Is an original electric guitar matters than local?

[riffscreamer]

Funny how this has turned out to be a healthy discussion, despite the lack of proper syntax in the thread title. hahaha.. Can't anyone fix it?

Nooooooooo. Don't fix it! This thread IS the spirit of GC. Haha.

[abyssinianson]

anyway,  if local guitars are cheap and "crap", i wonder how mr bryan arzaga made his SX tele/strat (i forgot kung alin dun basta SX) sound good on his demos? but i have seen many "expensive guitars" on youtube that sounds [gooey brown stuff]

easy. everything boils down to proper recording equipment and technique. fact of the matter is - youtube is not a proper representation of what the actual instrument sounds like and you shouldnt take it too seriously. just because a PRS is more expensive than an SX doesn't mean the fingers playing the thing can't make it sound good; if you play like cr@p you will sound like cr@p whether you are on a 100 dollar POS or a 5K dollar Suhr. remember, gear is only part of the equation - you still have to play it and know what you are doing in order to make it sound good. with this thought in mind, the line between local and imported guitars come down to three integral factors:

-quality control
-quality material
-proper luthiery technique

a word of caution, just because you say you are a luthier doesn't mean you are because the sole gauge of your work is your product, the ingenuity behind it (if there is any), the quality control you have and the dedication and integrity you put into your work. make good guitars? then you are a pretty good luthier. have a mixed bag of stuff? you need more work. a good example can be found in the high end guitar market..reason why some of them cost 5K and up for a base model, unamplified instrument is because you will get a quality instrument every single d@mn time from the luthier. the wood is graded under intense scrutiny and every step of the manufacturing process is rigorously carried out. can local guitars compete? sure - just do the exact same thing other high end builders are doing...except do it with more intensity. if you want to play the game, you have to walk the walk and talk the talk. everyone has the same wood and materials available, the only limiting factor are the ideas in your head.

[ysei]

Is a correct grammar matters than wrong?      

[bryanarzaga]

anyway,  if local guitars are cheap and "crap", i wonder how mr bryan arzaga made his SX tele/strat (i forgot kung alin dun basta SX) sound good on his demos?

youtube compressed the real sound, they are more lively in actuality but to make it that way i had to work with the instrument, out of the box they didnt really appeal well, to a regular person its 'eh nothing different' this happened to the RST when i got it, i mean big deal its $59. but im always the kind 'hmm what i can do with this bugger', didnt...its mostly the stuff in it that made it not likeable..once i got through with that it was likable, right now it needs a new nut(since the plastic one's wear down so easily),.i did a bunch of resets to the neck pocket, im fortunate enough to be provided parts from friends in arizona and jersey..

SX guitars are tinker guitars, they handle tinkering well..decent guitars for what you pay for..but the Q.C. / Q.A is not as close to the those expected to be of a higher bill,

That is why a need for quality guitars is important and you buy quality since if you dont have time to deal with things like that or educate yourself..buy an instrument that is worry free..doesnt matter who's name is on the headstock..

so if they price high..expect and do not compromise on quality..if there is something wrong with the feel take it back..make sure it gets serviced correctly.. you paid high expect to be given high and quality service in return..its never been 'hey i bought an expensive guitar from you..would you be my friend?', no its always business..friendships are only a plus to it..

[bryanarzaga]

i'd like to go OT: about this whole deal of said nationality being better than the other..its all just proper business ethics, most of the establishments i have been and also where i work practice this, balancing between risk and merit..loan officers will not accept all applications for loans, because of certain factors..similarly is guitar building..

if i was 'said' guitar builder and you lay down your requirements..if i said i dont think i can accommodate your request its not that i am being a good guy, its also i dont want to waste my time and build something that i know im not going to get paid for if you dont like it..let alone get a bad review..

how about that view? that's realistic..

[pitongjerome]

my only point is, you could make good music out of those pieces of instruments which some people call crap and wouldnt hesitate to make "lait", but crappy playing cannot be compensated buy expensive guitars/gears. 

and yeah, my stand is the same as most people's stand, that its better if you have quality gear and some mad skills.

[firemodel55]

i only play  2 old prestige models and j.custom and usa custom and compared to the suhr pro maple top + basswood(which i will be getting soon) apples and oranges, and one was no better than the other designed with different specs and for different people, no ultimate guitar there and like i said before a standard suhr which i compared to a suhr pro, would still pick up the suhr pro without thinking twice..different caters for different people no one's better than the other..

if you pickup Signature ibanez's then its clear what you search for..especially that im really confused that.. 'Ibanez' is a brand or a specific guitar for you?

