All About Cables

[Agent_So]

mga sir.. i decided to create this thread para malinawan about cables.. so here it goes.. iba iba ba talaga ang cable na dapat gamitin for mics, instruments, racks, speaker? kasi im planning to buy sana yung mic cable 100meters na benta sa forerunner na stag yung brand for 2500.. plano ko sana yun na gamitin sa instruments, mic, and sa rack,, pero nung tinignan ko yung website sa audiophile klotz brand, iba iba pala ang cables.. so anu ba talaga? pwede ba na mic cable nalang or dapat use ko specific type of calbe for each category?


and by the way, suggest naman kayo ng medyo murang cable na ok ang quality and ultra-low noise. and saan narin mabibili and price.. thanks again..

[pmack]

input ko lang agent so,
yung binili ko kasi yung swan na brand ng wire sa deeco.
ok siya, tahimik. and 45-50 pesos per meter.
medyo mid-priced siya than cheap pero ayos na.
pinagawa ko na lang sa nakaka-alam yung mga wires ko (xlr's).
dun ako medyo namahalan ng konti. hehehe...

peace!

[Sound Weavers]

yup, iba-iba wires/cables for

- mics

- instruments

- speakers

- digital cables (RCA, optical)


KLOTZ is good. others available locally are

- CANARE
- BELDEN
- MONSTER available sa mga Abenson

try mo sa mga audio shops sa Park Square sa Makati

[Blueberri]

eto ang alam at ginagawa ko:

sa mics: balanced na cables...yung 2 ang wire sa loob plus ground na wire. eto medyo yung mahal na cable ang maganda kasi sensitive ang mic level sa noise.

sa instruments: unbalanced yung isa lang sa loob at ground. eto din, yung mas mahal at maganda na cable dahil sensitive din sa noise ito...

line level signals: pwedeng balanced or unbalanced, depends on your equipment. eto medyo mas mura lang gamit ko, dahil mataas naman  ang level ng signal at hindi masyado nakaka-pick-up ng noise...pero kung pwedeng yung magandang klase na rin na wire..bakit hindi..para matibay tuloy...

gamit ko kadalasan ay Quantum na cables. 60++ per meter ata yung unbalanced...70++ yung balanced mula sa isang electronic shop sa Aurora Ave. Gumagamit din ako ng Swan mula sa Deeco...ok man din sya basta maganda pag-kakakabit ng plugs. yung Canare na cable ko matagal na rin ayus pa...sa mics ko gamit yun.

[bindoy]

late ko na nga nalaman yan klotz(germany pala) e..tsk tsk...Midi cable binili ko...napabili tuloy ako ng peavey(20ft.)...kung sa bagay 1.8 meters lang offer ng klotz e(audiophile)...hehehe...mura naman..ayun kumuha din ako ng isang klotz...hehehe

[jplacson]

Klotz is German, so is Neutrik

[Tarkuz Toccata]

Neutrik is actually Liechtensteiner. Liechtenstein is a small country bordered by Switzerland to its west and Austria to its east.

[Agent_So]

regarding sa speaker cable, i used microphone cable.. yung ground ginawa kong negative, and yung dalawang red and white na sleeves pinagsama ko ginawa kong positive. ok na kaya yun? or iba parin ang gumamit ng speaker cable? is there difference in using cable with thick copper fibers than thin ones? thanks mga sir

[KitC]

is there difference in using cable with thick copper fibers than thin ones? thanks mga sir

Thicker wires are capable of carrying more current than thin ones. If you are using small gauge wires between your power amp and monitors, the line resistance in the small gauge wires may be high enough that it would cause the wires to heat up. With sufficient enough voltage, it might cause the wires to burn, or worse, melt the insulation so that the wires touch. Shorted speaker wires can blow up your power amp. That's why speaker cables are usually thick.

[smarty]

hi, got this information on the link below, hope this might help you also.

If your speakers will see 500 watts or less, use 18 or 16 gauge (AWG) wire.
If your speakers will see 500 watts or above, use 16, 14 or 12 gauge (AWG) wire.

