara mo.

pero para sakin din, mas may maipagyayabang ang may skills, kesa puro high end gears lang, pero para sakin, masama parin manlait, whether bad playing or sucky guitar/gear.

When I first saw Paul Gilbert play at the FAT, I was wowed and he was not using a starter kit. His Concert DVDs do not show him playing a starter kit. Nor do I see him play starter kits on his instructional videos which I all have. So, that says something... starter kits suck for Paul Gilbert. In fact, I have never seen Paul Gilbert pose in any photo op with a starter kit.

Conversely, no matter how good your skills if you sound bad or you cannot be heard dahil lubog ka you can be rest assured that the audience shuts themselves out to you. In fact, they feel more relieved if you finish the set ASAP. I heard this so many times here locally that they preferred the less technical guy because he was easier on the ears kaya nga mas hindi accessible sa majority ng pinoy ang guitar music kasi masakit raw sa tenga.

Let me just quote somebody as saying: " I've only got one tip to pass on to TG readers. Don't play with your fingers; play with your ears. Don't worry about this or that technique. What matters is what it sounds like. It might be an obvious thing to say, but there are a load of guitar players out there who ignore it. If music's not about sound, then what is it about? -- Yngwie Malmsteen

Well just a case in point, there are a lot of local guys making stuff here in the forum that do NOT deliver. And I feel they deserve the lait for taking away your cash. On the other hand, I know a lot of USA manufacturers who would not sell you a dud and make money on you because they sincerely want to give you a toneful product if you ask it from them. Other than my close luthier friend, mayroon ka bang alam na local luthier na nag-tanggi ng trabaho? Sina Pete Thorn, John Suhr, at Gene Baker tinagihan nila ako a lot of times kasi hindi meet ang 'tone' requirements ko.

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #351 on:** December 20, 2009, 11:24:02 PM »

Quote from: firemodel55 on December 20, 2009, 10:50:31 PM

wala pa ako narinig na gutiar manufacturer sa buong mundo na nag CLAIM ng ganoon . Akala ko ba sa hands iyon?

if they do..whats the point of building and doing market research..but they exists to create quality instruments that do not break easily and meet the standard of quality..

the hands execute to pick the right notes and instrument with the help of the ears for the final judgement, guitars dont play themselves..

cowboi_way · « **Reply #352 on:** December 20, 2009, 11:26:41 PM »

il buy these gift cards 2000.00 sa orig na guitar, il just add 98k

pitongjerome · « **Reply #353 on:** December 21, 2009, 12:09:43 AM »

i saw it somewhere in youtube.

boogsy · « **Reply #354 on:** December 21, 2009, 12:56:08 AM »

Quote from: pitongjerome on December 20, 2009, 07:35:44 AM

local guitars are really good, incredible sustain and really good workmanship.. especially the custom ones..

pretty bold claim IMO, since you seem to be referring to local guitars in general. Not that I have anything against anything local - although I havent been "wow"-ed by any. I've seen a lot without any truss rods, you call that workmanship?

Quote from: firemodel55 on December 20, 2009, 10:50:31 PM

Tawa nga ako kay Ramon Jacinto dahil sa RJ Jam kung sunday minsan ko siya nahuling nagsasabi na its in the hands pero every sunday may bagong model siya ng electric guitar na ibinebenta. Lalo na iyung RJ Super Rocker ba iyon na get a tele, get a strat and a les paul all in one guitar -- wala pa ako narinig na gutiar manufacturer sa buong mundo na nag CLAIM ng ganoon . Akala ko ba sa hands iyon?

Saw this video of him also raving about his Les Pu, but at the same time fighting to keep it in tune. It sounded terrible, and he pretty much made a fool of himself.

boogsy · « **Reply #355 on:** December 21, 2009, 01:25:23 AM »

Ultimately, we are all just trying to make music. In any craft though, I cant think of any disadvantage in being properly equipped with well-made tools. There's no sense in trying to justify not having good equipment, as long as you can afford it. What many people dont understand is that for some people, how the tools are made is an artform in itself. You dont need much skill to appreciate that.

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #356 on:** December 21, 2009, 02:15:32 AM »

guitar with no trussrod = fail..

firemodel55 · « **Reply #357 on:** December 21, 2009, 06:34:04 AM »

Quote from: boogsy on December 21, 2009, 12:56:08 AM

pretty bold claim IMO, since you seem to be referring to local guitars in general. Not that I have anything against anything local - although I havent been "wow"-ed by any. I've seen a lot without any truss rods, you call that workmanship?