What you write is basically for every player out there..including George Benson gee guess his tone def too..this whole deal of brand x is better than brand z is what brown noses like to talk about,




original vs local...such as (Derrig vs Max Lp's ) vs Gibson..on who has the better tone..FACT that..

I started buying a lot of Ibanez in the early 90s. I owned my first Ibanez an S model MIJ in 1989 which I kept for around 15 years.  I have not nor have I heard an Ibanez that rivals a great sounding Suhr in terms of richness bar none whether different specs or not.  In fact, I am the last person to look at specs because I believe a guitar is more than the sum of its parts and its specifications.  I end up upgrading lots of stuff anyway. In the same way, I would rate ESP Custom Shop Japan even better than Ibanez custom.  You can ask the Japanese guys about this in Tokyo.  ESP just does it better than Ibanez on almost every level.  When I first tried my Suhr Modern, I was one of the real early adapters.  I probably got one of the first dozen and my guitar was actually on the Suhr website when the first Moderns came out and was really skeptical about it.  Well, if you can take my word for it and a friend here in the forum, the suhr modern is what ibanez has failed to be and once you try one you get dissatisfied when you get back to your RG.  I do not think about apples and oranges anymore because they are both fruits and at the end of the day you still have six strings, a pickup and wood.  Apples and Oranges classifications are the same reason I used to previously keep a dozen signature ESPs and Ibanez when in reality only one sounded the best.  I had owned the following Ibanez Made in Japan Guitars -- all at the same time. a JEMV7WH, S540 LTD, Reb Beach Signature, PGM 300 with reverse headstock and Ibanez Iceman.  And they never felt as solid and as well made as the Suhrs and more importantly, suhr seem to sound better.

Maybe you should ask George Benson if he has an old Gibson Jazz Guitar.  You might be surprised.

By the way for info, Max was willing to sell me a guitar but a close and knowledgeable friend said that it would be better to spend on and worth the money to just buy an original 59.  

[bryanarzaga]

I started buying a lot of Ibanez in the early 90s. I owned my first Ibanez in S model MIJ in 1989 which I kept for around 15 years.  I have not nor have I heard an Ibanez that rivals a great sounding Suhr in terms of richness bar none whether different specs or not.  In fact, I am the last person to look at specs because I believe a guitar is more than the sum of its parts and its specifications.  I end up upgrading lots of stuff anyway. In the same way, I would rate ESP Custom Shop Japan even better than Ibanez custom.  You can ask the Japanese guys about this in Tokyo.  ESP just does it better than Ibanez on almost every level.  When I first tried my Suhr Modern, I was one of the real early adapters.  I probably got one of the first dozen and my guitar was actually on the Suhr website when the first Moderns came out and was really skeptical about it.  Well, if you can take my word for it and a friend here in the forum, the suhr modern is what ibanez has failed to be and once you try one you get dissatisfied when you get back to your RG.  I do not think about apples and oranges anymore because they are both fruits and at the end of the day you still have six strings, a pickup and wood.  

they still are different from everything if you say one is ultimate against the other that is your fruit to clutch between your hands, not everybody like fruits we enjoy them differently,

Apples and Oranges classifications are the same reason I used to previously keep a dozen signature ESPs and Ibanez when in reality only one sounded the best.  I had owned the following Ibanez Made in Japan Guitars -- all at the same time. a JEMV7WH, S540 LTD, Reb Beach Signature, PGM 300 with reverse headstock and Ibanez Iceman.  And they never felt as solid and as well made as the Suhrs and more importantly, suhr seem to sound better.

you dont have the USA ibbys so you cant compare them completely..and nor will you, your perception is yours..again comeback to me when you have tried a USARG30 and tell me..what you think..these were made by Bunker USA..get all information first then run yer mouth,

as posted earlier if you cared for the overall music rather than the technique..

its best to run your music than your mouth..

[abyssinianson]

Maybe you should ask George Benson if he has an old Gibson Jazz Guitar.  You might be surprised.

 

i've actually met George a few times. He has many, many guitars but his main recording and performance guitars have always been his Ibby jazz boxes. The sig guitars were designed primarily with the intention of capturing the tone from larger jazz boxes in a smaller package. I do have an earlier GB box and I can tell you that it is smaller than other jazz guitars I've come across which include various Gibsons models like the L5 etc....

I can tell you this about GB...that man's fingers will sound like GB no matter what you give him. Impeccable phrasing, chord knowledge and a nice guy to boot. Truly inspirational to watch.

