Author Topic: CTA and BST (Read 5251 times)

nancy brew · « **on:** January 12, 2007, 08:22:40 PM »

ei.

Just wanna post dis and know there are also others who dig Blood, Sweat and Tears and Chcago Transit Authority. (Before it took the name Chicago).

Much respect to these bands who have merged jazz, funk, soul, blues and rock in their time. The musicians who have been involved in the said groups ay talagang malulufet. For BST, Michael Brecker, Bobby Colomby, Fred Lipsius, Lew Soloff, Mike Stern and many more. with CTA, the late Terry Kath, Dawayne Bailey (!!!),Peter Cetera (ngayon ko lng nalaman that he was singing the high parts while playing the bass) and a consistent line up that seems to get tighter by the day.

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #1 on:** January 13, 2007, 12:53:42 AM »

Chicago's first albums were very jazz oriented. This was way before Pete Cetera invented the corny ballad

The one track that got me interested in drums was a long drum solo by Danny Seraphine called "Rocketship to Mars" from Chicago III.

Or was that "Motorboat to Mars"... hmmm must check

Jaco D · « **Reply #2 on:** January 13, 2007, 02:35:23 AM »

Yeah, the thing I like about the early CTA/Chicago albums were their long-winded cuts running eight minutes or more. AOR (album-oriented radio) music at its finest. My personal favorite is still "Happy 'Cause I'm Going Home", both the studio and the Live at Carnegie Hall versions. A few bars into the song and you start smelling jutes

. Very simple melody - nice track for practicing improvisations and other creative stuff on the guitar, bass, flute, drums, etc. Another favorite is the tight skin-work on "Beginnings" that sha-shays into an extended percussion solo. Too bad that percussion solo often gets faded-out on radio. Somehow after Terry Kath accidentally blew his brains out, the CTA sound lost its bite and became a bit "middle of the road"-ish.

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #3 on:** January 13, 2007, 12:32:40 PM »

Ok, I checked, it was indeed "Motorboat to Mars" - a 1 minute drum solo track (seemed a lot longer back then, hmmm).

More info on Chicago III here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_III

vegetablejoe · « **Reply #4 on:** January 13, 2007, 01:53:07 PM »

Jerry Fischer was just as great on vocals for BS&T! That's the version of the band I got to watch at Araneta Coliseum many years ago... sigh. What fun. Can't recall though if it was already George Wadenius on guitar, but it was still the handsome Bobby Colomby on drums then... made all the girls around us swoon and scream!

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #5 on:** January 13, 2007, 02:10:10 PM »

I missed seeing BST live at Araneta ... but I do remember having front row seats to Chicago at the Folk Arts Theater! This was already the post-Cetera era in the 90's when they were reduced to a golden oldies band. Great show though, the 3-piece horn section is still intact as the most recent live DVDs will attest to.

nancy brew · « **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2007, 08:54:37 AM »

ei.

with CTA, nice to know u guys made it there, or almost.. (i was in diapers ata hehehe.. not!) . exactly sir Jim, and i think it worsened when seraphine left and Champlin took over , worked with Foster, and in my opinion, they tried to tread the TOTO territory in the 80s (the drum sounds, well very 80s) which lost the bite. But still, its 'Does Anybody Know..', 'Beginnings' and 'Dialogues 1 and 2' for me.

My BST album would be the 2nd (the band doing covers from Traffic to God Bless the Child) with Clayton Thomas, and Nuclear Blues.

+ 1000 sa Motorboat to Mars

BTW isn't Radioactive Sago's 'Astro' from CTAs 'Mongonucleosis'?

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #7 on:** January 15, 2007, 08:57:55 AM »

Quote from: nancy brew on January 15, 2007, 08:54:37 AM

BTW isn't Radioactive Sago's 'Astro' from CTAs 'Mongonucleosis'?

There's a similarity, but Mongonucleosis was itself a tribute to Mongo Santamaria and that whole latin vibe. I think RASP was tuned to the same wavelength, that's all.

nancy brew · « **Reply #8 on:** January 15, 2007, 09:00:50 AM »

Ei sir.

Up, same wavelength nga and much2x respect to RASP. Lupit din

frogfunk · « **Reply #9 on:** January 15, 2007, 09:11:45 AM »

Chicago has been swimming in my brain for a long time now. I don't understand why people I talked to (especially them old LP records people) made a fuss about how different they were (at times with another adjective, TOTALLY) way back before Peter Cetera sang for them. Any comprehensive album that you guys would suggest I listen to? By the way, some people I talked to even labeled them as prog rock.