Saw this video of him also raving about his Les Pu, but at the same time fighting to keep it in tune. It sounded terrible, and he pretty much made a fool of himself.

Kita ko rin iyon... I think the Guitar Hero and Band series is doing a better job of getting a new generation of guitarists than a Les Pu. Les Pu might actually discourage beginners or worse injure them. LOL. If you look at it, the Guitar Hero series is a testimony or rather an antithesis to technique and equipment. LOL. Its all about songs I guess and playing in it or on it in the simplest way possible. Come to think of it parang karaoke siya. The danger I believe is that as time has shown that the Guitar Tube amp is slowly being replaced by Multi FX and so will multi FX be replaced by some form of future Guitar Hero that allow people to play and make music out of it. That would be sad because clubs will now seize to exist as things move to online. Already there are declining numbers of people watching live acts. In fact, there are more you tube recordings that there a gig slots in Manila. Only Piolo Pascual and his ilk are the only local acts that book large venues. I think and I believe one way is to 'fix' the sound of our guitars and that means moving back to great sounding tube amps and speaker cabinets bar none. I believe the technique thing is dead... simply because nobody commercially can book enough people to make money for any producer if they are just about technique. I believe that technique is a requisite and an EXPECTED MINIMUM but you don't need a lot of it and that at the end of the day, sound and tone is more important in a song and band context. Case in point, look at the Ibanez Artist catalog, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps. After awhile no matter how many times you twist shred picking and the harmonic minor scale, you end up sounding like one long extended remix na lubog pa dahil sa dami ng gain -- tapos 7 string pa which further mucks up the range of the guitar which is suppose to give it presence in the mix. But the artist worked so hard on it? Take any Beatles or Led Zeppiln album and I call that working hard -- rarely do they repeat themselves and yet they make great songs.

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #358 on:** December 21, 2009, 07:27:24 AM »

Case in point, look at the Suhr Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #359 on:** December 21, 2009, 07:44:24 AM »

Case in point, look at the Baker Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Fender Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Anderson Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Charvel Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Tyler Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Taylor Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

abyssinianson · « **Reply #360 on:** December 21, 2009, 07:52:52 AM »

Quote from: bryanarzaga on December 21, 2009, 07:27:24 AM

Case in point, look at the Suhr Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

i wouldn't compare Lady Gaga to anyone on the Suhr roster, it just isn't possible because it is trying to say that someone who composes commercial jingles is as creative and skilled as Beethoven. also, just because you use good gear, doesn't mean you can play and there plenty enough stellar examples of this fact.

@firemodel: the technique thing is not dead, it just seems to be dead because people don't take the d@mn time to figure out how to play properly. if some folks spent as much time learning as they did spending cash on gear, they'd be much better off. folks like Lady Gage make money because, largely, the public doesn't know jack squat and they will digest whatever is easy and visually appealing no matter what kind of drivel is packaged in a music act. Gaga is a 15 minute novelty that, at the end of the day, is just a pop sensation..nothing more. because her songs don't carry significance, she has to dress like a bloody rodeo clown to make up for the discrepancy between her music and act.

moreover, seeing live acts is not declining - at least not internationally - though it might seem like it to you because acts like Piolo Pascual (whoever he is) seem to be the only ones that appeal to the masses. i am sure the underground in manila is alive and well.

shifting the emphasis of sound and quality to amps and speaker cabs is not the whole answer. you must start with good R&D at the guitar front as well. currently, i've watched a lot of threads about local builders but see a lot of copies and not a lot (if any) of original designs and THAT needs improvement. sorry, but building some frankenstein guitar for the kid down the street is not proper R&D...get back to the drawing board and hash out some improvements on what is already out there.