[firemodel55]

they still are different from everything if you say one is ultimate against the other that is your fruit to clutch between your hands, not everybody like fruits we enjoy them differently,


you dont have the USA ibbys so you cant compare them completely..and nor will you, your perception is yours..again comeback to me when you have tried a USARG30 and tell me..what you think..these were made by Bunker USA..get all information first then run yer mouth,

as posted earlier if you cared for the overall music rather than the technique..

its best to run your music than your mouth..

Whoah... don't mean to tick you off dude.  But USA made Ibanez?  Common on now.  I don't think Ibanez was known for that.  Even the personal guitars of their endorsers are made in japan.  By the way, nasaan na pala ang Ibanez USA?  Its nowhere.  If you think having USA MADE Ibanez makes you special it does not for the plain reason that it was an attempt by Ibanez to head off what Anderson, Suhr and Grosh started in the early 90s.  I remember the ad.  You might as well just have bought a USA made Anderson.  By the way, in my previous post I have been also harsh with Anderson.    But I do acknowledge that it is your preference but you are free to compare my Suhr Modern to your USA Ibanez any time.  I'll lend it to you without strings attached.

[inigo]

Nooooooooo. Don't fix it! This thread IS the spirit of GC. Haha.

Because it's interesting, assumes a lot, sparks firemodel55's interest, promotes flaming, and has bad grammar? I agree!

[bryanarzaga]

Whoah... don't mean to tick you off dude.  But USA made Ibanez?  Common on now.  I don't think Ibanez was known for that.  Even the personal guitars of their endorsers are made in japan.  By the way, nasaan na pala ang Ibanez USA?  Its nowhere.

oh im not at all ticked off, careful sa heart LOL!! see link below..(the lack the lack the lack'a lack'a lack..)

http://www.jemsite.com/articles-menu/usa-custom-specs-usrg-rg/

If you think having USA MADE Ibanez makes you special it does not for the plain reason that it was an attempt by Ibanez to head off what Anderson, Suhr and Grosh started in the early 90s. 

nor does your preference make you anywhere near special at all, what you attempted so far is nothing that contributed to what the guitar is, nor you have established a clear linked between the brand you're trying to compare vis a vis guitar brand, early-on its best to do full circle on every guitar has been tried and tested before making a general statement..if you feel like it please enjoy..buts its all tease anyway..

But I do acknowledge that it is your preference but you are free to compare my Suhr Modern to your USA Ibanez any time.  I'll lend it to you without strings attached.

no thanks, your preference is not like mine, like i said i have sights on the one i have tested and will be planning that fits all the specs i wanted,

[firemodel55]

oh im not at all ticked off, careful sa heart LOL!! see link below..(the lack the lack the lack'a lack'a lack..)

http://www.jemsite.com/articles-menu/usa-custom-specs-usrg-rg/

(Not impressed.  In fact, if you read tonequest enough.  Some of the best sounding historics now really shine when placed at proper tension.  My problem is PBC's approach to try to be unique.  If it was so, how come there are great sounding guitars that do NOT have a tension free neck?)

nor does your preference make you anywhere near special at all, what you attempted so far is nothing that contributed to what the guitar is, nor you have established a clear linked between the brand you're trying to compare vis a vis guitar brand, early-on its best to do full circle on every guitar has been tried and tested before making a general statement..if you feel like it please enjoy..buts its all tease anyway..

(Its simple.  Just bring your guitar and compare against my guitar.  We don't need to try out all the guitars and thats why one of my suhrs was hand picked at the factory because its the suhr guys who try out all their guitars.  With regards to the Suhr I handpicked at Manny's New York, I was lucky it owned all the usa Deans, Andersons, Fender Custom Shops, Gibsons Custom Shops, PRS, etc.  After a while playing the Suhr Modern salesman even said, you are right.  There is something unique and nice sounding about this guitar.  By the way, though I preferred the metallic orange Modern-- it sounded like crap.  And the salesman agreed with my assessment of the sister guitar.)

no thanks, your preference is not like mine, like i said i have sights on the one i have tested and will be planning that fits all the specs i wanted,

(If I were you, I would buy the one you tested because one will come out to be worse than the other its a 50-50 chance)

[jamming_papu]

again, i think original electric guitar doesn't matter to local electric guitar as along as original guitar player plays original guitar (not local ha?) tone with their own original fingers. 

good guitar player no care if guitar copy not original as along guitarist like features and tone of guitar copy. 