Piezos and Voice-Coil tweeters do not use as much power since they are frequency limited. 20 or 18 gauge (AWG) wire is sufficent



http://www.colomar.com/Shavano/2x12wiring.html

[TheHunter]

I've got few cables with Amphenol 1/4 plugs. This is made in Australia. Perfect fit to my amps and mixer. I used planet wave cable for live gig. I like the compression spring for really tight fit... no noise

[Tarkuz Toccata]

regarding sa speaker cable, i used microphone cable.. yung ground ginawa kong negative, and yung dalawang red and white na sleeves pinagsama ko ginawa kong positive. ok na kaya yun? or iba parin ang gumamit ng speaker cable? is there difference in using cable with thick copper fibers than thin ones? thanks mga sir

masama yan! dapat speaker cable ang gamitin mo. tama si kitc.

pwede ko i-compute ang correct wire gauge ng speaker cable para sa sound system mo.

ilan ohms ng speaker?
ano ang haba ng speaker cable na kailangan mo?
ilan watts ang power amp sa impedance (ohms) ng speaker?

[hyper0822]

sa raon madaming class of cables bumili yong tropa ko ang daming klase may mga xlr pa, stereo, rca at mono pati mga converters medyo nakakalito yan

[dequi09]

Naku ingat sa pagbili sa Raon, dami nagkalat na fake Neutrik Speakon, nakabili ako minsan ayun sira agad.. Yung Swan Cable hindi din matibay, madali matunaw insulators kapag nag hihinang.. Yung Quantum, ok sana kaso ang tigas, pumupulupot yung internal conductors.. The best pa din ang Canare cables combined with Neutrik connectors, 10 years na yung mga gamit ko, wala pa din nasisira.. Cables and connectors should also be considered as a major investment, some of the "minor problems" ay nagiging complicated dahil lang sa cables.

[Direk]

   about cables kapatid...here's my pitch.Most expensive cables aren't always the best.The word is ,right choice of cables(for mic,loudspeakers,guitars,amp-speaker interface,etc)can bring out the best performance from your system.Conversely,poor cables-or those not suited to your system(calling Agent So...mic cable become speaker cable)-will never let your system achieve its full musical potential.
   my experience suggest that the only way to determine the best cable for your system is to experiment and LISTEN.In some cases,the best results will be achieved with all the cables made by the same manufacturer.In others,a mix of different cables will work best.Starting from scratch,,selecting cables is more difficult.Because different combination of cables will produce different results,the possibilities are endless since you dont have the baseline reference againts which to judge how good or bad a cable is.The best way is your dealer's advice.Try the cables he suggest,along with two other brands or models,along with your do-it-yourself cables for comparison.
    why so picky with cables?Ideally,every component in the system-including cables-should be absolutely neutral and impose no sonic signature on the music.Selecting cables for their musical compatibility should be viewed as the final touch to your system.Lastly,good cables merely allows the system to perform at their highest level; they wont' make a poor system or bad component match sound good.Remember,a cable can't actually effect an absolute improvement in the sound;the good ones merely do less harm.


Direk

[KitC]

Direk,

Medyo rusty ang EE ko, pero I know that overly long cables can have a capacitive effect, which can affect frequencies to a degree. If I remember my speaker experimentations, putting a cap in series with the tweeter killed of the lows while putting the cap in parallel killed off the highs. I was experimenting with crossovers then... Overly long cables can suck out the tone on a guitar - not sure about line levels or speaker level connections - but on instrument levels, capacitance, impedance and inductance will have a noticeable effect. That's why my guitar-wielding bandmates prefer to use wireless, especially when the cable will exceed 5-6 meters (bukod pa sa RFI/EMI).

[Tarkuz Toccata]

Agent So,

Never use a shielded mic or instrument cable to connect speakers. Alright -- any musician who's ever setup a sound system has used an instrument or mic cable to hook up speakers at least once in their life, with seemingly satisfactory results. But you shouldn't, and here's why: the braided shield uses more wire than the center conductors to get from point A to point B. This makes the capacitance higher on the minus side, creating a mismatch between the conductors and shield. In rare cases, this can cause the amplifier to go into high-frequency oscillation, damaging itself and the speaker. Also, the wire for the plus conductor is so thin that it heats up if you start pushing a lot of power. This dissipates a noticeable portion of what should be going to the speaker into thin air. Still tempted to use shielded mic or instrument cables for speakers? Don't push your luck...