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #361 on:** December 21, 2009, 08:00:34 AM »

Quote from: abyssinianson on December 21, 2009, 07:52:52 AM

i wouldn't compare Lady Gaga to anyone on the Suhr roster, it just isn't possible because it is trying to say that someone who composes commercial jingles is as creative and skilled as Beethoven. also, just because you use good gear, doesn't mean you can play and there plenty enough stellar examples of this fact.

you misquoted me abyss, its just fitting to try and compare any artist of any brand of guitar to mainstream bubble gum pop can be such an annoying thing..

i like Gibsons LP's and Joe Bonamassa, to say he sucks because he cant book as many large shows in the U.S. compared to the Jonas Brothers (who's using gibsons too), is just a pure sign of the lack of knowledge of what really goes on in the music biz nowadays..

abyssinianson · « **Reply #362 on:** December 21, 2009, 08:15:37 AM »

Quote from: bryanarzaga on December 21, 2009, 08:00:34 AM

you misquoted me abyss, its just fitting to try and compare any artist of any brand of guitar to mainstream bubble gum pop can be such an annoying thing..

i like Gibsons LP's and Joe Bonamassa, to say he sucks because he cant book as many large shows in the U.S. compared to the Jonas Brothers (who's using gibsons too), is just a pure sign of the lack of knowledge of what really goes on in the music biz nowadays..

oh, i understood where you were going with the idea, i just thought I'd add for folks to know my 2 cents on the comparison of the two.

firemodel55 · « **Reply #363 on:** December 21, 2009, 08:47:59 AM »

Quote from: bryanarzaga on December 21, 2009, 07:27:24 AM

Case in point, look at the Suhr Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Gee, probably more income than the Ibanez catalog guys. Cause they have to buy their Suhrs. LOL. I did cite the Ibanez Catalog because of the number of guys on it. But a number of these shredder guys at least the more successful ones later on graduate to Suhr from Ibanez. I have not seen a guy downgrade from a Suhr to Ibanez though. But my comment really applies to all other catalogs too and that includes Suhr.

pitongjerome · « **Reply #364 on:** December 21, 2009, 08:49:49 AM »

Quote from: boogsy on December 21, 2009, 12:56:08 AM

pretty bold claim IMO, since you seem to be referring to local guitars in general. Not that I have anything against anything local - although I havent been "wow"-ed by any. I've seen a lot without any truss rods, you call that workmanship?

ok my bad, i was referring to the custom guitars all along, i haven't played any local electric guitar, but the acoustics are good.. (not the super crappy ones)

firemodel55 · « **Reply #365 on:** December 21, 2009, 08:54:31 AM »

Quote from: bryanarzaga on December 21, 2009, 07:44:24 AM

Case in point, look at the Baker Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Fender Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Anderson Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Charvel Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Tyler Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

Case in point, look at the Taylor Artist Roster, how many of those guys have earned enough income or revenue on the level of Lady Gaga? By the way, Lady Gaga knows how to play guitar and composes her music. Hell, even Madonna uses a black Gibson Les Paul and plugged into orange amps.

I was making the point that technique is just one component and not necessarily more important than tone. I still love Mr. Big and Paul is on Ibanez right? Just read the quote of Yngwie which I posted above.

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #366 on:** December 21, 2009, 08:59:23 AM »

Quote from: firemodel55 on December 21, 2009, 08:47:59 AM

Gee, probably more income than the Ibanez catalog guys. Cause they have to buy their Suhrs. LOL. I did cite the Ibanez Catalog because of the number of guys on it. But a number of these shredder guys at least the more successful ones later on graduate to Suhr from Ibanez. I have not seen a guy downgrade from a Suhr to Ibanez though. But my comment really applies to all other catalogs too and that includes Suhr.

how about Suhr - DTM? = Tony Rambola

Suhr - Berni Rico Jr? = Xander Demos

they graduated too

pitongjerome · « **Reply #367 on:** December 21, 2009, 09:00:58 AM »

Quote from: firemodel55 on December 21, 2009, 08:54:31 AM

I was making the point that technique is just one component and not necessarily more important than tone. I still love Mr. Big and Paul is on Ibanez right? Just read the quote of Yngwie which I posted above.

both are important, probably equal. but for me, if i were to pick one, a local custom guitar with awesome guitar skills, or baker+suhr+everything exceptional gears with crappy playing, i will choose the "local custom guitar with awesome guitar skills"..

just my opinion, because you can still make good music with a local custom guitar if you have the skills, but you can't make good music if you are a crappy player with br0oTaL guitars/equips

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #368 on:** December 21, 2009, 09:08:21 AM »

Quote from: abyssinianson on December 21, 2009, 08:15:37 AM

oh, i understood where you were going with the idea, i just thought I'd add for folks to know my 2 cents on the comparison of the two.