Boddhisattva · « **Reply #10 on:** January 15, 2007, 11:53:59 AM »

Loved Chicago's double-album set which included jazz and classical-sounding tidbits. I think it was downhill for them after If You Leave Me Now..

nancy brew · « **Reply #11 on:** January 15, 2007, 01:48:57 PM »

ei.

It's stated at their website that the reason they stopped doing lengthy works and double albums was also due to the changing radio format and the increasing prices involved in producing LPs.

May be true, may be not.

Na iirita na ako ke Champlin twing kakanta, kahit walang baluktot ung kanta lalagyan unecessarily, tapos iipitin ung boses to show na mataas ung range nya (?). Kahit alternate nila ung EWF sa DVD ay panay ang birit ng lolo.

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #12 on:** January 15, 2007, 07:46:10 PM »

Quote from: frogfunk on January 15, 2007, 09:11:45 AM

Chicago has been swimming in my brain for a long time now. I don't understand why people I talked to (especially them old LP records people) made a fuss about how different they were (at times with another adjective, TOTALLY) way back before Peter Cetera sang for them. Any comprehensive album that you guys would suggest I listen to? By the way, some people I talked to even labeled them as prog rock.

The albums to get are probably the first 5 or 7 albums. Chicago Transit Authority (first album) and Chicago II,III, IV, V, VI, VII. Peter Cetera was a vocalist as far back as the first album (incidentally the only time they were CTA, they were Chicago after that) on the song "Question 67 or 68", its just that he didn't sing as much as guitarist Terry Kath (who had a mean bluesy vocal growl and complex guitar lines with plenty of wah wah pedal thrown in) and keyboardist Robert Lamm. Unfortunately Cetera discovered he could write cheesy hit ballads ("If you leave me now" is the prime offender and their biggest #1 single), after which all thoughts of Chicago as a progressive jazz-rock ensemble flew out the window. Strangely enough Cetera was a very good bassist.

The first album (recorded in 1969!) still stands out as one of their best. Funk, jazz, rock, soul, classical, pop fusion and it doesn't sound dated today.

But in their prime I think Chicago was probably better than Tower of Power and Blood Sweat and Tears. The horn parts (arranged by trombonist James Pankow) were fantastic and you can't remember a Chicago classic without singing the horn parts. Not bad for just 3 guys (trumpet, trombone, sax) who are still part of the band today.

I must give props to Mr. Nancy Brew for recommending the "Live at Carnegie Hall" album (aka Chicago IV, a 4-LP set when it was released sometime 1971). I had never heard it before until a couple of days ago when I discovered it over the Net. It is seriously bad ass and all those long jams are as good now as they were in the early 70's. I would recommend playing this to anyone who thinks Chicago was just that cheesy over produced ballad band produced by David Foster in the 80's.

frogfunk · « **Reply #13 on:** January 15, 2007, 07:58:11 PM »

Wow! Nasty!

Anyway, it's like my cutoff on Metallica albums: I recommend the Cliff Burton era albums above all else. But for Chicago, wow! Seven albums before they turned to one hunk of cheese! Now that's alot!

I think I'm gonna call my music supplier now...

Thanks, Sir Jim!

3650guy · « **Reply #14 on:** January 15, 2007, 11:46:17 PM »

...uhmmm also if i could interest you into this thread i start....

http://talk.philmusic.com/board/index.php?topic=19003.0

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #15 on:** January 15, 2007, 11:52:48 PM »

Quote from: 3650guy on January 15, 2007, 11:46:17 PM

...uhmmm also if i could interest you into this thread i start....

http://talk.philmusic.com/board/index.php?topic=19003.0

O nga no! I guess it's... "A Hard Habit To Break"... hehehe

Chicago as a bunch of hippies, circa "Live at Carnegie Hall". Spot Peter Cetera if you dare:

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #16 on:** January 16, 2007, 12:01:18 AM »

Quote from: frogfunk on January 15, 2007, 07:58:11 PM

Anyway, it's like my cutoff on Metallica albums: I recommend the Cliff Burton era albums above all else. But for Chicago, wow! Seven albums before they turned to one hunk of cheese! Now that's alot!