[bryanarzaga]

like i said my response was to the details of what 'you think you know'...so you said there isnt one and the fact there is..(in existing of a usa ibby), well now at least you know and you're not forced to like it..its just the info i want to share..

i have nothing against suhrs and like i previously said why should i try your preference when i already have decide on which of his models im going to choose from, i have tested one and will stick to the spec, the only thing is to decide if im going locking trem or not and that is my decision..i got nothing against guitars you choose and 'think' highly off,...same old boring response..

dont try to educate when you yourself..do not even know..i guess with all the cerebrum missing your rational posts seems unlogical to think..

so i leave you with...make some good music, then i will listen and see what you have to say..till then..

[pitongjerome]

 i have heard local custom guitar demos in youtube/soundclick and i think they are good. the owners demo it by themselves. now i wanna hear demos from baker/suhr.. from its owner..

MAKE MUSIC... its a musical instrument.. let us hear it.. its not for bashing other instruments..
if anyone wants to prove that their guitar is the best, make some music..

[riffscreamer]

make some good music, then i will listen and see what you have to say

[inigo]

I'd rather read bad grammar than paikot-ikot at paulit-ulit at heto-nanaman-type stuff.

[pitongjerome]

I'd rather read bad grammar than paikot-ikot at paulit-ulit at heto-nanaman-type stuff.

baka parang umiikot yan sa tenga na parang ano..

[firemodel55]

baka parang umiikot yan sa tenga na parang ano..

The Baker experience is fully enjoyed first hand and in person.  But if you want a recording, as I said before listen to the current album of Bamboo.

[randymarsh]

The Baker experience is fully enjoyed first hand and in person.  But if you want a recording, as I said before listen to the current album of Bamboo.

which one is better then? your baker or your suhr?

[arkeetar]

The Baker experience is fully enjoyed first hand and in person.  But if you want a recording, as I said before listen to the current album of Bamboo.

lahat ng songs sa album? hmmm kaya pala ok na ok
...sa live, ang layo ng tone ni Ira compare sa album

[firemodel55]

like i said my response was to the details of what 'you think you know'...so you said there isnt one and the fact there is..(in existing of a usa ibby), well now at least you know and you're not forced to like it..its just the info i want to share..

(I am not discounting that there will be a good sounding USA Ibby.  But I think a good sounding Suhr will smoke a good sounding Ibby. This is something I had to accept early on because I really liked how Ibbys looked until the suhr modern.  Actually, it started when I first got a change to try ian's suhr standard.  There are several people here on this forum who have tried my suhr modern who were previous Ibby owners and I suggest you ask them yourself.  Its like comparing an italian super car versus a Japanese touring/sports car.  Though there are some happenin' kudos points for the japanese sports car, overall the italian super car wins out.)

i have nothing against suhrs and like i previously said why should i try your preference when i already have decide on which of his models im going to choose from, i have tested one and will stick to the spec, the only thing is to decide if im going locking trem or not and that is my decision..i got nothing against guitars you choose and 'think' highly off,...same old boring response..

(Because not all suhrs are good sounding. But rarely a good sounding ibanez.  Its more common to get a good sounding suhr despite it lowers production numbers than ibanez.  I am just trying to save you some disappointment in the same way I was disappointed tesing 20 Andersons and 4 suhrs.  Only to end up having to pick one.  Not because I could not buy another one and I really wanted to buy another Suhr or Anderson because it was available but they sounded dead compared to the one suhr modern that I picked. )

dont try to educate when you yourself..do not even know..i guess with all the cerebrum missing your rational posts seems unlogical to think..


(I pass on what I am told too.  It may seem that I may not know;  so just come over so I can show you what I do know in terms of equipment or tone.)


so i leave you with...make some good music, then i will listen and see what you have to say..till then..

[firemodel55]

lahat ng songs sa album? hmmm kaya pala ok na ok
...sa live, ang layo ng tone ni Ira compare sa album

3 songs on the album were made on the Baker.  The rest are on a U.S. Strat.  I will identify one song: Nobody knows (observe the lead break starting at time 3:16) -- Notice the harmonic sustain from 4:12-4:17 which was cut short with a slide.

I did not want identify the song again because its really something personal for me that I prefer to know for myself pero maraming makulit for demos.  This is just one side of the Baker#55 and it sounds better in person because thats NOT the only sound it can do. 

[pitongjerome]

3 songs on the album were made on the Baker.  The rest are on a U.S. Strat.  I will identify one song: Nobody knows (observe the lead break starting at time 3:16) -- Notice the harmonic sustain from 4:12-4:17 which was cut short with a slide.

I did not want identify the song again because its really something personal for me that I prefer to know for myself pero maraming makulit for demos.  This is just one side of the Baker#55 and it sounds better in person because thats NOT the only sound it can do. 

will listen..