yup cool that you made a follow up, its funny when whoever started that comparison even listens to lady gaga..goes to another apple - oranges comparison..

happy holidays to bigots..

firemodel55 · « **Reply #369 on:** December 21, 2009, 09:33:45 AM »

Quote from: bryanarzaga on December 21, 2009, 08:59:23 AM

how about Suhr - DTM? = Tony Rambola

Suhr - Berni Rico Jr? = Xander Demos

they graduated too

Unfortunately or Fortunately depending on how you look at it, plenty more Ibanez guys don't graduate. LOL. I used to love Ibanez and I had lots of them but really wala talaga laban sa Suhr specially the Modern. As much as I am trying to get back to Ibanez even today, when I pick up the prestige models and even the signatures, parang downgrade talaga compared to the Suhr. They feel rough and unrefined compared to suhr and sometimes they feel downright cheap and cheezy. Just my opinion though.

bryanarzaga · « **Reply #370 on:** December 21, 2009, 09:48:31 AM »

Quote from: firemodel55 on December 21, 2009, 09:33:45 AM

Unfortunately or Fortunately depending on how you look at it, plenty more Ibanez guys don't graduate. LOL. I used to love Ibanez and I had lots of them but really wala talaga laban sa Suhr specially the Modern. As much as I am trying to get back to Ibanez even today, when I pick up the prestige models and even the signatures, parang downgrade talaga compared to the Suhr. They feel rough and unrefined compared to suhr and sometimes they feel downright cheap and cheezy. Just my opinion though.

i only play 2 old prestige models and j.custom and usa custom and compared to the suhr pro maple top + basswood(which i will be getting soon) apples and oranges, and one was no better than the other designed with different specs and for different people, no ultimate guitar there and like i said before a standard suhr which i compared to a suhr pro, would still pick up the suhr pro without thinking twice..different caters for different people no one's better than the other..

if you pickup Signature ibanez's then its clear what you search for..especially that im really confused that.. 'Ibanez' is a brand or a specific guitar for you?

What you write is basically for every player out there..including George Benson gee guess his tone def too..this whole deal of brand x is better than brand z is what brown noses like to talk about,

original vs local...such as (Derrig vs Max Lp's ) vs Gibson..on who has the better tone..FACT that..

dakuykoy · « **Reply #371 on:** December 21, 2009, 10:12:31 AM »

Quote from: bryanarzaga on December 21, 2009, 08:00:34 AM

you misquoted me abyss, its just fitting to try and compare any artist of any brand of guitar to mainstream bubble gum pop can be such an annoying thing..

i like Gibsons LP's and Joe Bonamassa, to say he sucks because he cant book as many large shows in the U.S. compared to the Jonas Brothers (who's using gibsons too), is just a pure sign of the lack of knowledge of what really goes on in the music biz nowadays..

you're right, bry...

and by the way, Lady Gaga is just a product of commercialism; too bad that the talented Stefani Germanotta is locked up inside her.

now back to the topic:

@TS: pwede namang magkaroon ng "Original" na "Local"..

I think what he really wants to ask is "Is an imported guitar better than a local-made guitar?".. or something like that.

yung gawa nila Kuya Jon at Mang Max, local yun, pero better than some midrange level na imported guitars.

Meron ding murang Chinese guitars na mas ok compared sa mga local-made. (kasi may truss rod

)

There are choices for everyone, I guess..

killerbutete · « **Reply #372 on:** December 21, 2009, 10:16:37 AM »

Minsan "OO", minsan "HINDI DIN"......Asa gumagamit yan, pero di mo rin maiiwasang isipin na "DI PEDENG MAGING TUNOG GIBSON YUNG MGA LUMANOG".

pitongjerome · « **Reply #373 on:** December 21, 2009, 10:36:51 AM »

anyway, if local guitars are cheap and "crap", i wonder how mr bryan arzaga made his SX tele/strat (i forgot kung alin dun basta SX) sound good on his demos? but i have seen many "expensive guitars" on youtube that sounds [gooey brown stuff]

boogsy · « **Reply #374 on:** December 21, 2009, 11:23:27 AM »

Funny how this has turned out to be a healthy discussion, despite the lack of proper syntax in the thread title. hahaha.. Can't anyone fix it?

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Author Topic: Is an original electric guitar matters than local? (Read 123862 times)