Well maybe as a starter... the first album. That was originally released as a double LP in April 1969. I hear the last digital remaster by Rhino records sounds pretty good.

Jaco D · « **Reply #17 on:** January 16, 2007, 12:32:09 AM »

I bought the re-mastered CTA (album 1) Rhino-reissue sometime last year to replace the vinyl one that somehow got misplaced back home. This album alone has progressive rock written all over it. "Free Form Guitar" would feel pretty much at home with Ornette Coleman's Song X. You could also see how the record companies tried to make the band's cuts more masa-friendly by cutting out the long intro and ending of "Does Anyone Know What Time It Is" and "Beginnings", respectively. This brings back fond memories of the old RJ-AM when they would play those long Chicago tracks from end-to-end during the wee hours of the evening/morning.

frogfunk · « **Reply #18 on:** January 16, 2007, 07:32:13 AM »

Quote from: Jim Ayson on January 15, 2007, 11:52:48 PM

Quote from: 3650guy on January 15, 2007, 11:46:17 PM
...uhmmm also if i could interest you into this thread i start....

http://talk.philmusic.com/board/index.php?topic=19003.0

O nga no! I guess it's... "A Hard Habit To Break"... hehehe

Chicago as a bunch of hippies, circa "Live at Carnegie Hall". Spot Peter Cetera if you dare:

I think he's the fifth guy from the left when you're facing the pic. E-hehehehe!

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #19 on:** January 16, 2007, 08:26:54 AM »

I just listened to Chicago VII for the first time after many many years - and was blown away! Originally this was a double LP, since combined in one CD. The first half of the double album is all jazz instrumentals, and for its era (1974) they are pretty adventurous, fusing big band horn sounds and bebop with some weather report like electronic experimentation. Plenty of solos. These tracks are on par or better than some of the recordings from jazz/fusion artists of the time. Too bad they never went down this road again.

Of course balancing this, the second side has their pop hits like "Happy Man", "Wishing You Were Here", and "Call on Me" which foresees the rise of the creepy Peter Cetera ballad era of the 80's.

But Terry Kath's "Byblos" is a masterpiece, composition-wise.

nancy brew · « **Reply #20 on:** January 16, 2007, 09:23:05 AM »

ei.

up! just checked it : extensive info uv got there sir3650 + 1000! haven't dropped by that thread kasi

eniwei, mga sir, is it at Chicago Live at Carnegie is with the last track LIBERATION? Puts the 'Psyche' in psychdelic!! Way ahead of time, no offense sa mga space guitar fans there, but Terry Kath was pulling every imaginable sound with early equipment at that time!

Even Jimi really dug CTA and the "guitar player who was better than me (Hendrix)" and had plans to coem up something with the group, months before he died. Too bad.

Medyo mabilis yung tempo ng songs nila dun sa live album, must be Speed, man.. hehehehe...

Boddhisattva · « **Reply #21 on:** January 16, 2007, 03:33:45 PM »

Chicago even had one TV special capped with an open air concert. It ran a lot of times either on Channel 4 or 9. I remember it very well-they all wear long hair and psychedelic clothes and part of the live songs they did was West Virginia Fantasies

nancy brew · « **Reply #22 on:** January 16, 2007, 04:03:13 PM »

ei.

Sir Bod was that the one where Cetera sang Call on Me?

3650guy · « **Reply #23 on:** January 16, 2007, 04:41:44 PM »

for sure Cetera sang and played "if you leave me now" on a 12string acoustic guitar and did the solo also. meron din string section ata.

for me after "If you leave me now" is the cutoff point wherein somehow the group shifted into something else.

although they did a Big Band cd with some good reworkings of jazz standards.

Tris Imboden on the drums helped to reinfuse the group into the from the 90's to the present.

Jim Ayson · « **Reply #24 on:** January 17, 2007, 08:50:10 AM »

Quote from: nancy brew on January 16, 2007, 09:23:05 AM

eniwei, mga sir, is it at Chicago Live at Carnegie is with the last track LIBERATION? Puts the 'Psyche' in psychdelic!! Way ahead of time, no offense sa mga space guitar fans there, but Terry Kath was pulling every imaginable sound with early equipment at that time!

Liberation is from the first album... couldn't find it in Chicago IV... unless you have the Rhino release with the extra disc.

News:

Author Topic: CTA and BST (Read 5251 times)