[Blueberri]

I guess a good idea for picking the cable types/quality you're gonna need,specially pag tight budget, is to approach it on a per application basis...buy the best cables you can on connections that get thrown around a lot...and maybe cheaper ones on semi permanent connections. what i did sa studio was use better quality cables sa mga vocal mics and guitar cables. and just cheaper ones for the drum/amp mics, which are usually just left sitting there and are rarely moved or disconnected...syempre, pag live applications...well get the best that you can afford.

sayang, the september issue of RECORDING mag has a great article on cable stuff, how to pick and make them...pag sinipag ako maybe i'll try to post it...

[dantuts]

just noticed a while ago that my guitar sound different with my 2 instrument cables...

nobelle & klotz (neutrik plugs)

i was wondering why the sound coming out of my amp sounds bassy/muddy its seems there is no highs.. im sure its different from the sound i was getting before.. considering i didnt do anything to my guitar or amp settings..

then when i accidentally changed cables.. bumalik sa dating tunog. i can hear balanced high/lows ...

may naka experience na ba nito ? 

[xjepoyx]

just noticed a while ago that my guitar sound different with my 2 instrument cables...

nobelle & klotz (neutrik plugs)

i was wondering why the sound coming out of my amp sounds bassy/muddy its seems there is no highs.. im sure its different from the sound i was getting before.. considering i didnt do anything to my guitar or amp settings..

then when i accidentally changed cables.. bumalik sa dating tunog. i can hear balanced high/lows ...

may naka experience na ba nito ? 

bro refer to sir KitC's post.

Medyo rusty ang EE ko, pero I know that overly long cables can have a capacitive effect, which can affect frequencies to a degree.

check the length of the 2 diff cables of w/c is longer. the longer the cable the lower quality it may produce.

My Guitarist chito_eoi same member here still uses nobelle cable w/neutric plugs for 6 years w/ 0 maintainance and still dont get any problems using it.  We even have sets of the same cables for recording.

Im gonna try experimenting on what youve experiece, what is set of cables that you use that produces that crappy sound. Im headed to Audiophile Paco 2moro.

[dantuts]

5 m lang yung instrument cable ko which is i think the basic length.. i went through with the past post. walang masyadong subject regarding instrument cables..

[xjepoyx]

@ danuts

nobelle cable and the other one is klotz? ill try to get a klotz cable and try to compare both

[dantuts]

@ edgeofillusion-jepoy

hey ..thanks .. i was just surprised to hear the difference. 

[mikep]

I did an A/B with different cables just about a few weeks ago.  I used Klotz, Nobelle, ProEl, Planet Waves and Quantum cables.  Yes, there are differences.  I feel that Klotz and Planet Waves gave me the better frequency responses.  But surprisingly, the ProEl cables from Italy made in China, about PhP 500.00, came out with a very good result.  Although I never really did any measurements, I just relied on my hearing which I believe, is still pretty much "in there," above are my findings.  I posted this sort of informal experiment in the Guitar site previously.  So, YES, there are differences in cables (I never also believed in his matter previously, as I attended a "shoot out" in one AES convention where top notch engineers were made to identify speakers connected with the esoteric cables and one with a simple THHN/THWN cable, and they had a hard time indentifying which were the esoterics and ordinary wires.  Now, I am a believer).  BTW, the longest cable I used was 5 meters.

Also, another variable is the connectors.  That one I did not consider.

FWIW.

[dantuts]

@mikep ..

hey thanks for review.. actually its really a touchy subject when it comes to difference.. some people dont buy the idea of "i can hear it..."  when you attended the AES shoot out , did they rely on hearing ? or by numbers ? like this cable can do XXXkhz etc ..etc...

but i also notice that when i use my klotz cables.. pag natatapakan or medyo nahahampas sya sa kahit anong bagay.. nag kaka noise.. may static... pag sa nobelle hindi..

is it because of the plastic (coating or insulation ?)